I am not sure if there is a future for my marriage.

[PinkElephant73]

Winning the argument is more important to my husband than whether he is right, or the impact he has on me. We had a terrible row yesterday about a decision he made to pay for an expensive meal with a colleague when we are short of money. He was adamant that I was being unreasonable and treating him like a child. He then went on to say that I am negative and difficult to live with and that I shout at the kids a lot. I do admit that I can be resentful and angry sometimes, (although he says I am like this much of the time), as I feel like too much responsibility in the relationship falls on my shoulders. Over the years I have taken on more and more tasks, as he doesn?t get round to things (leaving bills unpaid/car unserviced/grass not cut/jobs not done around house). He is pre-occupied with his own hobbies and interests and recently has spent a lot of time away from home, leaving me to look after the children on my own or with help from my family. When he is with us, he often doesn?t seem present anyway as he is using his laptop or phone constantly.

Anyway, once he had got me to admit that I am at fault too in this, he had a complete change of heart and said that he felt terrible about the meal and that it had been a stupid mistake. I believe him, but I am very upset that he has caused me so much pain and distress by getting into a huge argument when he knew that he was in the wrong. This (not admitting he is in the wrong) has happened time and again in our relationship (18 years and 3 children). We have tried so many time to break the cycle of me doing everything/getting angry about it, and to be fair in the last few months he has started doing a bit more but I am just not sure if its too little too late. We have I think agreed to see how things go over the summer, and he will take on a couple of extra household ?jobs? but I feel so emotionally bruised this morning I just don?t know if its worth it.

Its rubbish I agree Cogito. What do you suggest I do?

Continue your exit planning? Reading your first post and then your most recent one it's pretty clear to me that you hadn't quite reached a last straw situation in July, you were still clinging on and hoping for the best, but you've sort of reluctantly had to accept that it's not really got any better. I think, once you separated the finances and the other steps you took, your heart's not in it any more

Chitchat you are bang on there. I don't expect an overnight fix to a problem that has crept up over years.

Cogito my followup post was to say that there has been some positive progress since my OP - which I think others have picked up on.

There are at least 2 similar threads going on AIBU at the moment, its so so common.

and thanks amillionyears too

Sorry... didn't think anyone would see the latest developments as an improvement. Good luck.

Cogito I don't think there's any need for snideness. This is the sort of PA crap I get from DH frankly and I think its about time I stopped tolerating it from anyone.

Pink I was going to link to some of the other current threads on the same topic - yes, it is common, to one degree or another.

How was your dinner?? Did he man up and cook?

amillionyears on the contrary, I don't see any progress here in their marriage. I see progress from OP, but not from him.

OP in answer to your question, no it should never 'come to this' with your life partner. I don't see someone I practically have to put diapers on as a 'life partner' as much as a big, overgrown baby with an attitude problem.

Yes it's almost an MN cliche to tell you to leave but I don't see at all what you're getting out of this. You would clearly cope much better on your own AND have far less work to do.

He doesn't sound like your soulmate so once you take that out of the equation, what's left? The mundane day-to-day is what, and if he's not helping with that, and in fact actually hindering, I don't see what the point of him is.

You don't sound happy.

Stop doing wife work for him.

Start preparing for your life without him.

Hell and other no-progress-seers: you're right, it's a total kneejerk MN cliche to say 'leave.' It's also completely hilarious in cases like this where it is based on literally a couple of paragraphs. I mean honestly.

What are you basing lack of progress on? DH's grumpy reponse to being asked to make supper? Thing is, if this has been the pattern in their relationship for X years and OP changes the pattern, her DH probably will be grumpy. You can't change things overnight (but I really believe and I base this on my own marriage) that you can change things.

We 1. got a cleaner, dishwasher, tumbledryer 2. put all the stuff we need to do (from renew car insuramce to potty train DD) into giant calendar for visibility 3. promised to acknowledge to each other when I am being chippily resentful and he is being sulkily withdrawn 4. had a lot more sex and - other stuff but I think those were the main four that helped turn things.

There is also an element of taking responsibility for your own behaviour - there are two people in this situation - and OP has contributed to this mess (enabling, withdrawing, being resentful) and she acknowledges this. That was pretty key for me. I had to do a lot of deliberate trying.

It may be true that some people have a complete and ideal marriage of equals - and I would like to hear the breakdown of housework etc in cogitos and hells house - genuine curiosity, not being snide or sceptical - but a hell of a lot of marriages are not like that. A hell of a lot of men are not raised like that (still.) Doesn't make it right, makes it the reality, and OP is trying to deal with reality of her marriage.

