Need some outside perspective, a bit of a ramble sorry

[AverageWombat]

I don't know what advice I'm looking for really I just need to get a few things written down and maybe get a little outside perspective. Sorry if this turns out really long.

Last year I left my husband. We were together for 9 years, married for 5. We got together when I was 16 (and still in school) and he was 22, got married when I was 19 just 2 weeks before our daughter was born. Dd is now 5.

The reasons I left were longstanding and mostly just caused low-level unhappiness rather than full blown rows and arguing all the time. In fact to outsiders we probably both seemed content enough, but truthfully I'd been thinking about leaving for some time.

From before dd was born, in fact from the moment I fell pregnant, EXH seemed completely unbothered about sex. The first excuse was pregnancy, then it was the baby, tiredness, stress, the wrong phase of the moon.. eventually he withdrew all intimacy (including kissing) completely unless he felt things were just right and only then was he able to bestow his gift of affection.

All through these years I wanted sex and actively tried to initiate things, even asking him what he thought might get him interested and tried his suggestions, but I was rejected 99% of the time. The constant rejection was crushing, and eventually I shut off from him and stopped trying, I couldn't handle the way it made me feel. I actually cried myself to sleep most nights at the thought of spending the rest of my life feeling like that. Although he reluctantly admitted there was a problem when I tried to talk to him about it, he gave the impression that he was happy with our sex life (probably because it was all on HIS terms) and he thought that I was making a big deal about nothing.

Since our split I've started seeing someone new and I have never been so happy. It's helping me to realise that this is how a relationship should be, and I'm starting to see my previous relationship for what it really was. I was just a young girl really when I met EXH. He hated my family and pressured me to move out when I was 17 because my mum was trying to stop me seeing him. I did, and he eventually got me to stop all contact with my family and move hundreds of miles away to live with him. I was so naive, but my family was not a happy one and I thought that getting away from them would be good for me at the time. In fact after I left they sort of imploded - my dad left my mum, my mum became even more of an alcoholic than she had been before and my siblings were taken into care. That makes me sad to this day and I know it's slightly irrational but I do feel responsible for what happened after I left, even more so since my mum died recently due to alcoholism.

During the marriage I never felt like I was on equal terms with EXH. I never felt good enough. Now that I'm looking back with a clearer perspective I can see that he was actually quite controlling and manipulative, something that my mum had tried to tell me when I was 16 but I refused to listen :(.

Anyway fast-forward to today. Dd is now 5 and since I was a complete pushover and emotional wreck and couldn't stand up to EXH when we split, I only get to see her every other weekend and one evening after school :( This is NOT an arrangement I'm happy with, not at all. Since I've been away from him I've gained some confidence and realised that actually, I AM a good mum and dd deserves to see more of me, whether EXH likes it or not. I'm taking him to court for joint residency (but I would love full residency), as I think she needs to spend time with both her parents as equally as possible. He is fighting me every step of the way, backed by his entire family, while I feel I have very little support.

I know I'll be frowned upon for letting myself get into this situation in the first place, but at the time I left I was going through so much emotionally. My mum had died 2 days before, I watched as they turned off the machines and cried for what could have been. She was only in her forties and had only met my dd once as a baby. So I know that I should have stood up to him at the time but as I said before, I was an emotional wreck and had been controlled by him since I was a teenager.

I'm currently trying to get my life back on track and focus on making dd and myself happy. I have no friends but I'm starting to make more of an effort to get to know other mums at the school, however I find it awkward and embarrassing to admit that dd lives with her dad and not me, without going into the details of why. I really don't want to badmouth EXH, even though I know he has done so to our (ex)mutual friends.

I don't know what I'm really asking for in terms of advice, but if anyone did actually read to the bottom - thank you.

I think you are bloody brave and sound very sorted. I caonoletely agree that your dd deserves to see you more. I hope all goes well with the legal battle. You can do it :)

Completely agree... By the way, sorry that you've had a tough time, the only way is up as you have proven. Wishing you all the best.

Ive read most of it.Sorry about your mum.You have had a difficult time.
Quite a lot of people come on here just to rant or get things out in the open.
Not sure how new a poster you are.
I find it useful sometimes to put words into the search box at the top of the page if I want to find out all sorts of things really.Much stuff you will find an answer for, as it will have already been discussed to a degree.
Im thinking you would like some help and support about joint residency.
Dont have any knowledge about this, but I should do the search about it,else start a new post about it.
This post is rather long, and some people would not have time or inclination to read it all.

I have read to the bottom.
Your story and explanation about your youth and emotional state due to mums death at the time of the split will explain to judge why you let things happen as they did.
As you have done nothing wrong and simply want to have joint residency (or at very least some more time with her) then I am sure the courst will listen to you. Do not be intimidated.
His family will not be in any hearings- just you and him and your briefs.
Stick to your argument, support his afthering (if it is good) but emphasize the importance of a mum in a daughter's life.
I really hope it works out.
Don't give up- your daughter will appreciate it.

