How do we break this cycle?

[DisparateHousewife]

Dh and I have 2 dc. Our lives are busy, but no more than most - dh runs his own company, I work part time, the dc have various after school and weekend clubs through which we've met friends we socialise with. We travel to see family every other weekend.

None of us is happy. The dc would watch tv all day and don't do anything unless we get cross and warn them we'll take privileges away. They are 12 and 8, so quite capable of doing small chores as part of the family. Instead they fuss, moan, argue and bicker. Every. Single. Day. They don't have any common sense and don't seem to be any more mature than when they were little - eg I had a kettle of boiling water to put onto the hob, ds was swinging his arms around in the kitchen, I warned him to stop and move out of the way so he walked towards the hob, where he knew I was heading. When they do actually do chores (put the bins out, unload the dishwasher, nothing too onerous I think) they do it so badly I end up having to re-do it. Yesterday they put the recycling out with the bags open so the wind blew everything all over the drive so dh had to go and do it properly. This type of thing is an every day occurrence. We tell them, they say sorry, then the next time it happens again. It's like groundhog day.

We are worn down, which leads to dh and I snapping at each other because we've run out of patience. I'd like to get in my car and go to a deserted island, I cannot see many positives at the moment, although I know I'm lucky to have a job, a home, healthy children. How do I change things (including myself) to make things happier? I don't want to be the sort of mother who wishes every school holiday would end so the kids would be out of the way.

Can't you make them go and pick up the rubbish, keep on until the ob is done properly?

it sounds as if you have too much on.. Set aside a weekend to do nothing but be together. Then divide up the chores and aim to have all done by a certain point. Then have a treat planned, cinema, park, trip out somewhere.

Come home and cook and clear up dinner together. Have two teams and take it in turn to cook for each other and judge the winner. The team that doesn't cook, clears up!

Seriously though, at that age, children should be keeping their own room tidy, can hoover, clear up the kitchen and do most jobs well enough to pass muster. My two boys, now 14 and 10 were trained early to do simple cooking and make a good cup of tea!

Good luck.

job, not ob!

how far is the travel every oerh weeken? sounds quite onerous!

if they doing lots of clubs and activities then not surprised they want to chill in front of tv when they a t home...

the sugestion to do things together is good one a walk, cinema etc

I had this at one stage with my kids, and of course it still isnt perfect, but better.

The keys seem to be:

• consistency eg dont let them off because you cant be bothered

-nice words and odd complements when they get it right

-ALWAYS send them back when they have done it wrong or too quickly ie let them own the problem dont allow them to reward themselves with a shoddy effort).

eg I look in bedrooms on the way downstairs (four storey house, and I am a bit asthmatic) and check for cups, plates, laundry. I LEAVE it there, and ask them if they have brought it down. They say yes, and I point out otherwise, and then they have to get it there and then.

I find the first thing most difficult, but after a year of no results and constant arguing about the same issue eg the dishwasher, I worked out that a month consistency was better than a year of hassle.

Thanks for the replies. Our family live an hour away, so by the time we get there, have lunch, chat and return most of the day has gone.

I agree, we do tend to huff and puff and say "I may as well do it myself" which the kids don't care about as it lets them off the hook but builds resentment.

I do think we've got too many "have to" in our life - at the moment there's only 1 day in the week when we have no commitments to drive the kids to clubs/matches etc. It's wearing us down.

Do you think a rota would work if we worked it out together who did what?

Travelling every second weekend to see family sounds like too much to me. Perhaps you all need some downtime. Your children might be whingy and unwilling due to tiredness and a need to just relax for a while.

As for the chores, sorry to say but you'll have to gather all your energy, set your mind to it and be very very firm with them. There's no way on earth your DH should have gone out and sorted out their mess for them, he should have rounded them up and marched them up to tidy the rubbish themselves. If they can't do jobs properly, then you'll have to stand over them until they do do it properly. So with filling the dishwasher, the deal would be that they fill it and then call you to check it. If it's wrong, they'll have to unload it and redo it themselves. The fact that if they do it wrong the job will take twice as long will be motivation enough for them to do it right. Whinging and moaning gets no response. You just repeat that the job must be done properly and they're not leaving till it's done. Hopefully you'll only have to do that a few times before it'll sink in that it's easier to just do it right the first time.

Make sure they have some genuine downtime in the week - time where they can just slob and do nothing. Everyone needs that, including you. Trying to occupy them all the time will make them exhausted and grumpy and will only increase the bickering and fuss.

From your last post it sounds like you all have way too much going on. Time to cut down, definitely.

The rota system won't work just yet, I think. At the moment the children are still at the stage where they can't take responsibility for jobs. For the time being you're going to have to orchestrate everything personally, which I know is a massive pain in the ass, but it'll pay off eventually when you can rely on them to do the jobs properly. Then a rota would be a good idea.

Incidentally I think the age gap might a problem, in the sense that the 8 year old probably doesn't do as much as the 12 year old. Don't get them to do jobs together as this will only piss the 12 year old off as he'll have to pick up the slack. Get them to do separate things, with easier jobs for the younger one.

Agree with caitlindana re separate jobs. Its a big issue in out house who does what, and age issues.

Could you also review the afterschool and other events? I may not be popular for saying this, but as someone who also has a 32 year old from a previous relationship, I am firmly of the view that there is way too much pressure on both parents and kids re out of school activities. They do not grow up fucked up because they dont participate in everything.

It is practically a middle class disease these days, and exhausted parents are run ragged servicing them. I think that with two children this should not be a nightly thing, plus every weekend.

Do you think that people will start thinking more deeply about having kids because of MN and all the stories of frustration on it? Just a thought.
I wonder how many women use MN?
I find this site fascinating for the glimpse given into what life can be like with kids.
I get exhausted from just reading it.
I have no kids and still feel there's not enough time in the day to do all that I want to do.
You need to move to Japan where the school basically nannies the kids until they are 18. There is even school every day in the holidays and during normal term time, most kids stay in school till around 7pm.
Yes, if I had to have kids, I'd have them here.
;)

Bay, I don't think you can ever understand or believe how having children will change your life until you do it. It doesn't matter how many people tell you I don't think!

I agree with malinkey. Looking at it from the outside, having children seems like a monumentally bad idea - it just seems to be one hard slog with no respite. And in some ways, it is exactly that. But the reason parents continue to slog away is because the love they feel for their children is the best motivator ever. Nothing compares to looking a gorgeous little being and thinking "that's my son/daughter." Of course there are times when you'd sell them to the circus for sixpence but the good times more than make up for it IME.

That's good to hear because often it doesn't look that way, especially with so many kids with their heads in computer games these days.

Baypolar, I don't know why you comment at all really.

However your comments are very valid in that they make me see that I am glad I am not you.

So in that way they offer me an alternative world view iykwim.

Why don't you have children? [nosey]