I am not responsible for my narc sister's abusive temper and poor impulse control - long and ranty.

[openerofjars]

I have just got off the phone with DSis and right now i feel as that if I never speak to her again it'll be too soon. The minute anything stresses her out, she gets unpleasant and starts freaking out. It is always about her, she lashes out verbally whenever anything isn't to her liking and for the last couple of decades the whole family has tiptoed around her and her lousy interpersonal skills/anger management problems.

We are attending - note, not planning, attending - a relative's birthday party. DSis has had emails about who is bringing what, ideas for food contributions etc. She has not read the emails and now it is all a massive surprise and she is angry that she is expected to muck in with the cooking, providing food etc. She apparently thought that DBil and she would just turn up. To be fair, she lives the furthest away and will be travelling by plane, so can't shop and then bring things, but it's a self-catering affair. Nevertheless, we all have busy lives and she, for example, has no children to bring, is in perfect health, earns a good salary etc. I have offered to pick food up for her to cook as part of the mucking in but this is also stressful and unreasonable of me. How dare I stress her out like this?

I am buying the present and asking for contributions from whoever wants to chip in. This is apparently also stressful for her as she "didn't know" that other people would be joining in on this and now feels that I am forcing her to go out and buy a top-up present so that she has spent more money. This is all my fault for sending emails that she has no time to read.

She hung up on me when I told her not to shoot the messenger and not to speak to me like that. She has now texted to say that she was "just surprised" about the self-catering arrangements etc and has a lot on at work. I bet when work "surprises" her she doesn't feel the need to have a go at her manager in the way that she does for me.

I am starting to feel that it is not worth maintaining a relationship with her. She adores DS and is a very generous aunt to him. I am concerned that as he gets older she will start to include him (and unborn DC2, due in May) in the circle of family members whom she feels entitled to verbally abuse and I am not prepared to let her do this. Thankfully, we only see her every few months or so, as she lives so far away.

I was in a great mood this morning and now I could just cry and I'm feeling shaky from the confrontation, which is not particularly good news for DC2.

Honestly, after years of having to deal with a family member like this, I tend to turn off completely and not engage. If your sister wants to be a prat then it's up to her, it is her who will look daft when she turns up with no food or present, that was her choice.

Wrt your children, i imagine you will make that decision when it comes to it. I have :) Please don't get upset about it, you haven't done anything wrong and she needs to get over herself and realise everything is not about her, unfortunately some people never have the capacity to understand that.

I have a sister a bit like these and sadly we aren't talking. Sadly because I wish she would behave like a grown-up. But she won't and last summer she finally did something I couldn't tolerate. Frankly it's easier not having to deal with her.

I am not responsible for my narc sister's abusive temper and poor impulse control

Indeed you are not. You'll find the right path to tread so long as you hold on to that fact.

Is this the sister who got abusive about visits and not being picked up from an airport a long drive from you? Forgive me if I am mixing you up with another poster.

I am concerned that as he gets older she will start to include him (and unborn DC2, due in May) in the circle of family members whom she feels entitled to verbally abuse and I am not prepared to let her do this.

Either that, or she will enrol them into being "on side" with her and her attempts to undermine you and other family members. Neither outcome is acceptable.

Am curious how you came to this conclusion that she has narc tendencies?

I had a friend like that. On paper the squabbles look petty, but in real life there is some kind of unspoken aggression behind it that makes it very hard to deal with. With my friend I found there was such a propensity to mini-anger-outbursts, petty but nasty digs, and boasting, it gets tiresome and draining. I often felt inexplicably angry and undermined after just being with her for a few hours or talking on the phone. She had her good points e.g. sense of adventure, but I just couldn't deal with the rest.

I don't think there is any real way of "dealing" with it as such ..... Just keeping your distance, and interactions as brief as possible.

Sorry your morning started this way, hope the day improves. Don't let people like that ruin your day.

Thanks, all. I have had a cup of tea and a nice online rant, now all I need to do is call the relative in question and warn them not to try and contact her today unless they want their ears to bleed.

