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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How can I resolve this? (relationship with Mum)

31 replies

MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 10:18

I had a baby just before Christmas and DM who lives in another country came to stay, I originally said that for Christmas I wanted to go to ILs this year, the first for about 5, as I was taking this year off doing Christmas. DM told me she had nowhere to go as my DB was spending it with his Gfs family,this turned out not to be true she hadn't asked, I said DM could come. At the time I felt very pushed into it, I knew her staying for such a long time was going to cause problems. I offered that rather than stay with us I arrange an apartment for her to stay in but she declined.

So she arrived, she as usual criticised everything about me, my friends looked chavvy, my house looked scruffy none of these are true, she ignores me and throws herself in with the dc, she adores them but it's always very clear that she only really tolerates me so as she can be with the dc who she then treats as if she is the parent unless they require disciplining and then she refers them back to me. So i'd just had a baby I was sore and at one point I developed really severe pain which turned out to be retained placenta I told her I was really ill and that I think I was going to take some of the codeine the hospital had given me, her response was ' oh please don't think of the poor baby' ( I was bf), she helped with the dc but left me to make food for everyone clean up after everyone(she creates an unbelievable mess) and Dh spends most of the time cleaning up behind her. On boxing day she starts to put up some shelves in dds room because she wanted to not because we wanted her to, causing absolute chaos and dh spends the whole day having to sort it out when she can't do the job but has covered the whole down stairs in cardboard and crap.

I had said that I wasn't doing any of the family Christmas stuff but she railroaded me into having my grandparents over, she had fallen out with them and they weren't speaking, for dinner said she'd cook I told her the oven was broken and wouldn't cook only heat so just go buy easy buffet type food but instead she arrives home with about £100 worth of lovely Sunday roast stuff that needs to be properly cooked. I again tell her that it doesn't work she says yes but you cooked a ham yesterday, I say no I cooked that in the slow cooker, so dh spend the whole day looking after my grandparents whilst she figures out ways to make dinner, takes our oven apart screws and all and completely breaks the whole cooker, dh and I then have to go and sort out the mess me constantly on edge because I can tell how wound up dh is.

Anyway this is all back story,normal from her, sorry this is so long. The main issues were that one night she took the baby from me and was asleep on the sofa with dd on her chest, I was in the room, when she woke up I explained that it's important not to sleep with dd on the sofa due to the risk of cot death. The next night I had been cooking I come into the room, she has polished off half a bottle of wine and is laying on the sofa with her eyes closed and the baby asleep on her I was so angry that I shouted at her, she refused to apologise just saying she wasn't asleep and that if I didn't believe her that was my problem. The other thing was that she told me that my older children had told her I was a really grumpy mum, they are 7 and 4, they had told her this when I was 7 months pregnant, working and finishing my Msc and she had taken them to stay at her house. It really upset me because i'm sure it was a passing comment from them but she brought it to me like a problem that needed fixing, I'd a week old baby and the timing was terribleSad.

She was due to come and see the baby again when she was a month but just before she was due I rang her to ask her something and she ended up shouting at me down the phone telling me I never listen. I was calm but upset and just felt it was the final straw. I emailed her that we had some boundary issues that needed sorting out before she came to stay again but said I didn't want to get into petty who did what, she said what issues Hmm I said the above, she basically said that I was always a difficult child she had never forgotten my behaviour as a teen and would never be able to forgive me, I got angry and said that any bad behaviour as a child was as a direct result of her dysfunctional parenting. In the words of my brother 'what have you done, what, what have you done?' she has refused to speak to me hasn't seen the dc, missed out on the baby. I feel like the really bad child, I'm anxious, panicky and I don't know what to do and I know I'm going to have this thrown back at me in the future. My DM is really, really good at conflict she has always fallen out with somebody, didn't speak to my brother for 6 months. At all the big moments in my life she has caused huge rows so as they are all tainted with these issues, she told me my wedding was the worst day of Her life. That when dd1 was small the reason she cried was because I obviously didn't have enough milk for her as she had counted what I had dranknin a day and it clearly wasn't enough. She takes baths with my dc, I asked her not to she does it anyway the list is endless.

