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Relationships

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About divorce

20 replies

divorcemealready · 02/09/2012 17:44

Need some perspective please - genuinely not sure if I am being unreasonable (or even unlawful!)

(Have name changed as details will out me)

-- argh! is VERY long - sorry!

Background: Husband cheated on me throughout our relationship - I always forgave/ forgot as I thought that being with him was better than not. Got to the point where we were about to move away and start a family (a sign, I thought, that he would be faithful). Plans were put on hold for about a year due to my job. Then Husband started asking again about trying for a baby (Autumn 2010) which we did for a few months - unsuccessfully (thank goodness!). During this time I realised that I did not want to be with him, the thought of having a baby to tie us together forever terrified me and I realised I had to leave.

As far as I knew, he hadn't cheated on me within the last 1 - 2 years. Don't ask me why, but I felt a huge amount of guilt leaving him. To the outside world he was absolutely in love with me and would have done anything for me. He always spoke about our future, where we'd live, how many children, etc. I told him it was over, he moved out. We spoke on phone civilly - but only to sort out money, etc. I packed up his things, he came to collect them when I was out - he asked which TV he could take, I told him he could take anything he wanted. (He took £1,000 50inch tv that had been paid for on my credit card, his clothes, a few DVD and nothing else).

I couldn't afford to live in (rented) house so I moved. Most of furniture got dumped - old, argos stuff, falling apart, wouldn't fit in new place. I took a couple of small TVs, bed, TV stand.

Stayed civil for a month or so - last message I had from him was asking what had happened to furniture and could he have one of the TVs for his son (previous relationship). I told him what I'd taken and dumped and said he could have TV if he came to get it (I had no car). This was the last I heard from him because... I snooped on his Facebook and read a message on his wall telling a friend about his 'baby number 2' (this was about 1 month after we split). I text to ask him WTF? no reply. I phones - he wouldn't pick up. I emailed - no reply. I gave up!

At this time our car lease was up. He mainly drove the car (every day to work) but it was in my name. Sent car back and I ended up with £2,700 charges (way over mileage allowance, new tyres needed, etc)

I subsequently had it confirmed that he had had another child - didnt know any details but the dates well and truely overlapped the time we were together.

I left it - I couldn't contact him. He did not contact me.


When we had planned to move away (you still with me???!!!) we bought a house - run down - everything needed doing to it. I say 'we', actually - I got the mortgage, my grandma paid the deposit and my parents put in all the renovation money. We hoped to live in it for a few years and then sell up so that everyone could make a bit of money out of it.

Obviously, we didn't move in. I was left with a lovely home 300 miles from my work. Tried to sell - no luck for 6 months. Couldn't afford the mortgage and my own rent so the property was let out.


So, 12 month after we split I contacted husband to ask for his address for divorce(winter 2011). I expected him to either ignore me, or just give me address and leave it up to me. No such luck - his reply was that he would agree to divorce me when I gave him the money he was owed from the house sale. Apparently he had sent his dad round to 'our' house to get some of his property - this was 7 months after we had split and 6 months since he'd last spoken to me (summer 2011). He expected his dad to let himself in with his set of keys - I'd changed the locks months ago. His dad was met my new tenants and assumed we'd sold the house (I had no idea this had happened, tenants didn't tell me - I feel bad they had this happen to them).

So I told him that I hadn't sold the house and that, yes, I'd tried to but couldn't sell it and the only offer I'd had would have given no profit at all, and the offer had fallen through anyway (all true - we bought the house just before the recession). He rightly reminded me that he had bought all white goods for the kitchen and his dad had bought us a £1,000 fridge, and what was I going to do about it? - i.e. he wanted them or the money back.

So: (I think I'm getting to the end!)
It's coming up to 2 years seperation and I plan to divorce him on those grounds. Do I owe him anything?
In my mind - he had an affair/ one night stand (who knows?) and had a child while married to me. I feel that he should just walk away - yes he spent a few thousand on a washing machine, dish washer, etc. But he also took the £1,000 TV and left me with £2,700 to pay on the car. What's more - at no point had he contacted me to get his things back. The house was on the market for 6 months - he could have had it back then. It was over a year later that he was asking for it, and only because I'd contacted him. He'd thought that I'd sold it and made a profit which he was entitled to but still didn't contact me. I told him all of this - he gave no response, said he was going away for a few weeks. I asked him to get back to me when he got back and either give me his address or an address I could use for correspondance if he didn't want me to have his address.

That was last winter 2012 - heard nothing since.