Not me, hotDAMN - she usually organises her own transport (apart from this occasion, where someone else is picking her up from the airport, but that's all nothing to do with me!). Urrgh re on side: I can see that happening. Grim and not something I am going to tolerate. My relationship with my DC is more important than her relationship with her DNs.

jane, this is not a medical diagnosis. However, the temper, the self-importance, lack of empathy, superficial charm, my parents' failure to ever, ever call her on her behaviour etc (so I had to be the "good" one - they picked me up on everything with the result that I have shite self esteem but am Ever So Well-Behaved) chime in well. Example: at Xmas I was 4mo pg and fairly poorly with a virus. I was unable to attend a family party because of this and copped for lovely remarks such as "have you finished malingering yet?" and "you're clearly faking it, you stupid bitch". Nice.

And breathe...

Thanks all again for support.

And actually, I say she adores DS but she does so in small doses and doesn't deal well if he gets arsey with her (he is 3, so par for the course). If he's happy and fun, she's fine. He cries or gets stroppy and she can't deal with it. Hmm.

I don't have any advice, as I am in a similar position with my sister. Sometimes, she is charming, funny and great company, she also adores DD (her niece) and claims to adore DS (although, she can't really handle his ASD and is overly critical of him).

The problem is she is verbally abusive to most of the family, not so much towards me, as I have always walked on eggshells and pretty much agreed with everything she said, however now there are children involved I refuse to accept it and the shit is hitting the fan!

I admit both my parents have issues (very likely aspergers), and when we were growing up they both put their own interests above us. They are trying their hardest to be good grand parents now, and I just want to move on.

She called you a stupid bitch. Among a history of other such delightful behaviour, it seems.

Can you articulate why you still have any kind of relationship with her, despite such words and behaviour?

Because she lives abroad and we rarely see each other, and because I am Nice and Dependable and Dutiful and do not rock boats. If I stopped seeing her, other members of the family would be upset and we can't have that, can we .

Clearly she is not the only person round here in need of years of therapy...

If she lived in the same town I would have cut ties years ago, but as she lives hundreds of miles away I can stand to see her a couple of times a year. But I do not love her despite it all, whereas other family members say "Oh, what is she like? Dear me, she is a bit volatile, isn't she?". I am just tired of dealing with her on her terms now. I also think she is jealous of me having children and is coping badly with it as she has been extra unpleasant during this pregnancy as she is getting less attention despite having a better job, house, more glamorous lifestyle etc and all I have to do to get noticed is get upduffed .

I feel bad now.

What would happen if you stopped being Nice and Dependable and Dutiful and not rocking boats?

By which I mean: so, other people will be upset. And?

Well, other people would be upset. I don't like causing other people to be upset. It upsets them.

I can feel you saying "So?" and if I was reading this I would be straight in with "But it's okay for you to be upset?".

How much is this costing me per hour?

this all sounds very familiar opener - I too have a ghastly sister, and cannot just cut ties with her, for fear of upsetting other people. Seeing her once or twice a year, at family events so she and her twat of a fiance are diluted by other people, is still too often tbh.

can't offer any advice, but can sympathise hugely!

Maybe you need to look at your whole families interactions? She is given the freedom to be awkward, but you have to be dutiful and good, what other roles do people have?
How do people relate when she isn't around? Are you still expected to be dutiful and good?

You have to just rise above her and pretend not to notice her temper tantrums. My sister is exactly the same. The whole world must revolve around her. It is so exhausting spending any length of time in her company as I'm treading on eggshells and have to think of every single thing before I speak in the fear of it being taken the wrong way. She is soooooo prickly and when I'm in her company I just feel so tense. Even my kids watch what they say as she spends her life correcting them on their speech/manners/behaviour etc etc. My dh just avoids her. If he knows she's coming round he disappears and if she appears unannouced he suddenly runs off to do the jobs I've been nagging him to do for months . If it helps my best friend's sister is exactly the same!

What mummytime wrote.

You cannot have any sort of relationship with a narcissist; it simply does not work. Also such people do and say awful things very readily. Our particular narcissist within the family fortunately cut us off so we no longer have to deal with him.