I can't stand it but they're are so many issues I don't think I can ignore them when she carries on to treating me so badly. If I could cut her out and then forget about her then that would be the answer but the not talking is almost as bad as taking the shit. What do I do? My dad says she'll never change and that I just need to distance myself but it's not that easy, she is on her own and I feel so guilty. Thanks for reading to the end, it probably all sounds so trivial and petty but hard to explain.

OP posts:
MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 10:19

Bloody hell that's an essay and Iwas trying to be restrained Grin

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Shakey1500 · 20/03/2012 10:25

It doesn't sound trivial at all. She sounds a bloody nightmare and I certainly couldn't have been as restrained as you've been. I think you're Dad's right, distance is the key. Tell her you still want a relationship with her but there has to be some MAJOR changes. Your DH must have the patience of a saint Grin

Where is your Dad in all of this? Are your parents still together?

HotDAMNlifeisgood · 20/03/2012 10:28

How can I resolve this?

You can't resolve it on your own: it takes two. She'll need to be willing to hear you out, and acknowledge your feelings, as well as her responsibility for her own actions.

Can she do that?

You might also usefully nose through the resources on page 1 of the Stately Homes thread.

MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 10:33

No my parents split up when I was 10, it was all very messy. DM made me a confidante blamed my dad, I didn't have a relationship with him until I was an adult. But we get on very well now and he is nice to have around. He would never get involved because he is scared of my DM the wuss.

DH is incredibly patient and it's only since meeting him I realise how insane my relationship with DM is and now I feel like I'm caught between the 2 although dh never asks me to be. She is incredibly rude to him.

He keeps reminding me that the distance is her choice, I offered her a way of sorting this out and she chose conflict. It's making me so sad though.

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MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 10:36

Hotdamn I'll have a look, is it the original one I need to find?

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HotDAMNlifeisgood · 20/03/2012 10:39

No, the latest thread will do; lots of links in the first few posts - I've put the main ones on here for you too.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/03/2012 10:41

Your Dad is right; she will never change. She also has not been and will never be the kind mother you want her to be and admit to her wrongdoings. She will never apologise not accept any responsibility for her actions.

It is NOT your fault she is like this; her own birth family likely did that to her. It is also OK for you not to seek her approval any more and it is also OK for you to say no more. You and your family do not have to accept her abusive treatment of you all any more; why is she taking baths with your DC?. This woman does not know the meaning of the word boundary and has no interest in putting any of this right.

What does your H think of her?.

She keeps going back to you because you're the only one who now puts up with her; I note she has fallen out with other relatives as well. Am I surprised to read that - well no. Your mother does not feel guilty for putting you through all this.

Many adults who were children of such toxic parents often have FOG - fear, obligation, guilt. How you are feeling therefore towards her is certainly not unusual at all. BTW I would not let your Dad off the hook here either because many men in such situations act as the bystander out of self preservation and want of a quiet life.

Would suggest you visit the "well we took you to Stately Homes" thread on these pages and post on that thread as you will get more support that way too. Read "Toxic Parents" written by Susan Forward as well.

ClaireFromWork · 20/03/2012 10:43

End the relationship. She's toxic.

MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 10:52

I have just read the first page from the thread about Toxic mothers and her email back to me had literally all of the responses in it 'you were so bad', 'I had it so hard' 'look at what I do for you'.

Her favourite tale to tell about me is that I was such a bad child that when I was 2 she would lock herself in the bathroom to get away from me and I would cry and kick the door Sad.

I can understand how women with abusive dh's struggle to leave, I carry on hoping that she'll change, that I can ignore the bad stuff because of the good stuff but I'm exhausted.

