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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Never been loved, unloveable?

19 replies

runtosea · 09/07/2012 14:30

This is my first post, so firstly my apologies. I've been lurking and reading for a while and I've found that what I've read on here has truly opened my eyes to some of the things I've experienced in my life, and has changed my way of thinking for the better (I think!).

Now it is my turn to ask for some of your wise counsel. Or at least a kick up the backside if considered appropriate.

I'm in my mid thirties, and was married for 9 years until that came to an end two years ago. It should have ended a lot sooner. The last time we had sex was just after the honeymoon; after that - nothing. Not through my choice, but he made it clear he wasn't interested, and I didn't know how to broach the subject, so swept it under the carpet. At the beginning, things were all right, I suppose, despite the lack of sex. He had always been fairly undemonstrative, but he was kind and caring, at the beginning anyway. I knew at the back of my mind, even on the day of the wedding, that he probably wasn't right for me, but he was there, he claimed to love me, I thought I loved him, and I wanted some security in my life. I had suffered quite badly from depression in my early 20s, just before I met him, and I think part of me was truly terrified of being left to deal with the possibility of the illness returning and being all on my own. I should say that I am not from this country originally and have no family here at all.

As time went on in the marriage, we began to drift apart emotionally. We both worked long hours, he commuted three hours a day, four days a week, and I worked two jobs. But we always sat down to dinner together and slept in the same bed. We didn't fight, but he would go days, weeks even, without speaking to me. Not for any particular reason, just.........because. He never, ever, ever complimented me, or make me feel good about myself. I have body image issues that are quite long standing and do believe that I am ugly; he would sort of back that up by his indifference.

It all came to a head for me when my father was diagnosed with cancer and was told he had to have an operation immediately and wasn't given much hope for recovery. My husband had booked us a holiday with his family, and I really didn't want to go, because I wanted to be available to get on a flight ASAP if anything happened to my father. My husband basically said, if I didn't go on the holiday as planned, our marriage was over. I went. And spent the whole time climbing a mountain with my mobile held in the air trying to get a signal to see if I had any messages from my mother. It was horrible. Husband and his family didn't seem to notice that there was a problem. When not up the mountain, I spent the rest of the time in silence, being ignored by him and listening to them chat happily together as though I wasn't there. I overheard his mother describing me as "moody and petulant" to my SIL. However, the operation was a success, and my father is very much still alive and doing well.

After that episode, he got a job abroad, and I realised I was so much happier when he wasn't in the house than when he was. It took me over a year, but finally I wrote him a letter and we split up. One of the things he said to me, when I brought up my resentment about how he behaved during my father's illness. He said to me, "you always make such a fuss, I assumed you were exaggerating as usual, and I knew he'd be ok. I couldn't let down my family on the back of one of your dramas". Cancer. Exaggerating. Thanks for that. When I finally left, I had nothing. He had stopped paying the mortgage or his share of the bills without warning, I had to carry the entire costs until the house could be sold, which destroyed my savings. Due to the recession, we lost a ton of money on the house, and due to my shit lawyer (couldn't afford a decent one), he never paid me back the money he owed and got his "share" of the proceeds of the sale. I calculated that he owes me nearly 10k, but I accept now that I will never see it.

So now I'm living on my own and life is returning to me. I still have massive self esteem issues. I have come to recognise that I have never been loved - my husband didn't love me, and the people I had relationships with before him didn't either. I had a few abusive relationships with nasty men, emotionally and physically, when I was in my teens and early 20s. My parents are kind but very distant, and I am an only child. I was deeply in love with someone once who I have never forgotten, but he didn't love me and the relationship didn't last long. Now, I find myself looking at the very strong possibility that I will never be loved. And the possibility that, as my life has demonstrated, I cannot be loved. And it is so unfair. I have friends and I think I do have a lot to give. I know I'm no beauty, but I'm slim and fit and a size 8, and fairly trendy, and know how to dress (sort of); I'm smart enough to have a good PG degree and a decent job, and I have a hobby that I do well enough to be semi-professional at it. But yet.

