Opinions please re swinging nightmare

[80slass]

Hi any help/opinions would be appreciated please. I've been married for 10 years with 1 dc and always known my dh fantasised about us swinging. I've never been into this however ive encouraged his fantasies verbally during sex as otherwise he would struggle to come. This does blur boundaries I suppose although I've never given him cause to doubt my loyalty although he has had at least one affair in the past.
Anyway tonight we went out with a couple who are our friends and have been for many years. I've heard rumours in the past that this couple have a bit of an open marriage but I've never really believed it as I had no reason to do so. Anyway I don't know what changed tonight but the wife really came onto me. I was horrified but made it clear I wasn't interested. However while she was propositioning me (for want of a better phrase) my dh came in and made it clear he was interested in having sex with her while she was having sex with me. I was horrified and said 'sorry to disappoint you both but I'm not interested' (or something along those lines) and then ran off to my room. He said 'leave it xxxx, she doesn't want it', then got rid of them and came up to me.
Given his past history of affairs my instinct is to leave him (if I had been on mumsnet in 2005 when he had his last ea we wouldn't have been together now) however his defence (!) (and he is very gutted) is that he thought I was into it too (although I think my body language was absolutely the opposite)
I'm gutted. The only thing stopping me kicking his sorry arse out right now is wondering if the blurring of the boundaries mentioned above has confused things and made him think I am into something I am definitely not. I would be grateful for any opinions as two hours ago I thought I was very happily married. Thank you

How are you feeling OP the morning after the night before?
There was an interesting article by Suzi Godson in The Times yesterday about open r-ships along the lines that it may be presented as something mutually beneficial when really one partner has a personal agenda and the other is compromising under pressure. Basically this idea needs to be explored together and agreed in advance. Don't be pressurised into doing something you're not comfortable doing. You need to clarify boundaries with DH.

I really can't understand other posters saying the OP's DH has done nothing wrong - he has. He's betrayed her, in the worst possible way.

I'm open-minded about swinging - I think if both parties are up for it freely & without pressure then all good for them.

What I cannot understand - and I doubtt that even seasoned swingers would OK this - is he went behind her back.

If you are in a (you believe) heteromongamous relationship, then the ONLY person you discuss planned sexual activities with, is your partner. You do not go behind the person you are intimate with's back, and stage a possible extra marital contact. You just don't.

Even if the DH believed (via pillow talk) that his wife was 'up for it' he should have told her first.

I can't believe that others believe the DH reacted appropriately. The correct approach would have been to immediately all an end to the night, and talk to the OP in private - at home - later. Not allow his dick to become interested in his fantasy coming true.

Even if the event wasn't staged, and the other woman was acting impulsively, the DH should have made excuses and left - then sounded out his wife. By making it clear he wanted to shag the other woman, he's airing their private stuff openly, and putting the OP in the position of party pooper - instead of talking about it alone, then talking to the other couple, if the OP agreed.

Your biggest problem OP, is not that your husband wants to swing, it's that he doesn't respect you, your feelings, or your sexual boundaries.

I wouldn't trust your DH with her other woman now, even if it was just the fantasy, the truth is you know he'd happily shag her.

I find it hard to believe the female friend would instigate this with no sign of encouragement or discussion. What did her OH think?

I would be very surprised if this was a massive coincidence.

I hope you find out the truth you need.