I know his works address, so plan to serve divorce papers there. Should I offer to pay him for kitchen appliances in my rented property? Will I owe him half of the profits when I do sell the house in the future (if market improves and there is any profit)? Could he put in a claim for this when I divorce?

OP posts:
divorcemealready · 02/09/2012 17:49

Damn it - I first contacted him about divorce Winter 2012 - thought the dates might make it easier to follow, but I've probably made it more confusing!

OP posts:
ErikNorseman · 02/09/2012 17:53

Naaah
Let him take you to court if he wants to pay for it. Worst case scenario I guess you will have to give him a few £100s but it will cost him more to sue you for it.

BurlingtonBertieFromBow · 02/09/2012 17:56

Well you can serve him with divorce papers as you say. Two years separation is only with both parties' consent, so technically he could make you wait 5 years. If said he was going to do this you could divorce him for unreasonable behaviour or adultery, but you might need proof for that.

The solicitors will negotiate on financial settlement or the judge will just decide if you can't agree. You might have to give him some money from the house as it is a joint asset, even though he put no money into it

BurlingtonBertieFromBow · 02/09/2012 17:57

Erik, I think he wouldn't have to sue her, it would be decided in the financial settlement upon divorce, and as costs come out of the joint pot he might well try to get money.

WhereYouLeftIt · 02/09/2012 18:19

Serve divorce papers to his works address.

Tell him he owes you £2,700 for the car.

CouthyMowWearingOrange · 02/09/2012 18:23

Wouldn't the proof be that he had a child with someone else while they were still married?!

Even if he claims they had already separated at that point (a lie, but one that he is likely to use), they are still married, so she can still file on the grounds of adultery.

juneau · 02/09/2012 18:30

Go and see a solicitor and let him/her sort out the financial settlement when you get divorced. You'll be able to detail everything in the relationship that you/your family paid for and everything he/his family paid for and a suitable settlement will be decided based on that. He'll probably end up owing you money from what you've written above.

juneau · 02/09/2012 18:30

P.S. Don't pay him a penny. Let the lawyers do the work for you.

Balderdashandpiffle · 02/09/2012 18:31

Finances aren't anything to do with morals.

You need proper legal advice. Unless a consent order is drawn up the finances aren't sorted.

Kabooooom · 02/09/2012 18:33

Tell him to take it out of the £2700 he owes you for the car, see what the cuntbadger has to say about that!

ToothbrushThief · 02/09/2012 18:34

This might be better in legal?

My concern would be that marital assets are divided 50/50. (Even if in your name ???)

The fact that he took a couple of TVs and you chucked furniture... paid off his car debts will need to be proven to be offset against any claim of his.

I really think a solicitor needs to advise you

WhatYouLookingAt · 02/09/2012 18:35

If he's had two children, she has proof enough of adultery!

Don't give him anything. He owes you for the tv, for the car, for probably plenty more.

MigratingCoconuts · 02/09/2012 18:40

get yourself a shit hot divorce solicitor and do not pay him a penny until you have sought advise.

If he is suggesting that he will agree to allow the divorce only when you have paid what he thinks he is owed, then he is talking out of his arse..and from past behaviour, cannot be trusted!!

ToothbrushThief · 02/09/2012 18:48

I really would put this into legal...

The morals/rights and wrongs/ betrayals/babies... none of that overrides a consent order agreeing financial split.

pjmama · 02/09/2012 18:51

Congratulations on getting rid of this piece of shit btw.

MigratingCoconuts · 02/09/2012 18:52

I've reported the thread to get it moved to relationships or legal. Both places have tonnesn of experrience with divorce issues!

BurlingtonBertieFromBow · 02/09/2012 19:23

Yes but would have to prove it's his etc. Not really a problem, just an added complication. Hopefully he won't contest. You need a solicitor. You may well be looking at a 50/50 split of all assets, unfortunately.

RowanMumsnet · 02/09/2012 19:50

Hello

We've had a few suggestions to move this to Relationships and I see a few posters on here thought a move to Legal would be good. I've put it in Relationships in the hope that good legal advice will be forthcoming there too.

Best of luck to the OP.

ToothbrushThief · 02/09/2012 20:25

To get your divorce you will almost certainly need to agree a financial agreement called a consent order.