Since the split I have had two "relationships". One with a man who reintroduced me to sex, which he was amazing at, but who talked the talk, then ran away when it looked like it could get serious. The other was with someone who was the poster boy for narcissism, only I didn't know the term until I started reading Mumsnet! I don't seem to know how to act in relationships, and I don't seem to understand the rules. It seems to me that I am simply not "enough" to be loved. Everyone I meet runs away. And I'm terrified that the one who stays will turn out to be a repeat of the past: abusive, uncaring, or simply uninterested.

Sorry for the essay. I suppose I just would like to hear some insights into what happens next. How to break this cycle, to put the bitterness away, and to deal with the guilt, the hurt and the memories that stalk me every day.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 09/07/2012 14:43

Love is an act of faith. Putting yourself out there to be loved makes you vulnerable. It is not a crime to love people that don't reciprocate or turn out to be not what they seem. The trick is to recognise them early enough that you either don't get involved with them in the first place, or don't waste too much time after you realise they're not right.

I think how you break the cycle is twofold a) stop looking for someone and b) start properly liking yourself. Potential partners pick up on any hint of desperation or neediness and either find it a turn-off or see it as something to be exploited. If you stop looking, that blocks a lot of problems. Liking yourself is a bit of a cliche but, in practice, it means living your independent life to the full, being confident, having passionate interests and a sense of purpose that doesn't rely on someone else to make it complete. Once you really like yourself and your life you will be a lot more reluctant to share it with anyone who doesn't come up to scratch.

PeppermintPasty · 09/07/2012 14:44

Well, first off, you don't sound "unloveable" to me, you sound thoughtful and insightful. It also seem sto me that you have had some unpleasant or downright nasty experiences that not everyone would have coped with.

Have you considered talking to a counsellor about these issues? You see, what strikes me is that you may be coming at it from the wrong angle-seeking love from someone else, seeking validation somehow. It's the old cliche about learning to love yourself first isn't it? It screams out to me from your post that you need to spend more time with yourself, getting your life back, "life is returning to me".

What was the root of your depression? Have you ever got to the bottom of that, or started to? If not, maybe that is a starting point, and a good counsellor would be able to help you with that. You are worth so so much more than to be with a man like your ex. Frankly, he sounds vile from what you have said. What a great and positive thing you have done-to rid yourself of him.

You will be loved, when things are right with you. That may take time, months, years maybe. But taking your time is far better than saddling yourself with the stress of thinking you'll never find love. Or even worse, getting into another abusive relationship.

Anyway, that's a bit long. I'm such a slow typist I'm sure you've had tons of replies by now Smile

runtosea · 09/07/2012 19:56

Thank you for your comments, I didn't think anyone would answer!

CES: that is very wise, but what I struggle with is trusting myself to make the decision that something isn't right.

PP: I suppose I am somehow seeking validation, because I don't know how not to. I don't want to be alone forever. I see happy couples out and about and I ache.
I did have counselling, and that was what helped me actually leave ex-h in the first place. It helped, a bit.
Underlying cause of the depression probably wasn't helped by a slightly out of kilter childhood and a history of associating sex with being accepted. I still have that way of thinking in me and need to fight that instinct.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 09/07/2012 20:14

You will find it far easier to make the decision that something isn't right once you improve your confidence. If you don't believe you are worthy the risk is you set your sights too low. Also, if you have the confidence to be friends with a man without it automatically turning into a sexual relationship, that also improves your decision-making. You'll get better at sizing them up.

Mollydoggerson · 09/07/2012 20:15

I think you need to build up your confidence and maybe look for fun first, instead of epic love, just light hearted fun.

I am intrigued by the sexless relationship, why did your ex want marriage but not sex?

runtosea · 09/07/2012 20:26

Sexless relationship: I have NO idea why. It was like he just couldn't be bothered any more. As though once we were married he was relieved of that responsibility. But before than we had a pretty normal and relatively good sex life.

