I think I need to limit contact with my parents, but how to do it?

[Kveta]

my parents are becoming increasingly hard work - correcting my parenting every time they talk to me, bitching about me to one of my sisters behind my back (and about her to me - she and I get on VERY well, talk daily, and are in agreement that parents are being quite toxic), and generally refusing to accept that they are ever in the wrong.

this has all come to a head recently - middle sister has returned me some baby stuff I lent her, and it is filthy, covered in sick, maggoty, stained, crusty - vile. She hasn't returned the one thing we lent her that we actually NEED back, a travel cot, and has said she is keeping it as she still wants it. I have asked her for some money towards it, as it was in pristine condition when we loaned it to her, and we need a new one for our forthcoming DC2. Parents have intervened, said she isn't to pay, and they will get us a new cot so she doesn't have to - but it means no presents for the baby (which is fine, but a bit off). They told younger sister (the one who I get on well with) that I have no right to be asking for money, as my house is dirty too (it is messy, but no dirtier than their house!!)

Parents are also supposed to be coming down when DC2 is due, to look after DS. they recently changed their minds about this, said they'd be staying near us, but on holiday, they wouldn't be doing any cooking or cleaning (I have said that I won't be catering for them, as my father was hinting that they should stay with us, have our bed, and we would wait on them - when I'll be 40+ weeks pg, or have a newborn to look after - ha, I don't THINK so!!), and they would only look after DS if it suited them to do so. And they aren't staying for long, as have to go and visit middle sister (this is a new development).

DH is ready to swing for them, I am just pissed off by it all, and the person who is going to miss out most of all will be DS, as he adores his Granny and Grandad (he is only 2.6).

I currently talk to them once a week, and it is getting harder to remain civil, but they just will not stop harping on about how we parent DS (apparently none of THEIR children ever woke up during the night, or had a tantrum, or said no to them, or got down from the table before the adults had finished eating etc etc etc And mothers shouldn't work, should use reusable nappies, should make own purees for weaning (but NOT do BLW, as it is dangerous), should breast feed exclusively, but stop bfing by 1 year, it's repulsive after that, should not co-sleep, should leave child to cry it out, should have a dog for child to interact with, should live in the countryside, blah blah). They also spend a lot of time griping on about how little help they had from their parents when we were all born (both grandmothers stayed for a fortnight each to help after I was born, and one set stayed for a fortnight to help when younger sis was due, and the other paid for a cleaner/mother's help for a month after one of our births too), but are doing the same to us - I have asked them once for help, and been told to stop whinging, they live too far away, are busy at work etc etc.

I need to be able to stop interacting with them, as it angers me so much every time. I want to be able to tell them where to go if they are ghastly when DC2 arrives. DH wants to tell them not to come, but agrees with me that it is not fair on DS to limit his contact with beloved grandparents just because they are ghastly to his mother. (his grandfather on the other side, so DH's dad, is coming to help out, but is the nicest, least judgemental person - sadly he also has no interests in life at all, and speaks no english, so is also hard work, but in a different way :o)

Can anyone help me come up with coping strategies, so I don't do my usual, which is start explaining why I have a problem with them, wait for Dad to tell me what a selfish/self-absorbed/fat bitch I am, then burst into tears and have to withdraw from the discussion.

thanks in advance, sorry it's an epic, I am getting increasingly wound up by this all!!

I think you sound a bit UR too
you should not have "lent" baby clothes if you didn't expect them to be puked/shat/spat/dribbled on and warn, YABVU to expect things back un-used, just don't "lend" in future, give or don't

Sounds like a break would be best all round, for you from them but also them from you! you all sound toxic to each other, can't be done without breaking a few eggs though so don't expect it to be nice n neat.

Might help to have a bit of space from the sister you get along with too, the temptation to "bitch" about the others will be too great and by doing that you are spending time on them by thinking about them, also it's bad for the soul

thanks creme - I was more disgusted by sister returing stuff unwashed, I didn't expect it back in pristine condition at all. I have cleaned it all anyway, so it's by the by - was more wondering how to grow a backbone and not let parents trample all over me as usual :)

Ignoring all of yoour post but this sentence - your dad calls you a self absorbed fat bitch? Tell him to fuck off - im really sorry, but he sounds just horrible. Concentrate on your family and just let it go over your head. Give them an ultimatum, if they want to see their GC then they need to chane their attitudes, but dont hold your breath he sounds like a cunt - they dont tend to change.

