Two-faced mother

[Outofnappies]

I live abroad with DH and 2 young DC and have a very good relationship with my parents most of the time, in particular when they are with us or vice versa and my single, rather bitter sister is not around. I have an unmarried brother too but he is kind, laid back and in a serious relationship so basically a nice chap. My parents have just been out to stay a week with us and we all had a genuinely wonderful time, especially the DC who really loved the time and attention from their grandparents. Mum wrote an effusive email afterwards to us, thanking us and saying how lovely the DC were.

Now the tricky part. I know my parents' email password as saw Dad typing it in. I just logged on out of curiosity on I know my mum and my sister are toxic witches when they get together and I just had an inkling of something. Eavesdroppers certainly hear no good of themselves! Now I have read an email not meant for me, sent to my brother and sister by my mother, in which she says of their stay with us, "DC were mostly good, but DH winds them up and they are v noisy and Nappies does her best but it is difficult". I imagine she has said the same to my sister in person as they see her so often.

This is not the first criticism of my DC or parenting, but I feel so angry that it is being said behind my back, whilst to me Mum is gushing. Is it to make my siblings feel better that I am not little miss perfect (never claimed to be, just a thought)?? I find it disloyal.

And now I can't react as I am not supposed to have seen the email!! Am I over-reacting anyway?!

WWYD??

Hmmmmmm you know you are going to get TOASTED on here for nosing?

In all honesty, it sounds pretty tame. I think most of us would modify our language hugely if we knew the person spoken about would see/hear what we said.

I think you need to erase the memory of the password and move on. I might be tempted to work round to a convo about your DH with your mother. The problem she has seems to be with him.

A decent mum wouldn't slag you off, however mildly to your siblings

My mum does it...my H's nice supportive parents don't.

I think you were very lucky if that's the worse the email said. It's barely a criticism. In an ideal world no one would ever write aor say anything about someone else that they wouldn't say directly to them, but you've hardly shown yourself in a good light by calling your mum and sister 'toxic witches'.

I would tell her that you know, to be honest. I would call her on it and ask her why she thinks that is acceptable. And why she is being so two-faced.

She used your computer - she doesn't have to know how you found it. And so what if you were snooping?

I can't stand behaviour like this, and if I thought it was my own mother I would be horrified.

Yes I know.... it's fair cop. I felt better not knowing this email existed!! Am not tempted to check in again. However, the problem is between me and my sister/mother combo. Issues go back a long way, Mum admits my sis is jealous but still massively overcompensates by being very judgey about me and my family to her. I know this because of things that my sister refers to that I know I haven't told her about, or not with the words she uses. I WISH Mum would say nice things about us, I would like her approval. I never feel I have it.

Accepting I don't nose again (learnt my lesson there), can we move the thread to constructive ways to a) impress my mother and b) get my sister on side?! Thanks....

Does your sister know you think she is bitter? Would you call them toxic witches to their faces? In which case you are doing the same thing. Everyone has private opinions of other people even ones they love and like. Just try and move on I would say? As for trying to impress your mum and get sister on side .., why?

Your mums comments are very mild- if there was a tally of underhand behaviour, logging into another's email is far worse than saying 'thank you I had a lovely visit/ blimey nappies kids are noisy and her husband winds them up.
Going forward, I would say don't confront your mum, you don't have the moral high ground, and don't worry so much about what she thinks. Remember: other peoples opinion of you is none of your business. You know you're a good mother. It doesn't matter what she thinks. (she thinks you're a good mum- the email was nice about you!)

Thank you for your replies.

Yes my sister does know that I think she is bitter, she prefers to call herself "unlucky"... we fell out over the summer after she gatecrashed our holiday to the seaside with my parents (chance for the DC to see their GPs) on the pretext of seeing us all, yet spent the whole time being miserable, snapping at the DC and trying to take mum off to do things on their own (coffee-drinking and walking).... and I complained to her direct about it. A whole back story there as you see !!

And yes I have spoken to my mother on several occasions, being honest that I felt completely left out when my sis was around and thought the relationship she had with her was toxic for both of them. Did use those words. Mum thinks I over analyse everything and am too wordy!! Latest conversation was during their visit when she got upset at one point, yes teary, that her 2 daughters were not talking to each other. So I am now in touch with my sister, but thro email and not much emotion... I asked Mum if she would have the same conversation as she had with me with my sister but she didn't answer and I know she won't. She doesn't dare tackle my sister for fear of being frozen out.

You are right Pumpster. It is probably something I should get over. DH thinks I should manage the relationship with my sister on my terms, and try to time visits back to my parents when she is not there. Xmas we can all be civil!

Sounds like your parents have run around your sister all her life and infantalised her, they have also made her the way she is. Enabling and pandering to her in the ways they have done and continue to do has made her far worse. The dynamics in your birth family unit from childhood were skewed maybe because they did not see her as somehow "capable enough" unlike you who was perhaps trusted i.e left to get on with it.

Yes sounds like your mum's relationship with your sister relies on your sister feeling that she and your mum are a team against the rest of the world, including siblings. It's so sad that your mum has gone along with it to keep the peace - unless she too gets something out of it.