Hi all and thanks for your opinions. I'm feeling a bit better about it today. Haven't seen dh, he was picked up early for a prearranged match. He has texted a few times. Friend has been round to apologise, she was very upset. I said I didn't want to talk about it again and she said she hoped it hadn't changed anything but of course it will. To answer some questions her DH was in the loo at the time. That wasn't a ploy, he definitely needed the loo. She said last night that he swings both ways too so my (very straight) dh could have got more than he bargained for hehe. I asked her if she had discussed it/sought permission from dh and she said (convincingly) no. I said she had taken a big risk then and she said all men in her experience wouldn't mind their dw having a lesbian experience. Earlier in the night she had offered to show me how to become multi orgasmic (and yes alarm bells should have rung very loudly for me then) which I declined and she said it was obvious to her that my dh was interested at that point.
I do genuinely think it wasn't preplanned but I need to get my head around the fact that dh was straight in there. I've had an interesting pm from a male netter and he says most men would like sex outside the marriage with their dw's permission. He says he too has struggled to read signals from his own dw. If nothing else this experience has clarified our boundaries.
On the subject of my marriage there have been 2 EAs and I know full details of both. To put it in context, we married very young having only known each other a few months (what a stupid thing to do with hindsight) and the first five years of our marriage were hellish- we didn't really know or like each other, we were resentful and stifled by marriage and our sex life was non existent. He had never had a serious relationship or even done the whole clubbing thing with mates as he was so young when we met which didnt help as he was wondering what he had missed out on. I had been to uni and dowed my wild oats. I dont know why we didn't split up sooner. 3 weeks after the second EA started I said I wanted to separate. I didn't know about the EA at the time, but he was following the script and I could see he was even less interested in our marriage than previously and I decided to call it a day. Within a week I applied online for divorce and sold the house and his EA became physical then fizzled out straight away. Anyway I ended up taking him back after he made a whole raft of promises and convinced me that he had needed to live a single life for a bit but only now, as a result of doing that could he appreciate what he had and that the grass wasn't greener. I have been in a much stronger position since as he had to beg me back whereas I had moved on nicely and it was clear I could live without him but he couldn't live without me. I do have more power in the relationship if truth be told but I'm careful not to exploit that.
Anyway the last five years have been the best of my life. We had a dc and he is a good dad, we do 50/50 housework and childcare, we are completely transparent about phones/our laptop etc. until last night I was mostly blissful in my marriage.
With regard to porn, he's not that bothered. I'm actually more into it than him and have to suggest we watch DVDs to him. It's something we do together occasionally.
His fantasy isn't as much swinging together as me being with another man or woman. I think it's a fairly harmless fantasy compared to some (he's never pressured me to actually engage before last night) however he does struggle to come if I'm not talking dirtily about it.
Thanks for listening.

Who was the male mner? Be very careful lots of pervs circulate these boards for titillation and a chance to take advantage.

Your husband fwiw sounds sexually dysfunctional. It's not longer a fantasy. Which yes we all have them. If it affects your life, or takes over your sexuality.

If he cannot come at all, without this fantasy being talked about amd it's, every time you have sex. Then he needs help and it won't go away.

I really don't think of him as sexually dysunctional but would welcome other opinions. I'll give the mumsnetter the benefit of the doubt and not name him but I note your comments thanks house.

So every single time he has sex. He has to have you talk dirty about swinging. EVERY time, or he can't come. You do not think that's dysfunctional? Really?!

Yes, really. It's barely different to him fantasising silently in his head. The difference is he's got no imagination so I have to vocalise it for him (!) I could not climax without fantasising, it's a mental thing as much as it is physical. And my fantasies are much more hard core than his!

Well good luck with it then. He won't change. The boundaries as you say are blurred. You have to be up "for it" every single time. Or he can't come. So chances are they'll be more "pre meditated" incidents in the future.

As its taken over his sexuality. We all have fantasies. But if it has to be the same thing, every single time, or else he can't come. He's got a problem.

I'm don't know whether he's dysfunctional or not, but if it has to be the same thing every single time or he can't come, doesn't that get boring for you? I once had a BF who, a short while into our relationship couldn't come unless my hands were tied or pinned down by him, above my head. It got really dull in the end, I could feel myself rolling my eyes every time he reached for a tie.

Anyway, I think now you know you're definitely not into swinging, it's time to stop feeding into his fantasy every single time you have sex. You're blurring the boundaries.

it's time to stop feeding into his fantasy every single time you have sex. You're blurring the boundaries.

Agree on the first part, but going along with a fantasy is not blurring RL boundaries. Anyone in any doubt about whether something is ok in RL should ask.

I think for me the deal breaker would not be that they tried to involve you in this - it would be that he cant come unless there is swinger stuff involved. That is quite a specific fetish/desire and one that unless you join in you will never be able to satisfy. I would definitely have aproblem with that. Just my opinion though.