You are now 24 and he is 30- a much fairer age, and clearly a good age to ask to share her upbringing.

Any argument about you being young, 'unfit' (due to your Mum's death) etc etc have disappeared. Do you work and a have a stable home?
Do you live with new partner?
Does exh live with his partner?
Does daughter want it?
All these things may be asked or rehashed.

Please go forward with your plan

You sound strong and clear

The Family Courts will listen to you, ignore what the rest of his family say...they have no influence on proceedings

Your dd is entitled to a more equally-footed relationship with you, her mother

Good luck x

btw, you were targeted by this man as a very young girl, don't blame yourself for the situation you found yourself in

I imagine they will put DD care first- so you need to create an argument for HER benfit why this change should happen (not your benefit iyswim)
Things like- clothing, periods, friendships, doing her hair, dance classes, normality in child's life to have close maternal relationship, bra sizes, just all those things a Mum knows that a Dad may not. Explaining these things (that may have been unknown to you with alcoholic mum- sorry but they may refer to this) and showing you understand them and want to share them will help.

Excellent points AF I concur- esp last point. He was out of order at such a young age to target you and remove you from your family.

I have read to the bottom and I just wanted to say how brave I think you are. I don't have any experience of joint custody I'm afraid but I couldn't go without saying well done for getting this far, good luck and I hope everything goes well for you.

yes, good points by klick

you must be very aware and make it quite clear how much your daughter will benefit from your relationship, not just you IYSWIM

it's actually not about you (according to the courts)

Thank you for your replies, I'm sorry it was such a long post. I'm sitting here in tears after reading some of those, but I'm not really sure why . I haven't spoken to many people about it in RL so it feels good to get some honest opinions. I'll post again when I've dried my tears enough to reply properly

let the tears flow, love, they will help you

you will need strength and determination, but you can do it

Take care and good luck xx
And have a and a

Just wanted to add my support - as other posters have said, you sound extremely brave & I wish you all the best with the court case.

I read to the end and it was no problem. YOu have been through a lot so it takes a while to tell the tale (and with domestic abuse there are a lot of strands, which you have succinctly pulled together in your OP).

I'm not sure how joint residency goes but you will need a GP's backing that things are well with you now. The courts look for evidence, it's not enough to sit there looking good (are saying you are good), they have to have evidence. If at a future date you want to go for full residency you will need a lot of backing and for that I'd contact Womens Aid. In fact, contact them anyway pending your current case because they have all the info (and can refer you to other agencies too should the need arise) as well as emotionally support you through the case.

I represented myself in the family courts against ex's hotshot team of central london lawyers and I won! So don't worry about ex and his family; as a pp said, they won't be there in the courtroom. You also have your man so you are not entirely alone, even if ex does have all his family. Hate to say it but what kind of family are they anyway if they bred a controller like that (not as great as you may think...)

Well done, you've come through a lot and sound very clear. Well done.

I think you have shown your strength by actually leaving the bastard. You definitely can't leave your daughter in that situation though, if he's controlling and manipulative she isn't in for an easy ride either. Get some legal advice and get ready to be brave again, she's worth it and so are you. Well done :) (and your post wasn't too long)

Thank you for the replies, I know if I were reading my post as it were written by someone else I would be telling them how brave they are and how they're doing the right thing. But I honestly don't feel brave I feel like I've been stupid and I've played into EXH's hands as well as letting dd down :(

In reply to KlickKlackknobsac's questions:

Do you work and a have a stable home? Yes I work full-time but have flexible hours to allow me to pick dd up from school on the days I have her. I rent a 2 bedroom place and have started to fill it (as much as I can afford) with things to make dd feel at home. I wasn't allowed to take any of her clothes or toys or books with me :( let alone any furniture so had to start completely from scratch.

Do you live with new partner? No, he's only met dd twice as a friend but they got on well. Have been holding off on introducing them properly due to fear of it being used against me somehow.

Does exh live with his partner? No, he doesn't have one.

Does daughter want it? She tells me every time she's here that she wants me to take her to school, she wants to live with me and that she misses me lots. Obviously she's too young for this to be taken into account at all in court.

Just wanted to say that it has only been 6/7 months since I moved out and I applied to the court about 3 months ago, with the final hearing next month. I completely agree about making a case for why dd would benefit from seeing me more, rather than making it about me. If it were a case of me just missing her I could probably handle that, but I know she misses me and was always very close to me.

Even though it's crippling me financially as I'm not entitled to legal aid, I know I have to do this for dd. EXH is being represented by a lawyer family member so I imagine is not suffering so much financially.

Your point about lack of furniture and the reason is valuable / valid- remember that if anything is said.
Not sure about impact of new partner meeting DD- I think your instinct is right but check with Women's Aid or Legal advisor.
Your daughter's comments are powerful. Keep being loving to her, and don't think the court won't listen to her because I think they may well do (but not in front of you both of course)
Make sure you have an experienced brief. Irrelevant that his rep is a family member- although judge hearing case may disapprove of that. Get lots of evidence of the ways your daughter has expressed the fact that she misses you. And also good that its only 6/7 month since you lived with her full time- I am sure the court will want to reinstate this relationship.