I agree that you should OP and your parents are being UR

but here's the thing, if they have "headspace" then they're still getting at you even if you have zero contact, which is why a short detox from "nice" sister might help

just distance wont do it if you're talking about them with her all the time!

Just put a timer on when you're on the phone, five mins max, (invent something you have to do) and wean it down to a call every two weeks and then every month. and after that don't answer the phone - IF they still call you.

You won't know the difference it makes to be free of people who don't support and love you for you.

And by the way the reason why you as children didn't cry at night, is that you were never comforted and just gave up crying - this is a classic statement from self absorbed, and dare I say it narcissistic, parents.

You sound like you're doing a great job, your relationships with your DH and your sister sound very special and deep - your middle sister sounds like she's playing a bit of your parents' game - is she the golden child in their eyes?

Have a look at narcissism, it might ring a few bells with your birth family dynamic.

Good luck and wishing you happiness!

Ask yourself what message you are sending to your ds when he watches his Mum being treated like that? Are these messages ones that you want your child to take on board?

I can never quite understand the "they are horrible to me but love my children" thing. If they treat the Mum or Dad badly, why on earth would you want them around your children? Children will grow up and start understanding more and more and if your parents have nothing good to say to you or about you, what do you think they will say to your children about you?

I completely agree with tiptop, kids learn how to treat and be treated by what they see (which is another reason to not spend a lot of your time head/space hashing over your parents latest insult with your sis, and enjoy your life instead!)

someone on here gave me a good visualisation for dealing with people who consume your thoughts in a negative way:
when you see them, open a door in your mind, let them yap at you from across the threshold, when the encounter is over, mentally close the door so you don't waste the rest of the day thinking about them
it helps... only a little bit , but it does help!

What Tiptoe said.

If they are toxic to you, they will be toxic for your DC too. If they don't put DC down as they do you, then they will do that other thing that toxic people do: get your own children on side to undermine you.

Cutting contact down to the minimum that is tolerable for you will be best for all of your family.

As for how to do it, practice the following:

• "That's not convenient"
• "I won't be doing that"
• "No."

Imagine what it will feel like to say such things to them (you will probably feel fear of their no-doubt-unreasonable reaction), and then realise that you are an adult now, no longer a child in their thrall, and you can cope with anything they choose to do in reaction to you stating your limits.

Their reaction will be any or all of: rage, guilt-tripping, playing the martyr, throwing blame, bad-mouthing you to others. Let them: it is entirely their choice how they react; you cannot control them by being placating. All you can (and must) do is protect yourself and your DC by being clear about what you will and will not accept.

I think separation will be a good move for you. You are so NBU. The secret to managing it well, I was told by a swanky shrink, is to ease off contact with no fuss, still doing birthdays, Xmas, family dos - but nowt else, and never staying the night.

Altho you may feel like having a row, avoid it - just don't call. When they call, make excuses to cut the talk after a couple of minutes. Parents may sniff something is up, and panic - bullies are very frightened when their target looks like vanishing. This is the hard bit - don't react to that.

Separation from parents is not a magic bullet to happiness. You will feel really sad they aren't better people and at the loss you have had re decent family. But avoiding unhappiness is manageable. I suggest you give it a go.

There's a book called 'The Dance of Anger: A Woman's Guide to Changing the Pattern of Intimate Relationships by Harriet G Lerner (2004)' here which you may find helpful.

It taught me not to 'triangulate' i.e. talk to other family members instead of the person I had a problem with. Talking to your nice sister about it doesn't solve anything, and just reinforces the impact your parents have. You both get a double dose-the crap they put on the other sibling as well as the crap they put on you. Not saying never do it, but reducing the venting to each other may reduce the stress of it all. Sounds counter-intuitive, but it worked for me.

