Are we just too different? Another HUGE argument. Another disappointment.

[oreoaddict]

Morning

Me and dp have actually been getting on quite well over the last couple of months(unusual) but over the last few days a storm has clearly been brewing and last night it finally came to a head.

Our dd has issues shall we say and we had had an awful day with her and her behaviour. I had been with her most of the day on my own, but when dp came back from work things didn't improve and he saw how bad things were. After dd went to bed after hours of stress and confrontation, we decided to get a babysitter and go to a local pub for a much deserved drink.

After about half an hour of us trying to calm and sympathise with each other, everything just went horrible. He became unnecessarily defensive, rude and actually just nasty. He has this side to him that when it comes out, I can actually say, at the time, I hate him. I really do. He's just vile to be around and is embarassingly immature. I'm having to constantly stop myself from screaming at him to just get out of my life. The only reason I don't is because this isn't who he is all the time. I went mental in the car on the way home. Everything just came out that I had wanted to say for so long and he told me that i'd really hurt him. All the things which he'd said to me just an hour ealier had apparently just gone out the window.

Why does this keep happening? It's turning into a habbit. Every month or so we have such an enormous argument with insults flying around and it just sounds as though we quite simply hate each other. We don't, so why does this happen?!

I felt last night like he was trying to intimidate me because he was really raising his voice, which he does a lot. He also gives me this stare as if to say "don't mess with me" and i'm furious rather intimidated that he's even trying to intimidate me. This seems to be his nature, but it's getting to the stage where i'm wondering whether me and dd would be better off without him. He would make my life hell if we broke up and would insist on seeing dd whenever he wanted.

Please, what do I do? I don't think i've got it in me to leave. There is no easy option. Every option seems horrenous. I'm so sad today. I just want to know what to do for the best.

Would councelling work for you both?

It must be hard if yours has behavioural issues, you must both already be stressed with that.

I'm already having CBT actually cos I suffer with anxiety and depression so i'm not sure if i would be seen as a drain on the NHS if I then applied for councelling for dp and I.

I have asked him so many times to possibly get some anger management and he agrees that he has a problem and looks into it, but it never gets past that stage.

I would have normally called him by now or sent a really long text, but I just can't bring myself to talk to him. I can't believe that we're still stuck in this miserable place. It seems to be a case of 1 step forward and 3 or 4 back! We can't ever just relax and be happy. He we are, it's really shortlived.

I look at couples laughing and actually looking happy and i'm so jealous and sad that we've not really had that since right at the beginning of our relationship.

Sorry, if we are, not "he we are".

I'm having to constantly stop myself from screaming at him to just get out of my life. The only reason I don't is because this isn't who he is all the time.

Do you think a person has to be vile 100% of the time in order for you to consider leaving them?

No-one is abusive 100% of the time. In fact, abusive people are well-known to be exceedingly charming when they're not actively being vile: it keeps their victim reeled in.

Could this be what is happening here?

I'd like to hear some more details: what does he say or do when he is being what you qualify as vile and immature? In what situations? How are these situations then resolved between the two of you?

I have asked him so many times to possibly get some anger management and he agrees that he has a problem and looks into it, but it never gets past that stage.

How many more times are you willing to ask him? His actions are clearly telling you that he doesn't want to change; he is perfectly content to keep on using anger as a tool to manipulate you.

Does he display oubursts of anger to his boss or co-workers or friends, by the way?

I suffer with anxiety and depression

Anxiety and depression are the well-known result of living with abuse. Your partner is likely to be the cause of your illness.

What does your counselor say about your relationship?

How old is your DD and is she also getting help?

Are your daughter's "issues" exaccerbated by your rows/the atmosphere in the home?

HOT, I know what you're saying and no, I don't believe that an emotional or physical abuser for that matter, has to be abusive all the time. I know that he doesn't want to hurt me and he's utterly ashamed when I admit that he's made me feel uneasy or even scared when he's shouted and that look comes into his eyes. He has a lot of anger inside him, but he will also be the first to put his hands up and say "I was wrong" but you're right, I can't wait around forever whilst the promise to get help for his anger gets broken time and time again. When I tell him he's acting basically like a nob, because he's already in that mind set, he could become more hostile and say something like "shut up" or "f* off" that's if i'm really having a go and letting it all out. It doesn't tend to go that far though. He'll usually just act like a moody teenager and roll his eyes, tut and mutter the odd "yeah yeah" or "if ya like". It's exhausting! Actually, i've always suffered from anxiety and depression. When I was 12 I was on anti depressants and in therapy, both of which were completely useless and if anything made me worse, but that's another story.

dreaming dd's issues are complicated and actually at school(she's 5) she's doing quite well and manages to hold in her meltdowns, usually anyway. It's a good school though and they're working with us. My CB therapist never asks me about things like that. We tend to talk more about controling my anxieties and turn negative thinking into positive etc.

old, I would definitely say that there can be an atmosphere in the house, which i'm completely ashamed of, but we try to keep our issues away from dd as much as we can. To be fair to dp he's actually better at keeping things away from dd than I am. Sometimes i'll bring something up and he'll remind me that it's not the time and he's right. However, dp also raises his voice a lot to dd. He's never smacked her as we decided not to go down that route, but he shouts far too much and I hate to see her face when he's completely lost it.

oreoaddict

Have you written about him previously under a different name?. I ask that only as some details remind me of what someone else has posted before.

