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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

H swore at me again - this is what I want him to know

22 replies

anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 12:00

Namechanger here. Have a good relationship with H, but recently he started swearing at me during arguments. I won't tolerate it.

For work-related reasons I can't speak to him face to face just yet, so this is what I thought I could put in an e-mail:

Dear H,

I find it unacceptable to be sworn at. If I was at work and you called me 'fucking useless' it would he considered verbal abuse. It is still verbal abuse even if I am your wife and you won't be exactly prosecuted for it.

It is unacceptable. I will not be sworn at.

I find it sad to even have to make you aware that this is an issue but clearly you have problem controlling your language when it comes to addressing me. It is the second time this week we have this issue, which I find shocking in itself. I will not have DS listen to his mother being treated with so little respect by his father. You don't swear at anyone else, what on earth makes you think this is in any way excusable towards me?

This cannot happen again. I don't expect an apology and am not even particularly angry - but I need you to understand it can never happen again, regardless of the disagreements we may be having.

I hope I made myself clear.

Love,

xxx

MNetters, what do you think? Is it a good idea to send it or should I wait until this evening? Argh, how I hate having to spell it out for him at all.

OP posts:
mojitomania · 15/03/2012 12:09

Umm. This sounds a bit "formal" to be honest. Did you lay it on the line with him the first time and feel he didn't listen to you?

CogitoErgoSometimes · 15/03/2012 12:14

Don't send an e-mail - it looks silly. Just say, very firmly, to his face 'Swearing at me is unacceptable'. Demand an apology, demand to be treated with more respect in future and say that, if it continues, your relationship is at risk.

PurplePidjin · 15/03/2012 12:15

I would wait for the evening, tbh. Can you distract yourself with work, maybe have a coffee or lunch with a colleague, and deal with it Ice Queen style once the dc are in bed?

I think receiving an email like that during working hours would just get most people on the defensive. If you wait til this evening, you have the element of surprise on your side

anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 12:16

Thanks for replying mojito. Yes, I always call him on it at the time and tell him in no uncertain terms to stop swearing at me as it is unacceptable. What would you say to make it less formal?

OP posts:
anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 12:19

X-posted. OK, I won't send it. But I don't think the conversation will be a surprise. Cogito, why do you think what I had to say looks silly?

OP posts:
TheMightyLois · 15/03/2012 12:20

I've had similar in the past - DP swearing at me during arguments. Saying something at the time did nothing as tempers were raised and it didn't make a difference. Just have a quick chat when all is calm.

mojitomania · 15/03/2012 12:21

So, he's done it quite a lot then OP and not just twice?

Hassled · 15/03/2012 12:23

I think you should send it. If you have "the talk", he's much more likely to dismiss it/not really listen. Seeing it in black and white might make him pause for thought and register what's going on.

I don't understand why you don't want an apology, though. You deserve one.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 15/03/2012 12:26

Not the content. I think e-mails, texts and phone calls are just generally a poor way for partners to communicate important things. Face to face, direct, so that you can communicate in total... voice, face, body-language... and also see his reaction. An e-mail can be met with a shrug of the shoulders and a dismissive laugh and you'd never know.

anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 12:27

Mojito, no, not a lot. We seldom argue, but every now and then he does swear when he loses it. Twice in the last week, which made me think I need to tackle it clearly head on outside of an argument. I don't want this to be his normal way of addressing me and, as Lois mentioned, saying something at the time falls on deaf ears.

OP posts:
TheMightyLois · 15/03/2012 12:29

Does he swear at you, or just swear in the context of the argument?

CogitoErgoSometimes · 15/03/2012 12:32

If saying something at the time falls on deaf ears, an e-mail won't improve on that. If it's very important that this stops I think you have to raise the ante and explain how his behaviour is going to negatively affect him if it carries on i.e. some kind of threat, rather than explaining how it affects you and expecting sympathy.

anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 12:33

Regarding an apology: of course I know that I deserve one. But he apologised in the past and then did it again. I am not interested in a 'sorry', I am interested in a change in his behaviour. I guess I am scared of the nasty-nice cycle, which I saw before once or twice (not with H).

Thanks for all the replies. This thread is really helping.

OP posts:
anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 12:37

Cogito, I can see what you are saying. But, for me, I deserve a partner who can show empathy without an ultimatum or a threat. He should want to treat me with respect, not do it out of fear of losing me. I don't call him a cunt not because I am scared he will leave/withdraw affection, but because I don't want to hurt him. I expect the same.

Lois, this week he once said 'fuck you' and last night called me 'fucking useless'. He is definitely swearing at me.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 15/03/2012 13:21

You deserve an empathetic, loving partner but what you've got is one that knows verbal abuse hurts your feelings and doesn't really care. You being upset or 'sad', as you put in your letter, carries no weight whatsoever. There is no consequence to his behaviour beyond you getting upset (and, as we've already established, that isn't important to him). There is no incentive for him to change. He is not worried about losing you. Your definition of an affectionate relationship where people don't deliberately hurt each other is not matched by his.

