do people really change?

[KittenCamile]

Hi,

I would love some advice and some of your sage wisdom please. This could end up long sorry!

I have been with DP for nearly 2yrs and have found some (what I think is) quite shocking stuff out about him in the last month. We had been ttc but I have put that on hold while I sort my head out and we talk through this stuff. Thing is most of it happend when we were not together so I would love to know if I should just forget it or be a little more cautious.

So... DP and I didn't get together in the best circumstances, both of us were married and had been friends for years, we did not have an affair, we went out one night for a drink, it seemed very obvious that we liked each other and without talking about it we both left our partners the next day. I hadn't been happy with my husband for quite a while and when I left it wasn't a shock to him, we are still good friends (what we were all along really).

Stupidly DP and I got together about a month after this, not good I know but it happend. So I found out a few weeks ago that DP slept with his EXW during the first month of us being together, I was upset more that he didn't tell me rather than it happened.

Since then I have found out that he cheated on a long term GF many years ago with his EXW, his GF had told him she was thinking of leaving him for someone else but wasn't sure so he had a 3 week 'affair' with EXW. He got back with GF after.

Once that relationship ended he started seeing someone who lived 300 miles away, after a year EXW got back in contact and they had a 5 week affair before he left and finally started a proper relationship with EXW, got married and had a DD. That lasted 5 years until he left her and we got together.

Keeping up?!!

So last night I was clearing out the computer and looked at an old web browser, I found that when he was with EXW he had been looking at adult 'friend' websites (I know it was when they were together becuase our computer will show the dates and amount of time a site was visited)

I asked him about it and he said yes, he was a pathetic lonely man who married his friend because he thought he should and he was looking for a way out. He said he never met anyone off the sites (I believe that as he only visited a couple of times from what the computer said).

I told him that all this makes him seem like a sad, seedy selfish man and why would I want a baby with someone like that.

So what do I do? Most of it happened before he met me, he says that people are different in different relationships and when your with someone you do gradually change together, that in me he has found a friend and a lover and couldn't see himself doing anything like that again as he feels like a different man now. He isn't what his past is and that its the future that matters

Do I believe him? I want to and when I look at him I do but this seems like a lot to me or am I just being stupid? I read about so many women on here going through what he did to a lot of different people. He is a great dad, we would have a lovely family and I do still love him.

Thank you so much for reading this far!

So, he's a serial cheater who believes in keeping a bird in the hand - and one in the bush in case he needs a diversion from the one in his hand or vice versa.

You say he's a 'good dad'. Does he just have the one dc and does he have regular contact with her? Do you have dc?

Given his form, if you choose him as a sperm donor the father of your dc I would suggest you be prepared to become a single parent.

After he's gone off with a new bird, I further suggest you pas on being his wanksock while he makes his mind up which one he'll chose to share his new nest.

As for telling you that 'in you he's found a friend and lover' blah de blah, I suspect he's not telling you anything he hasn't told all the ow who've become romantically involved him.

In short, he's a man who has a low boredom threshold when it comes to long-term relationships and, even if you turned yourself into a non-stop all-singing all-dancing entertainment centre for his benefit, it's probable he'll tire of you in the next year or so.

"I told him that all this makes him seem like a sad, seedy selfish man and why would I want a baby with someone like that."

Tricky. On the one hand you could say that this new-found behaviour is fundamental to his personality and that you can't trust him. On the other, you could be flattered that he has given up his philandering now that he's got together with you and shouldn't judge a man on past sins. In 2 years has he given you any reason to suspect he's unfaithful?

Ha ha izzyizin you don't hold back do you! :)

I have no DC's and DP dd is with us 40% of the time, he pays matinance and genuinly is a good dad to her.

I know, seeing it all writen down it looks shit doesn't it? I don't want to be nieve and think that I can 'change' him. He has done nothing wrong in the last 18 months but I'm not sure that's enough given his history.

God I wish I didn't actually love him like I do, it clouds all of my judgment

Sorry, missed the bit about sleeping with his ex-W early days .... that suggests less of a Road to Damascus conversion to monogamy moment and more same-old, same-old. Sorry.