OP posts:
kittybiscuits · 09/07/2012 20:53

Hi op, whatever the reasons for your ex husband's lack of interest in sex, they are most likely to be his reasons/issues entirely. Your mistake is to look at his actions/his preferences, and ask yourself what it is about you that means he doesn't want you in that way. He sounds horribly remote and uncaring. I am pleased you found your way out. Maybe you could work on your self-esteem? You sound lovely, btw. And maybe when you can believe that about yourself even some of the time, there will be a possibility of finding a partner to love and cherish you. Smile

PeppermintPasty · 09/07/2012 21:02

At the risk of being presumptuous, do you think that the root causes lie in your childhood being slightly "out of kilter"? It took me til I was into my forties for the scales to fall from my eyes wrt my childhood. I am not trying to depress you! Everyone's different, but such an important period in your life sometimes takes years to unravel. Be kind to yourself. You are not failing, in taking time to deal with it all.

Again, this may be presumptuous but you could do worse than take a look at the Stately Homes thread on here and/or the child sexual abuse thread. Forgive me if I'm way off, but being coy(ie me being coy) wouldn't work x

runtosea · 09/07/2012 21:23

Childhood probably has something to do with it, my parents were loving but very distant. I had no siblings and craved acceptance, so I discovered that I could attract men. Older men. You know the story! One was married; one gave me a black eye; one stalked me after I finally got away to Uni......

OP posts:
PeppermintPasty · 09/07/2012 21:51

Yes of course. Ok forgive me, I was a bit off. Well, actually, maybe not that off-I had/have a very emotionally unavailable mother and I have concluded in the last few years that she is a classic narcissist. MN helped me decipher all the rubbish.

I know where you're coming from with seeking out love (in the wrong places). I did the same. It may not help with how you're feeling right now, but you're on the road to sorting all this. Love will follow-at the risk of sounding like a schmaltzy drip!

runtosea · 10/07/2012 11:06

I really want to learn how to "accept yourself". Do people really look in the mirror and like what they see? I can't even go try on clothes in a shop, last time I tried dress shopping with a friend I had a meltdown in the changing room as I felt so unworthy of the lovely clothes we were trying on.

I have recently met a nice man, and I genuinely like him as a person. I've had three "dates" with him (dinners, one at his place), but no physical contact apart from a few rather chaste kisses goodbye. I'm trying to be positive about it, but I know - I just know - he's too "good" for me, and why would he be interested in me when he is so attractive and personable - he could have anyone. He does go weeks without getting in touch, so I doubt it will go anywhere to be honest.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 10/07/2012 11:21

"Do people really look in the mirror and like what they see?"

Not at all. Confidence means working with reality rather than being delusional. A confident person will weigh up what they see in the mirror together with their personality, skills etc. and decide whether to accept any imperfections or take steps to fix them.

A big part of confident is the old 'fake it until you make it'. However you're feeling, if you act like a confident person that's exactly how people treat you. If you've ever envied someone for being marvellously confident, bear that in mind.

Mollydoggerson · 10/07/2012 11:31

People do eventually accept themselves, I'm not sure if I am there yet but I am getting close.

I think you need to distance yourself from any toxic people. There can be lots of people who are just not good for us. Can be pleasant on the surface but ultimately dismissive/rude/unkind/critical. For me it has been helpful to identify that some of the people in my life have been misguided in some of their advice or influence and I therefore have had to stand up to them a little in order to protect myself. To challenge some of the long standing family habits.I think it really takes time to understand who is impacting upon you negatively, who is ultimately treating you wrongly for whatever reason, and then taking control by not allowing it to happen any further. As they say you cannot change people, you can only change your reaction to them. There are other people in my life who are so self absorbed (still lovely people), that they are somewhat draining for me, and ultimately not good for me so I have learned to keep my distance.

I really think you need to focus on yourself. I have focused on being in control of my career (maybe taking a step sideways and possibly a slight step down, but it is suiting me better). I am now beginning to focus on my health and improving body shape, as surprise, surprise I am worth it and nobody can control it except for me.