I've got (hopefully) good legal representation and I'm awaiting feedback from them on the first draft of my statement ready for the final hearing. The comments here have been useful and I'm making notes on things to add to my statement.

It was decided that a CAFCASS report would not be done in this case as neither party had welfare concerns and they deemed dd to be too young to take her wishes into account. So dd wont be spoken to at all unfortunately. I will mention her comments to my solicitor though.

Glad to hear your case went well springydaffs, it must have been daunting representing yourself? I know I'm much more confident now than when I was with him, but I know I am definitely not ready for that. Good on you though.

As there is no welfare concern. Their best bet is to suggest you are not fit/ stable/ financially able/ clever/ resourceful enought to have DD more. Or that the change of routine will be a blow to her.
You need to think of every eventuality- everything they can throw at you. Esp new partner- you are not living with him hopefully as that could swing it. I am sure as you see her already the change in routine argument should not hold any weight.
Were there any mental health probs when you were with him that he may dredge up?
If I was on his side I would hark back to your own less than perfect upbringing (his words iyswim) and explain that you do not have the maternal model in your own mother meaning you cannot be a good model for your DD. You need to minimise the experience you had when you grew up, disregard your siblings going into care (as that was after you left so they experienced different things to you) and focus on the good times you had with your parents and esp your mum. And also the fact that this less than perfect experience means you are veryt well equipped to know what NOT to do, and also how valuable a good mother is (as you missed out a bit and really want to make sure that doesn't happen to your DD).
Cannot think of much more- but you know how devious he is (or isn't). If you have been on anti-depressants or anything and he knows- he may bring it up and ask for a delay- or anything else like getting drunk or doing drugs. But its last hearing you say so a bit late to bring new evidence.
Just watch your back- he may be having you watched.
And be as nice as pie to him on the day. I assume you want him to keep some contact so that's not a problem?
Best of luck

Their best bet is to suggest you are not fit/ stable/ financially able/ clever/ resourceful enought to have DD more. Or that the change of routine will be a blow to her. Yes I think he will be using the argument that the change of routine will be "unsettling" for her and her life will lack stability. I would counter that by stating the fact that he has just (in the past few weeks) moved house and therefore she is already being unsettled somewhat by him. She has regular overnight contact with me and is comfortable in my house (I live alone and she's only met new DP as a friend twice around Christmas), so increasing the contact with me is unlikely to be unsettling. Also as another poster said it's only been 6/7 months since I was living with her full-time.

Were there any mental health probs when you were with him that he may dredge up? I did attend counselling a few years ago but that was actually to talk through my feelings of wanting to leave him. At the time I decided to stay and hope things would improve. But I had some issues with depression, self-harm etc before I met EXH, I am worried he might bring these up but hoping they would be too far in the past to be relevant? No mental health problems at all while with him or since dd was born, even going through the death of my mum I was able to remain functional and haven't ever been on anti-d's.

And also the fact that this less than perfect experience means you are veryt well equipped to know what NOT to do, and also how valuable a good mother is (as you missed out a bit and really want to make sure that doesn't happen to your DD). Good point. Since my own mother isnt here any more I really want to be the best I can be for dd and give her the things I missed out on. My mother was only an alcoholic during my teen years so I do have good memories from when I was younger, even though my parents had a very violent and abusive relationship. Can't believe how much I miss her now having typed that :(

If you have been on anti-depressants or anything and he knows- he may bring it up and ask for a delay- or anything else like getting drunk or doing drugs. But its last hearing you say so a bit late to bring new evidence. I hardly drink and have never touched drugs. No social services or police involvement in our relationship or dd's upbringing, hence the lack of a cafcass report as they were satisfied that we were both good enough parents.

Something else I think he will try to use is that I had to work away from home for a few days at a time in the run-up to our split. However this is no longer required of me and I'm going to speak to the HR department at work to get a letter stating my flexible working. He will also accuse me of having an affair and "abandoning" dd, which hopefully the court will see is just him being bitter and my statement will explain the real reasons behind her staying with him.

Thank you for posting by the way, I really appreciate it.

lets us know how it goes- sounds like its all sorted to me.
And actually your xp sounds like he loves her too. Give him some credit in there- it shows you are putting dd first.
xx

I spoke to someone the other day who had to go to court to get her kids back. Her solicitor got out a Next catalogue and told this woman what to wear at the hearing ie mumsy clothes. You can't believe it can you but you have to watch every eventuality ie don't go in looking like a businesswoman iywsim, look like a 'mummy'.

btw I represented myself because I had no choice! ex had repeatedly taken me to court and legal aid refused to fund any more court appearances, so I had no choice but to represent myself. I shook to the core. But I won [yay]

actually it wasn't a next catalogue but a catalogue - sorry, 'next' and 'catalogue' seem to go together in my head - crap story teller

Good point though- wear a cardigan maybe? A skirt? Dunno- but not lke a business woman and not like a tart. (That old chestut).