I don't mean to upset you but you or the person having the party expects your sister to fly from abroad and then cook some food to supply for a party, sounds very strange to me. Are you expecting her to come to your house to cook the food. I live abroad from my family and if invited to a party would think it very odd to have to get off a plane and then buy some food and have to cook it. Fine if you asked her to bring some wine soft drinks or contribute money to food if that is the way your family runs things. but travelling from overseas and then being expected to cook a something for a party is a bit strange.

Why have you been invlolved in telling her what to do, why hasn't the relative having the party done this.

Sorry if she was rude to you, no you are not responsible for behaviour, I think you should have just told whoevers party it was that you would not get involved with telling your sister what to do and that if they wanted her to bring something it was up to them to do it themselves.

Sorry if I have offended, not my intention.

This thread is interesting to me because your sister sounds like I imagine DS1 could be when grown up (at least with his nearest and dearest). He has very poor self-control and anger management and always blames others for his mishaps, he also is highly resistant to requests to help others or do things for himself. He is well behaved at school.

I Do tackle him about his behaviour but I would spend all day fighting with him and have no chance of having any warmth in our relationship if I picked him up on everything he does. Staying calm and making repeated but gentle attempts to make him see things from other peoples point of view means that he at least makes genuine apologies for some of his behaviour these days.

I don't think I have caused this (although I have not always handled it well), I think he was born hard work, sadly. I cope by taking the long view and accepting two steps forward, one step back. I do worry that his brothers will not want to spend time with him when they are grown-up which is a sad thought.

Well, Pinkie, I sort of agree, but surely the answer is to say all that politely then offer some alternative, e.g. offer £ towards food, or just buy a giant Toblerone at the airport, not be nasty and abusive to the OP.

But I do agree with your second point. In future OP, let other family members cop it from her while you stay out of it. I wouldn't accept any role that involved me being the one to contact her. Since your parents are prepared to accomodate her every tantrum, they can do it!

Pinkiemum, none taken! To clarify, and out myself totally , it's a self catering weekend, Friday to Sunday, not just one meal, as it's a special birthday, and everyone coming has been invited to contribute by joining in with the cooking in a fun, communal way etc. It's in a venue hired for the event, and all accommodation is paid for, so she won't have to pay to stay, just contribute a bit to a couple of meals (not breakfasts, general tea/coffee/snacks etc). So she is basically miffed that it's not all totally free of any effort or cost to her (aside from travel and believe me, she can afford it) despite the fact that it is costing the host an absolute fortune. We earn less than her, have 1 DC and DC2 due very soon, and I'm not screaming down the phone at anyone although I am ranting like a loon on here . Sorry I didn't make it clear.

The relative is one of our parents, btw, but I was trying not to either out myself or drip feed and got a bit tied in knots.

I got involved like a fool because she called me for a rant, because she hasn't replied to any of the emails about food, present, transport etc, not even the one offering her a lift from the airport and because I am organising the big joint birthday present (mm, big joint...).

She (Dsis) thinks we get on brilliantly, by the way.

That puts a whole different perspective on it, I thought you meant a party not weekend together away.

I think you are lucky she lives abroad, It makes me so happy that I live a long way away from my family as I do not have to deal with them or the things that upset me about them very often.

Hope you can enjoy your weekend away

I have nothing to do with my sister who is quite similar. Tbf I cut off the rest of the family as well. It had got to the stage where I couldn't have even a basic conversation with her without her having a tantrum/making up lies.

With ds she was terrible/dangerous though my parents refused to accept this as she was their golden child. But it was interesting to see how by the age of 3yo he was emotionally/behaviourally outgrowing her (in her 20s). In fact having children has demonstrated very clearly to me that a lot of my family have not yet outgrown toddler behaviours .

What made me sad though and still makes me feel guilty to a certain extent is that she is clearly very depressed and also she wasn't always like this, at least not to this extent. She was made this way by how my parents treated her. And now as an adult is responsible for her own behaviour. I cannot save her or make her change her behaviour when she thinks she does nothing wrong. And neither can you. As adults the only people who are responsible for our behaviour are ourselves. I learnt that this meant me as well as them and that I needed to work on my insecurity/anxiety/inferiority complex etc as well (though it took a breakdown before that happened).

and mumsnettiness be damned