So either you change tactics, show a bit of strength and force him to change behaviour, or you carry on as you are and continue to get verbally abused.

doctordwt · 15/03/2012 13:29

I think given that you've tried already, the more formal email approach might be useful - not least because he'll be reading that when he's not angry, so it may sink in a bit more.

The one thing I think is missing from your email is the idea of consequences - because THAT is what will hit home. Especially if it's approached in such a way that it sounds real, iyswim.

'You need to know something here. If you keep on swearing at me in arguments, you are (to me) telling me that you think it's fine to insult me, that I'm not worth that much to you, that you don't respect me. That's the message you are giving me. If you give me that message too many times, I will start to believe it, and I will at some point stop loving you and stop wanting to share my life with you. I don't want to start looking forward to a life without you in it because you make me feel like dirt. But it will happen unless this stops. You would do well to remember this, it is a warning.'

Something like that.

Make him frightened of where he could take your relationship.

Good luck.

mojitomania · 15/03/2012 13:55

At the end of the day OP if it would make "you" feel better and more assertive then send it.

formerdiva · 15/03/2012 14:08

My DH used to speak to me in quite a critical way, which I think was a reflection of the family interaction he'd grown up with. I'd snipe back at him, and it was a pretty nasty destructive cycle.

After a while, we sat down and had a very calm conversation about how we both felt. He was surprised that I took it so personally, and I was surprised at some of the things he found hurtful that I'd said.

That was about 8 years ago, and things changed overnight for the better - we just seem to be a lot kinder to each other now. If I could give some advice, it would be to discuss this calmly with him, without the anger of your email. If he does care about your feelings I think this will have a much bigger impact. But consider it a yellow card, and should it happen after that I think your email would be an option.

Snowsister · 15/03/2012 14:11

What are you arguing about op? Are you scared of him? Why do you think he does this?

The email is a good idea as you can send him the message without being in the middle of an argument. Keep it short and to the point. Agree with the poster who said to spell out the consequence.

anotherwifewithaswearingh · 15/03/2012 20:10

Snowsister, I am certainly not scared of H. We don't argue very often, but when we do it is about petty things when both under pressure. I think last one was about picking DS up from PILs. We both had work to do for a deadline that day and we both assumed that the other would go and get DS (lack of communication on both sides). Cue an argument 10 minutes before pick-up time. I went passive-aggressive, he swore. Not a big deal, if it was not for the swearing.

I think he does it because he has a bit of a temper and because he saw his parents interact in exactly the same way - to this day PILs have exchanges which I would call abusive, but it seems to work for them, so it is none of my business. For years DH did not think they loved each other at all because of the way they spoke to each other. I tend to see the softer side of them a lot more than he does. I think in that way he is similar to formerdiva's DH, and, as much as I can understand why he swears at me, it is still no excuse and it needs to stop.

In that sense, I am obviously more likely to agree with formerdiva's inferred opinion of my H (as in, ultimately caring but carrying around some baggage from watching his parents scream at each other throughout his childhood and beyond), than with cogito's (as in, callous uncaring bastard, who does not care about my feelings).

It is perfectly possible that I am experiencing cognitive dissonance wrt H and that he is in fact an uncaring fuckwit, who hurts me on purpose. I would not be the first one to fool myself. If I really believed that, however, I would not have any interest in trying to enter into power games and ultimatums, I would be packing mine and DS's bags. Not having a similar idea of what constitutes a caring relationship would be a deal-breaker. What would be the point of staying with someone who is cruel, even if I could force him to change his behaviour? However, based on previous experience, when asked specifically to stop certain behaviours because they were hurting me, H always would. I just need to communicate these requests very clearly, which is why this thread was so helpful in thinking them through.

I suppose that is the disappointing part for me of the whole sorry saga. Why does a grown, intelligent and otherwise sensitive man need pointing out that telling his wife to fuck herself is not on?

Still, I did point it out to him. I did not send the e-mail, but we talked and cleared the air a bit. He understood that for me the swearing was not a minor annoyance, which one could put up with because it is insignificant, but a major sign of disrespect, which I would not tolerate. In that respect, doctordwt's suggestions for what to say really helped me to reconnect with my feelings. Thank you.

In fact, many thanks to everyone who took the time to post and sorry for this rather verbose response. This thread really helped me work through my feelings Thanks.

OP posts:
bubbles1510 · 15/03/2012 21:01

I was called names and sworn at daily by my exh, however he used a word that used to really hurt me so one day I calmly asked him how he would feel should anyone ever call his daughters that - never called that name again.

Hope you sort something xxxx

ImperialBlether · 15/03/2012 21:50

OP, you said, "For years DH did not think they loved each other at all because of the way they spoke to each other."

If he swears at you again, at the next possible opportunity, say, "I remember you telling me that you didn't think your parents loved each other because of the way they spoke to each other. Can you not understand why, when you swear at me, I think you don't care for me?"

From what you say, it's only happened a couple of times. If it continues, send him the email, but add on what doctordwt said. If he continues to take no notice, you have to look at where your marriage is going, I'm afraid.

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