TBH if you are going around in circles like this it will affect your DD markedly and it won't do your own mental health any favours.

What are you getting out of this relationship now?. Is the fear of leaving him (you write that he would make your life hell if you were to leave and insist on seeing DD whenever he wanted) keeping you within this anyway?.

I really want to point out though that he would never hurt her. Yes, his approach to her meltdowns aren't always the best, but his biggest crime as far as dd is concerned is shouting at her when she's done something really bad, like hit, bit or scratched.

He would never hurt her physically but he is hurting her mentally and it sounds like he is well out of his depth as are you because you are not getting the support you need. It seems that he cannot or will not properly acknowledge her difficulties. Shouting at her is doing her no favours is it?.

Attila, no I haven't. I guess i'm not the only one in this situation. I know it's not doing my mental health any good and I often feel like my head is going to explode with all this, but on the other hand I don't feel strong enough to call time on it. I don't even know if that's the right thing to do. Our dd would be completely crushed and wouldn't know where she was if we were to break up. Stability and routine is huge for all children, but for our dd it's kind of crucial to her functioning. What if I made the decision to leave and ended up making her life even more difficult?

No, it's not helping in the slightest, but i'm guilty of it too. Especially over the holidays because her behaviour gets worse when she's not at school. I tell myself everyday that i'm going to keep my cool, but then she'll just continuously push my buttons all day and I mean constantly, until I just snap and raise my voice that little bit too much. I genuinely don't know what else to do sometimes, even though I know that what i'm doing isn't helping and if anything, is just making things worse.

OP the man clearly needs to get a grip of his temper. I personally wouldn't go near a "shouty man" and to be honest OP you nor your child shouldn't be either.

No, you are not the only one in such a situation by any means, seeing another woman in this sinking boat of a relationship makes me feel quite sad actually.

What does your man bring into this relationship exactly?.

Your DD is being emotionally crushed by her parents private war. She is not seeing a stable relationship here. What are the two of you teaching her about relationships?. What do you want to teach her about relationships?. This is not an ideal role model for her is it?.

How much more are you going to put up with re your man who from what you write sounds absolutely awful and does not give a toss about either you or his DD. Where is your own tipping point here?.

He does not want to go to AM likely because he does not want to or thinks he has any issue with anger anyway. Does he talk to other people the same as he does you, if not that says an awful lot about him as well. I cannot imagine that your man would readily be counselled in any event. If he does not want to have counselling then go on your own.

What are the root causes of your DDs meltdowns; do you have a medical diagnosis or is she currently under the care of a developmental paed?. What have school said about your DD in a classroom setting?.

Are you staying within this simply because you are afraid that if you leave he will make life even more hard?.

He does sound so difficult to be around. Im not surprised you are exhausted.

You may find that without him around making you tense, you are more relaxed with your daughter, in turn making her more stable.

The fact that he would make your life hell if you left is not the reason to stay. In fact its the reason to leave. A man who would make your life hell is not a good person for you and your daughter to spend your lives with day in day out.

Does your daughter have an emotional problem?

Hi oreo,

re your comment:-
"Especially over the holidays because her behaviour gets worse when she's not at school".

That scenario can also happen because her additional needs at school are not being met. At school she has to conform and bottle up all her frustrations of the school day.

That's interesting atilla

as D os five you should be able to get her into a playscheme. if she is identified as special needs thn she should get a priority place. speak to education and look into playschemes.

is is a myth nto thin shouting is ok an not harming her because she isn ebing hit. of course the whole atmosphere is bad for evereryone.
you need to speak to someone a counsellor etc.

Attila, he does give a toss about us, but he clearly can't control this without a little help. Whether I stay or go, this will always be the case. He can talk to other people the way he talks to me, but he has to be really pushed to the edge. He is self employed and therefore he only has his customers to answer to. To an outsider he's actually quite charming, thoughtful, caring and considerate. I'm not saying that he is never any of those things with me, but they're certainly not characteristics which define him. He can be very caring and thoughtful, but it's rare and I often have to remind him of the very basics such as consideration and tact. He's often mortified when i've explained why what he's said has hurt/upset me or others because he doesn't always understand why what he's said is hurtful. Obvioulsy he knows that yelling and name calling is and there's no way i'm ever going to defend that. It's wrong full stop and he knows it too. Dd has behavioural and emotional problems. Possible ASD, but we're right at the beginning of the assessment process so we've a long way to go.