Her own father was very physically abusive, she measured her own parenting on the fact that she never hit us.

With regards to my Dad, he isn't totally off the hook, I've very aware he has a vested intreats in this and is trying to redeem his own bad behaviour but he has apologised for it and asked if we can try and make things better, he is respectful. I would never rely on him because I know that he always outs himself first, butbhe's nice to have around occasionally.

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AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/03/2012 11:14

Hi Mrs deM,

re your comment:-
" I carry on hoping that she'll change, that I can ignore the bad stuff because of the good stuff but I'm exhausted".

Not surprised to read you're exhausted. Your mother is toxic, this is what such damaged people do to others.

What good stuff however?. She tramples on and over any boundaries you set. Like many children of such an abusive parent you hope against hope that they will see the light one day. Well they do not. You are going to have to let go of hoping that she will change because she will not do so for you or anyone else. Counselling for you would be an option that you may want to consider; BACP are good and do not charge the earth.

Re this comment:-
"Her own father was very physically abusive, she measured her own parenting on the fact that she never hit us"
Thought she had an abusive childhood and she became an abuser herself because she did not know any different when growing up.

HotDAMNlifeisgood · 20/03/2012 11:17

Her favourite tale to tell about me is that I was such a bad child that when I was 2 she would lock herself in the bathroom to get away from me and I would cry and kick the door

I am sad for the child you were.

I can understand how women with abusive dh's struggle to leave, I carry on hoping that she'll change, that I can ignore the bad stuff because of the good stuff but I'm exhausted.

Yup. All the women I've met on here because of their abusive Hs/Ps have eventually understood that their mothers were the same: we were trained for it from birth. There is strong overlap between the Stately Homes thread and the Abusive Relationship support thread. So the connection you make between the two is very very apt.

MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 11:37

Atilla, this exactly it, she has always told us how badly she had it in order to demonstrate that although we too had it bad, she had it worse and that in a way my DB had a responsibility to her to provide her with a better family.

She adores my dc and they love her, in a way what she likes about them is that they're well behaved, well educated, polite attractive children, she feels she can credit herself in this as if my brother and I were just blips almost like she some how got the wrong children. My dc are like this because they come from a pretty stable family.

She has created the fear in me that I am somehow not good enough, that my dh will tire of me because I'm emotionally such hard work so damaged. I worry that it's in built in me, almost genetic and that sooner or later or even subconsciously that I will treat my children the same way.

I have seen on facebook, she has arranged a lunch date with my childhood best friend. She is creating allies.

Thanks for all of the book recommendations, I have bought Toxic parents, I need to feel better about all of this. I'm on Mat leave with my beautiful dd and when I should be happiest I just feel so sadSad

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AttilaTheMeerkat · 20/03/2012 12:11

Hi Mrs deM,

re your comment:-

"I worry that it's in built in me, almost genetic and that sooner or later or even subconsciously that I will treat my children the same way.

This is a common fear expressed by those who have toxic parents.

No you won't actually become like your mother because you have qualities that your mother never had or has - insight and empathy being just two. You also realise that your mother's abusive treatment of you is just plain wrong and you would not dream of treating your children in the ways you were yourself mistreated as a child.

Would protect your children from your mother as well; she could too easily start on them.

AgathaFusty · 20/03/2012 12:11

MdM so much of what you say about your mother strikes a chord with my mother's behaviour. Especially in your last post - "she is creating allies". My mother likes to have a 'surrogate child' (a lovely son or daughter who treats her like her own failed daughter never does) to wave around under my nose. It is one of the things that no longer has any effect on me, although I don't think she realises that yet Grin.

Attila's comments make such good sense - the best way forward is distance/no contact. That is hard though. For me, minimal contact has helped.

I would hide/block your mother from facebook. You really don't need to be tormented by her on there.

tb · 20/03/2012 19:32

If she had been a friend that treated you like that, would you continue to have her in your life? NO (sorry to shout).