No CogitoErgoSometimes he has done nothing to make me not trust him, sleeping with his EXW in our first month together wasn't good but on it own and concidering how quickly everything moved I can forgive that.

Bottom line is that all relationships are a calculated risk. If you take the information you've got and square it with the direct experience of two years together and decide you're OK with that level of risk, then take it forward. But, now that the honeymoon period is over, maybe give yourself time to properly get to know this man before introducing children

The condoms are firmly inplace CogitoErgoSometimes! I'm 28 so I have time. Its weird that in the space of four weeks you can go from planning house and DC's to thinking 'do I know this man?'

You are so right about the risks, there are no garentees in amy relationship but it seems my odds for faliure are a little higher than they were. He keep saying how can he prove that he has changed but I don't know how he can.

We do seem to have a very different relationship to what he had with his EXW, she has admitted it wasn't great either.

Oh I just don't know!!

I only tell it how I see it, honey, and in his case there seems to be a pattern which is that when the going gets tough, or it's not to his liking, he gets going with an ow.

Seeing him for what he most probably is may enable you to withdraw some of the emotional investment you've made in him and save it elsewhere for a rainy day that I hope won't come to pass.

That said, I recently read an article about Ernest Borgnine who died age 95 in July of this year. By all accounts he was a volatile character and he married 5 times. Four of those marriages were tempestuous but his last endured for some 40 years until his death.

It seems that he'd chosen to marry 4 equally volatile women but his last marriage was to a woman of a very different nature who was placid and self-effacing.

I particulary enjoyed a tale about Mr Borgnine's 38 day marriage to Ethel Merman who was 10 years his senior. Ethel, who was then in her 50's, was known for her rapier-like wit and on returning from the studio where she was filming one day she told Ernest that her director had remarked that she had the face of a 30 yr old and the legs of a 20 year old.

Ernest, who was in his 40's, responded with 'what did he say about your old c**t?' to which Ethel replied 'he didnt say anything about you'. That's my kinda gal

The moral of the story may be that if you are of a different nature to his former dw/girlfriends it could be that your relationship with him will last longer than they did.

Ha I love it izzyizin! I would like to think I'm more Ethel Merman than placid, I feel sarcasum is the only form of wit.

I have a failed marraige under my belt too and DP is so very different to EXH (he has a job for a start). DP's mum left when he was 12 to join some free love hippy commune and had an affair a few years ago with her female BF (she is now remarried) and told DP all about it, he hasn't had the best role models in life!

When he says its different he does seem genuine, I don't want to 'fall for it' but what if it is true? We could be really happy together.

BTW I'm dyslexic so sorry about spelling. On phone so it doesn't spell check (not that, that makes it better, I can't tell the difference between the words anyway!)

I'm certainly not advising you to leave the bastard, honey and if it ain't broke, there's no need to fix it.

However, as you've said, there's also no need to rush into having dc and I suggest you wait a few more years to see if your relationship stands the test of time before ttc.

Have you considered embarking on an adventure holiday or weekend? Any pursuit that depends on teamwork may give a clue to as to your individual strengths and weaknesses and whether you can pull together under pressure.

As Cogito has said, all relationships come with an element of risk and
IMO it's sensible for all women to advance their careers and to marry or otherwise legally secure joint or individual purchases such as property before having dc.

We can't eliminate every risk from our lives but we can take steps to minimise some of the fallout when relationships crash and burn or come to an unexpected and possibly premature end.

"He keep saying how can he prove that he has changed but I don't know how he can."

He can't really. Time, actions and words are the only way you know someone has changed. All I'd say to you is that, now that you have had your eyes opened, keep them open. Don't be tempted to make his excuses for him (like having a dodgy mother) or benchmark him against old time-wasters. Set your bar high, judge him by his actions and, if you find that you've lost respect for him or that you can't trust him or that you don't look at him the same way any more, then cut your losses.

Thank you both so much, great and level headed advice from both of you.

I am very lucky and have a strong family and friends around me, I know if it all went 'tits up' I would always have a home and surport, I can't say the same for DP though.

I have a good job and can afford to wait a couple of years before ttc again, it makes me a bit sad that this has happened and we have to put our family off for a while but better that I guess than being a single parent having had the chance to be sensible. I really want DC's though!