ASD did cross my mind when reading about your DD and with specific reference to her meltdowns Have you contacted the National Autistic Society?. It may be an idea to keep a daily diary or film her at home playing for when you do see the developmental paediatrician (this is the person she needs to see). How does she play and interact with her peers?. Has he actually accepted the very real possibility here that his DD could be somewhere on the autistic spectrum?. If he is denial of this, this stance will not help either him or her. He is still her father regardless.

I daresay as well that your relationship has been rocky for a long time.
A decent man would support both you and his DD. Not go all aggressive on his partner and mother of his child for no apparant reason.

You have repeatedly asked him to go to AM and he has refused (because he does not want to go). He will not change for you or anyone else. What do you know about him exactly in terms of background and or relationship history?. What are his parents like?. What do your family and friends think of him?.

A man who you think would make your life hell upon leaving is no reason to stay within this. It is a reason to leave. The arguments and a further lowering of self esteem and worth will continue if you stay within this, its a continuous cycle.

Abusive men can be very plausible to those in the outside world and yes abusers are not abusive all the time. If they were, no woman would want to be with them.

Well, put it this way, his dad and I don't get on. He's rude, disrespectful, sexist, racist, immature, the list goes on and on really. The biggest problem I have with him though is the way which he speaks to his wife. I've heard him on several occasions just tell her to shut up and that nobody's interested in what she's got to say. He seems to revel in the fact that he's uneducated and sometimes it seems as though he wants to keep dp down with him. In fact, this came up last night and I just recieved a text from dp about half an hour ago and this is part of it. "I want us to get on like we used to and get that bond back, but if you keep hanging on to this thing with my dad(which is out of my hands)then we can't move forward." He knows his dads basically a tosser, but at the same time he seems to have this kind of connection with him. I think because dp struggled academically at school his dad kind of felt(i think) like they could relate to each other but only if dp didn't improve enormously. Does that make any sense. His daughter(dp's sis) lives in Australia and he never really had a great relationship with her ad I think that was because she didn't struggle in the same way. He couldn't feel powerful or in control because she was more intelligent and clued up than he was/is. So really, she didn't really need him, but at one stage, dp did. Now dp's 100 times more sucessful, intelligent, respectful than his dad is and I don't think he likes it one bit. Like I said before though, there will always be this warped link between them and it makes me so angry to think about it. Believe it or not, I actually love his dad, but at the same time, I utterly resent him.

My girlfriends tend to fancy him when they first see him to be honest and then think he's very charming etc, but the more time they spend with him, the more they see that he can be aggressive etc. My family tend to keep their opinions to themselves, but there have been occasions when my mum and dad have had to step in. For example, when we were still living with them, dp was having a massive go at me and was practically squaring up to me and my mum told him to back off or get out basically. He told her it was non of her business and then my dad told him to watch it or regret it. I ended up having a bloody panic attack. That was my first actually and the worst for that matter. Eventually, he sat us all down and appologised individually and it's never been as bad as that since. That's not to say that I don't still think about it.

Like father, like son. It will be ever thus with these two. Small wonder therefore his sister went to the other side of the world; his Dad seems to hate all women. Your man learnt a lot of damaging stuff from his parents when growing up; he is re-enacting what he saw with them with you now where his mother is. Bullies like his father like to keep everyone down to their level as it makes them feel better about themselves but your DP has a choice. He does not have to be dragged down with or by his Dad into the pit of his own making. Whether your man is actually strong enough to resist his Dad is down to him. It does not sound like he is strong enough and your man needs to realise it is okay not to seek his approval.

Hi oreo,

re your comments in quote marks:-
"My girlfriends tend to fancy him when they first see him to be honest and then think he's very charming etc, but the more time they spend with him, the more they see that he can be aggressive etc".

There's the first red flag for you. As mentioned before abusive men can be very plausible and charming to those in the outside world.

"My family tend to keep their opinions to themselves, but there have been occasions when my mum and dad have had to step in".

You would not likely have listened anyway to any counsel they gave you at that time. He probably made out to your back then that it was you and him shoulder to shoulder against the world.

"For example, when we were still living with them, dp was having a massive go at me and was practically squaring up to me and my mum told him to back off or get out basically. He told her it was non of her business and then my dad told him to watch it or regret it".

He spoke to your mother in exactly the same manner as his dad talks to his long suffering wife. And you still stayed with this man. There are an awful lot of red flags here re your man aren't there?. Says an awful lot about the state of your self esteem as well; he is undoubtedly a factor in your low state now.

He will not change.