I would keep the contact to a minimum - ie send chatty emails, but refuse all offers from her to come and stay with you. Decorating, oven broken, not convenient etc etc and practise saying 'no' to her.

Easier said than done, I know. However, with baby steps, you will be able, eventually, to have the relationship you want. Even if that's none.

MrsdeMontford · 20/03/2012 21:56

Well I bought the Toxic parents book on kindle and have most of the day reading it, it makes a lot of sense. So many feelings about my shit childhood have come to the surface since all of this started although I feel desperately unhappy at the moment I hope that I'll be able to overcome this I need to lose this guilt, she chose this life, I'm not obligated to her because she is my mother. Even as I say this I'm cringing because I'm so scared of the fall out, she's going to be so cross with me.

She is so good at making me feel guilty about any feelings I have after all she always had it so much worse, she did her best Hmm she was young, i'm her best friend etc etc

Thanks everyone for the support, I'm going to work my way through the list of recommended reading. It's nice to know my feelings are valid.

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Pippa5l · 21/03/2012 11:12

Hot damned, Ive just read through your recs and ordered the book Children of the self absorbed. Sorry to have hijacked and butted in but OMG its like reading the story of my life !! Ill but out now but those recs are brilliant !! Thanks

HotDAMNlifeisgood · 21/03/2012 12:05

Glad you're finding it useful, Pippa.

MrsdeM your comments are as ever very astute. Yes, she made her own choices; even though she is a hurt and damaged person too, it never entitled her to take it out on others. Especially not her own children.

Yes, there will be fallout when you start enforcing your boundaries, and she will be cross. She has engineered - and gotten used to - a situation where you do not dare to pull her up on bad behaviour, so once you start being firmer about what you will and will not tolerate, her usual tactics of blame, denial, rage, and 'poor me' will be stepped up. After all, they've been working well for her so far.

It is frankly unlikely that she will ever change. If you're lucky, and very firm and very consistent in your boundaries, then you may achieve a situation where she understands she's not to push you, although she'll never accept that this is a reasonable position on your part.

MrsdeMontford · 21/03/2012 13:14

Oh Dear, I've emailed her, I'm waiting for a response I'm sure it will be nasty. I basically told her where I'm at and letting her know that just because I'm not having her to stay does not mean she has to end her relationship with the children. that way I can't be blamed for that too.

I was In sainsburys and started to have a panic attack, I haven't had one of those since I was a teen, nightmare, but on the plus side I've lost 5lb through sheer anxiety, silver lining and all that Grin

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MrsdeMontford · 21/03/2012 13:15

Pippa, hijack away, it's nice to know I'm not alone Smile

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CailinDana · 21/03/2012 13:31

MrsdeM, in your position I would only allow her to see the children for short periods, and only ever in your presence. I also would not allow her to bathe with the children.
She was abusive towards you and there is every danger that the she will be abusive towards your children.

HotDAMNlifeisgood · 21/03/2012 13:32

MrsdDeM if you're having panic attacks and losing weight, would you consider speaking to a RL person - a therapist - about the emotions you're uncovering right now?

I swear it helps. Keeping to yourself things that are so HUGE in your emotional landscape can be very debilitating. It does make the process easier to get it out in the open, with a professional who is unconnected to you and can guide you with pertinent questions and tools to cope.

MrsdeMontford · 21/03/2012 13:37

That is all it would be for, baby still BF so would never leave them. I don't think she would be abusive to them, she is so low level with me individually it hardly registers but over the years it has all built up. She likes my dc, they are good, normal children to her, not like myself and my brother, bad children that we are, nothing to do with her Hmm

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CailinDana · 21/03/2012 13:45

Just remember MrsDeM that you're your own person now, you have no obligation whatsoever to your mother. You need not feel guilty or ashamed of limiting contact with her. It is sensible to protect yourself and your family from an abusive person.