Good luck pink. I am signing off MN for a while to work (hence very long post). Back in a couple of months. Really hope that whatever you choose works out.

1. Winning the argument is more important to my husband than whether he is right,

1. I feel like too much responsibility in the relationship falls on my shoulders.

1. Over the years I have taken on more and more tasks, as he doesn?t get

round to things (leaving bills unpaid/car unserviced/grass not cut/jobs not done around house).

1. He is pre-occupied with his own hobbies and interests

1. [he] has spent a lot of time away from home, leaving me to look after the

children on my own

1. When he is with us, he often doesn?t seem present anyway as he is using

his laptop or phone constantly.

1. Sulks when he's asked to put a bit of pasta and sauce together (which my

9 year old does on a reasonably regular basis)

OhGood personally if there was that much dead weight in my house, I'd be getting rid. Maybe you wouldn't.

No 7 my words, not OP's :)

I feel like I am pointing out the obvious,but anyway,here goes.

Her DH has reorganised finances,that is a big step
Her DH doesnt always have to win an argument anymore,that is a big step
Her DH might grumpily make tea,a quite small step.

Hopefully he will do more large and small steps.He might not.The op is fully aware,as she has to live it,that there is indeed a very long way to go.
But the DH has made progress.
I am also fully aware,that a lot of women would have thrown in the towel by now.
It is peoples choice.But she hasnt mentioned he is violent,so he probably isnt.She hasnt even mentioned that he shouts a lot.
At the end of the day,there are children involved here too,who also probably want the family to stay intact.

The point is not whether it's the obvious or not, the point or the question is: what is the OP getting from her relationship with the man? Is he even good company? Is he at least a tiger in the sack?

Oh and by the way, I'm not even going to further waste finger energy on this:
But she hasnt mentioned he is violent
except to say that as women, we seriously need to STOP considering this a positive in a relationship or nothing will ever change.

Sheesh...

Hello again ladies:) I do appreciate your insights. I have also been reading "Wifework" as recommended on other threads. Interesting reading and one of her main conclusions is that divorce is usually a Bad Thing for children (except in cases of abuse).

DH has continued to make more of an effort to share chores although he is still off work, wil have to wait and see what happens next week when he is back to commuting and not getting in til 7.30pm. He has been a lot happier whilst on holiday. He has been looking around for a new job for over 2 years and although I was aware he was not enjoying his current post, it is only since our major bustup that he has made it clear just how bad it is. He feels like he is wasting his life in this job, but other opportunities at his level dont come up often. We are both aware however that we are lucky that both of us are in employment so need to keep it in perspective.

We are working through our "issues" one step at a time. Trying not to attempt to fix everything at once and fail. Its not just DH, the older DCs also need to take responsibility for doing their bit around the house (age 10 and 12). They have very simple tasks to complete - get selves dressed, make bed, clear away after meals, put dirty laundry in basket, tidy own room once a week etc. However they are very slack and need constant nagging. We have jointly agreed a checklist and reward/penalty system. I have also weaned DD (18 months) - last BF was about a week ago. We still have a lot of disturbed nights with her and it is 2 steps forward one back. She will literally scream for 2 hours nonstop (doing CC) - we had visitors last weekend who were amazed/appalled. If we can both get a good night's sleep then the rest of it may be more achievable...

He sounds just like my h used to be (20 years, 3 kids between us, plus two of mine from previous).

With us it got way worse, as the less responsibility he took in practice (whilst agreeing to take some, and not), the more I complained and the more he saw that as 'control'. Finally there were OW (he says online) and initially he tried to blame my 'controlling'.

On down the line, things are much better, though we still have some work to do.

The absolutely most useful book I have read is the one on boundaries by Cloud and Thomson. They also do one on boundaries in marriage. Both are worth having, especially if you want to extend the principles to the kids.

I am not a christian, and the writers of the book are, so they bring in religious examples from time to time. That doesnt bother me, as the principles are spot on, and so are the simple processes for solving them which they suggest.

It is all readable practical stuff on how to take responsibility, how to avoid taking responsibility for what is not your share, and what to do when there is conflict. It shows you how not to control others , whilst at the same time not enabling others to be irresponsible, which your h is, a fair bit.

I wish I had had this years ago.

For example, you can support your h re his job and understand him, and help him to make time to look elsewhere for different work. But it isnt an excuse for his self centredness.