Divorce procedure is loosely and superficially as follows:

Petition
One of you petitions the other for a divorce (using grounds described in law)

Divorce Nisi
This basically means grounds for divorce have been accepted (I'm sure a solicitor will be more exact than this!) There is a 6 week 'cooling off??' period between this and the absolute. The absolute can be applied for after 6 weeks. A partner can block it if the next stage has not been agreed

Financial and Arrangements for children (if applicable)
A judge oversees the agreement for a financial separation (or children). This can be the longest part and stall many divorces

Absolute
You are a free person :) Wine

Apologies to the legal people - this is an eejits guide from an eejit

olgaga · 02/09/2012 21:30

Don't offer him anything. Just apply for the divorce and wait to hear from him. If he wants money from you tell him he either wants a divorce or doesn't, and he'll have to pay for a solicitor which will cost him far more than he will ever get out of your joint assets.

You will probably be able to deal with this yourself, but you may need a solicitor at some point. Here's some information, much of it won't apply to you but you'll find a lot of the links are useful.

Relationship Breakdown and Divorce ? Advice and Links

General

Read everything you can get your hands on. Get familiar with the language of family law and procedure and try to get an understanding of your rights BEFORE you see a solicitor. Get word of mouth recommendations for family lawyers in your area if possible. If you have children at school, ask mums you are friendly with if they know of anyone who can make a recommendation in your area. These days there are few people who don?t know of anyone who has been through a divorce or separation ? there?s a lot of knowledge and support out there!

If there are children involved, their interests will always come first. It is the children?s right to maintain a meaningful relationship with the non-resident parent (NRP) ? not the other way around. Children are not possessions to be ?fairly? divided between separating parents. Parents have no rights, only responsibilities. A divorce will not be granted where children are involved unless there are agreed arrangements for finance, and care of the children (?Statement of Arrangements for Children?). It is obviously quicker and cheaper if this can be agreed but if there is no agreement, the Court will make an Order (?Residence and Contact? regarding children, ?Financial Order? or ?Ancillary Relief? in the case of Finance)

Many family lawyers will offer the first half hour consultation free. Make use of this. Don?t just stick with the first lawyer you find ? shop around and find someone you feel comfortable with. You may be in for a long haul, so it helps if you can find a solicitor you?re happy with.

If you can?t find any local recommendations, always see a solicitor who specialises in Family Law. You can search by area here:

www.resolution.org.uk/

You can also find family law solicitors here:

www.lawsociety.org.uk/areasoflaw/view=areasoflawdetails.law?AREAOFLAW=Family%20law&AREAOFLAWID=36

Check your eligibility for Legal Aid here:

legalaidcalculator.justice.gov.uk/calculators/eligiCalc?execution=e1s1

Some family law solicitors publish online feedback from clients ? Google solicitors to see if any recommendations or feedback exists.

Mediation

You will be encouraged to attend mediation. If there has been violence or emotional abuse, discuss this with your solicitor first. Always get legal advice, or at the very least make sure you are aware of your legal rights, before you begin mediation.

www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/Divorceseparationandrelationshipbreakdown/Endingamarriageorcivilpartnership/Planningadivorce/DG_194401

Married or Living Together?

This is a key question. If you are married, generally speaking you have greater protection when a relationship breaks down.

Legal Issues around marriage/cohabitation and relationship breakdown are explained here:

www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/relationships_e/relationships_living_together_marriage_and_civil_partnership_e/living_together_and_marriage_legal_differences.htm#Ending_a_relationship

static.advicenow.org.uk/files/benefits-and-livingtogether-2010-11-1161.pdf

DirectGov advice on divorce, separation and relationship breakdown:
www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/Divorceseparationandrelationshipbreakdown/index.htm

Legal Rights are further explained here:

www.rightsofwomen.org.uk/legal.php#children_relationship_breakdown

I found these guides from law firms quite informative and easy to read ? there are others of course:

www.family-lawfirm.co.uk/uploaded/documents/Surviving-Family-Conflict-and-Divorce---2nd-edition.pdf

www.terry.co.uk/hindex.html

Finance

Before you see a family law solicitor, get hold of every single piece of financial information you can, and take copies. Wage slips, P60s, tax returns, employment contracts, pensions and other statements ? savings, current account and mortgages, deeds, rental leases, utility bills, council tax bills, credit statements. Are there joint assets such as a home, pensions, savings, shares?

Handy tax credits calculator:

taxcredits.hmrc.gov.uk/Qualify/DIQHousehold.aspx

Handy 5 Minute benefit check, tax and housing benefit calculators:

www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/

Child Maintenance Calculator:

taxcredits.hmrc.gov.uk/Qualify/DIQHousehold.aspx

Further advice and support

www.maypole.org.uk/

www.womensaid.org.uk/

www.gingerbread.org.uk/

england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/families_and_relationships
(Re Shelter, if you are not in England follow the link at the top)

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