On the other stuff, why not just not contact them so regularly and not seek their help-there's just no point if every chat is just a series of opportunities for them to do you down. That way you get distance and your parenting becomes less of their business. Perhaps beware letting DS have lots of contact with them anyway: if they are this horrid to you and so critical, they are probably going to start communicating this disapproval to your DS, if they don't already. Or he may become a target in his own right-sounds likely if they are disparaging his behaviour so much already.

Oh, the baby clothes thing has been posted before and I disagree with the apparent consensus that returning them unwashed is ok/perfectly understandable/normal. It's revolting. If someone saves you a fortune by lending you a whole lot of baby clothes, the very least you can do is launder them well before giving them back. I mean really.

DH wants to tell them not to come, but agrees with me that it is not fair on DS to limit his contact with beloved grandparents just because they are ghastly to his mother.

seriously?????

just because they are ghastly to his mother? how can both you and your husband think so little of you OP? what do you think your DS is learning from watching that happen?

you say you need to limit contact with your parents, and you are 100% correct in that. but i really want to be blunt with you now, because this sentence ^ in your OP shows me that you both need a reality check.

here's the thing: your DS is a toddler, he will trust and love anyone that comes into his life. he is not a judge of character. do you think that children of abusive parents dislike their parents? no, they adore them. it's what children do.

your parents sound absolutely horrific and exposing your children to them will teach them this: "here's how you have a happy family life kids - take horrific verbal abuse from your parents, and never ever ever pull them up on it. ok? just cry after they're gone. also, let them manipulate all your siblings and rule over you like a despot. and when you have children of your own, make sure they spend time with them and bond with them, so the whole horrible cycle can repeat itself and we can all play insane happy families till Kingdom come."

i think we can both agree that is not good enough. you need to change that, not just cope with it. in terms of strategies, the good news is they are out there.

look out for a book called Toxic Parents. www.amazon.co.uk/Parents-Overcoming-Hurtful-Legacy-Reclaiming/dp/0553814826

both you and DH should read it.

basically both books teach you a) what your rights are when it comes to dealing with your parents, b) what your responsibilities are, c) and how to set boundaries properly in light of (a) and (b).

good luck. you can make the break and have a happier life.

i have recently cut my toxic dad out of my life, he has emotionally abused me all of my life

when my DS was born i stupidly thought he would "change" but of course he didnt, my parents looked after my DS 2 days a week while i was at work,my OH works full time so my mum convinced me they would do a good job of looking after my son

a few months ago when DS was around 19 month old we started noticing bruises round his wrists, then i found out my dad had been trying to teach him to swear, he also walked into MY house and called me a "miserable little fucking shit " infront of guests we had over

i think there comes a time when u no u just cant take it no more

i have read Toxic Parents its worth a read

we havnt spoke for 3 months now and i havnt regretted it for one minute

what i do regret is that i didnt do this sooner,the guilt i feel is unbelievable that i left my son in their care

my dad has no respect for me whatsoever,it sounds like yours doesnt also
my mum is brainwashed by him and has put up with his crap for 34 years

whats important is your family,your family as in in you your OH and DCs,you get to choose who else u allow into your life, if they dont treat you right then cut them out, you owe them nothing

im still not over things as mine is still ongoing

but i feel much happier x

DH wants to tell them not to come, but agrees with me that it is not fair on DS to limit his contact with beloved grandparents just because they are ghastly to his mother.

Nooooooo!!!!!!. This is completely NOT the way to go and your child will learn damaging lessons from them as a result. You will play completely into their hands if you really think this because if they act toxic to you they will act the same to your child. Your DH clearly has no understanding at all of how such emotionally damaged and narcissistic people like your parents operate either.

You and DH need to read Toxic Parents and Toxic Inlaws respectively.

I would also suggest that you read the website entitled Daughters of Narcissitic Mothers.

Just to reinforce what other have said really, but if it needs to be done, it is better to limit their contact with your ds sooner rather than later. IME when he grows older and starts to have opinions of his own that might differ from theirs, they may turn on him as they turned on you. It's confusing and painful and you have my full sympathy.

Wow! Im so sorry for you.