Once your confidence grows, people recognise it and honestly I think treat you a little better. Buy yourself the clothes, you are of course worth it. Try and evaluate what you want in life (apart from the man). Try to evaluate what is best for you. Spend the time and money on yourself, you are as worth it as the next person.

runtosea · 10/07/2012 14:58

You are so right about "toxic people", Molly. I've recently stopped seeing an a friend for exactly this reason. She was super popular and I sort of coasted on her social coattails, which was useful for meeting people and doing stuff, but I found her exhausting and manipulative.
I do focus on myself a bit, in that I'm very into fitness and health, and I run and go to the gym a lot. I push myself hard and set goals. I think I am moving forward a bit as when I'm running, I feel so strong! But somehow it doesn't quite translate into the rest of my life.

I have a really strong memory of being maybe 10 years old (I can date it, because my great grandfather was alive), and deciding that no, I will not have an icecream, because my stomach was fat. Isn't that so sad? I was already denying myself a pleasure because of criticism of myself. So young :(.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 10/07/2012 15:39

The good news is that you're no longer 10. You can't change the past but you have 100% control over the future.

alphabite · 10/07/2012 16:02

I am a similar age and came to the conclusion a couple of years ago that I will never be loved. I have never been in a serious relationship.

I live with it but it doesn't mean you should. You don't sounds like the kind of person who is unlovable. You maybe need to get your confidence back and then take control of your life. Go for it girl.

fizzfiend · 10/07/2012 16:16

Your story is very similar to mine. My DH went off sex pretty much after the wedding...I practically had to beg for it. After we broke up (also way later than it should have) I rediscovered sex with the wrong kind of people.

Eventually I ended up here...on my own and feeling very sorry for myself. That no man had ever loved me, not even my father. One day I blurted out all this to a very close friend who I knew would listen and not judge. She reminded me that I had loads of friends who loved me. They didn't have to love me, but they did...and kept coming back for me. It made me realise I was being a bit self-obsessed and maybe I'd just been unlucky with men. I also remembered men who had been in love with me but I hadn't loved them back...I'd conveniently forgotten about them because they hadn't really mattered to me.

It took a while but I now know that I am loveable...and I'm not searching for anyone. With a bit of luck someone might turn up one day, but I'm learning to count my blessings....the friends, family and daughter I have. I try to remind myself that others have a much worse deal than me...sick people, people with sick kids, etc. Nobody has it perfect. Try not to beat yourself up and think about the good things in your life and the good things you have done. Maybe try to do more good things by doing something for charity, befriending old people, helping out with others' kids, etc. It will really help...we can spend too much time thinking about things that really don't deserve as much attention.

puds11 · 10/07/2012 16:23

Hi op. I feel like this a lot too. I dont believe that anyone i have been with has ever truely loved me, and i'm starting to think that no-one ever will. Having said that, i have never truely loved anyone, and have never felt there was a person who i couldnt live without.

I do want to be loved, and to love back, but im starting to think that for some people it just doesnt happen. I think i am certainly one of those people.

runtosea · 10/07/2012 18:50

"I do want to be loved, and to love back, but im starting to think that for some people it just doesnt happen. I think i am certainly one of those people."

This is how I feel too, and this is a conclusion that I've come to also. But I'm not quite ready to give up hope yet, which is what is so soul destroying. Every time I get a hint of hope, it is cruelly dashed. Perhaps I just am a glutton for punishment?

fizzfiend - what your friend said to you is so very true I suppose. I am really blessed to have a best friend who I love and who I know loves me. We are closer than most sisters. And I had sort of not thought of that as proof that "someone" can love me.
You use the word "luck", which is something I've dwelt upon a lot. I've not really ever had the bit of luck that would make life a bit easier. I don't have it bad, but haven't had a break either. Some people seem to simply have luck. They are lucky enough that the bad things pass them by and the good things come their way. That isn't my road. But yes, I have a decent life and I try to do my best to remember that. I've had to fight bloody hard for that bit of decency though, nothing has come easily.

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