I like the idea of saying the email account was not properly logged out on your computer. Then you might be able to have a proper conversation about it.

Thank you... yes definitely the case that my mum she has to do me down (but not to my face) to perk up my sister. Perhaps I can get past that by being extra sparkly and perfect at Xmas when we are next all together...

I can even understand and convince myself to get past my sister "winning" my mum's attention/approval over me, but it upsets both DH and me that she also comes between my DC and my mum! We live abroad and see my parents 3 times a year. She lives down the road from them. She is extremely demanding. She is 31 and my DC are 4 and 2.... you get the picture I am sure.

Yes it's pretty tame, yes you shouldn't have snooped but I would be pissed off too and would probably say something along the lines of "I saw the email you sent to dsis, say those things to me as well if you're going to say them at all, don't do me down behind my back just to put a smile on her face, ok". Then leave it at that.

I wouldn´t want to see her again tbh.

And if she thinks so little of OP, her husband & the children-it wouldn´t bother her, would it?

That's nothing, I often talk frankly about my siblings to my mum, not in a nasty way more in a 'why do they do that?' type of way that I wouldn't say to their face, I'm just exploring the whole dynamic. She didn't say anything nasty about you, and the fact is small children are quite lively and can be a bit much, she may need to let off steam about that even if she had a lovely time with them.

YOu are so in the wrong for snooping, what were you expecting to find?

And, I do think it's fine for family members to speak frankly to each other about different issues and situations in the other member's lives. It's natural and normal and that's why snooping and eavesdropping never does any good.

And- diddl- I don't get that from the mail at all,she didn't say anything nasty about the husband except 'he winds them up' and it's difficult for mum to cope sometimes.

What's the betting there's some truth in this? There's also the truth that they had a lovely time and thoroughly enjoyed themselves. It's not two-faced, there is not always one 'truth' about our experiences in life, I might have a great time with a friend on a night out but later speak with my husband about a concern about them, this isn't two-faced, it's trying to make sense of our world which is a bit more complex than 'Nappies' = nice and no one is ever allowed to comment negatively ever.

I do see what you mean mumsy and you sound very wise but I am under no illusions about our complex world and families....! Criticisms would be fine, I have said as much to Mum, I can take them, but it is the behind the back bit that gets me.

I snooped, I shouldn't even know about it, fair enough, but why does she have to be that way about me to my sister? Why can'T she stop at something nice?! I shouldn't have snooped but would have been quietly chuffed to bits to find a genuinely 100% kind comment about their stay with us without a barred "but...." on the end. She also said our pillows were lumpy. To my sister! I mean, WTF?!?! She NEVER says anything remotely nasty (to me) about my sister. Protects and stands up for her even if conversation gets jokingly round to how spoiled she is. And she does love my DH - thinks I got very lucky there... which I did of course! Anyway... onwards and upwards. Too much navel gazing is not good!!

Well the way it reads to me is that she says things about OP & her family to make them bad/not good in order to make her other daughter feel good/better about herself.

If that´s it, it´s just so fucked up I just don´t get it.

I honestly can't see the criticism, really I can't.

People with a mutual interest in someone's wellbeing discuss them sometimes, don't they?

Agree diddl.

Just seen that the email was also sent to OPs brother.

I don´t get it tbh.

Why would you criticise one sibling´s family to another?

Well, if I´m reading it all wrong, then of course I apologise, OP.

My sil is working way, way too hard and her dh doesn't seem to appreciate this. The rest of the family have noticed it, I know this because we've talked about it together.

My mil's partner is being a bit of an arse; we have discussed this as we were a bit worried. We're coming up with a plan to help her out (she doesn't need to escape, just needs a way to be a little less dependent on him).

Are we being two-faced?

Are you saying the same things to the people concerned & are you worried about them?

Are you bitching for the sake of it?

If I criticised my daughter to my son, he would be devastated for her-& it would probably colour his view of me, also.

If it's going to help, then yes someone will say something. But sometimes you don't know if that's the right thing to do unless you've discussed it with others.

With sil; I might just have seen her on an off day. It's not until mentioning it to her sisters that that we appreciated that every day seemed to be like that.

I took the OP's mother's comments as expressing concern; not criticism.

Yes diddl that's it in a nutshell (your 3rd last post!)
ref your 2nd last post - sending email to brother and sister together, yes my DP went to stay with brother and his GF before coming out to us so it was a thank you email to them including comments about their stay with us. He never rises to the bait (we both know how mum is) but my sister - well that's a completely different kettle of fish - why she was even included in an email to my brother to thank him for having them to stay, I will never know but there it is...
And JenaiMarrwell it sounds like you are being supportive and constructive in your family; whereas my mother is doing me down behind my back to make my sister feel better about her own rather empty self-absorbed life.

I'm glad I've only got the one child; I'd be crap with this stuff

That's odd though, cc'ing your sister into the email.

Odd indeed!! It's like my mum and my sister are joined at the hip. I don't know for sure but could check now I know their password but I am willing to bet that mum forwards my emails to my sister too. Things my sister knows that I know I didn't mention to her. Families eh?!

My DH's family for the record is lovely...!