tragic or just shit

[ithastostop]

Hello, first post but long time lurker

Married for 10 years, together for 16, one dc each then two dc together, DH was unfaithful when pg with dc1. Caught with his trousers around his ankles at Christmas party when dc2 was 6 mth old, by me. He was unfaithful 18 months later, I had a 6th sense (checked his phone for the v first time). Typing this I am Shocked and ashamed at myself, like it is not me that I am writing about for staying in marriage.

When we returned from a holiday last August, the first post I open was a card from someone implying, again, that he had been unfaithful. It was a witty card, he said it must have been from a disgruntled employee (own business).

I realise exactly what this looks like and am so ashamed, of myself, I cannot go on like this. I have told him too many things had happened for me to recover from, his response is "we have to make this work". He is devastated that I am considering leaving. I feel broken.

it's shit when you are going through things like this but it does get better

and it's not tragic to want the best for your family, and sometimes that means staying together, when before you were in this situation, and it was a friend of yours, you would have been telling her to leave the bastard -I get that!

only you can decide what is the right thing to do now, and yes from the outside looking in it is easy to say that this has gone far enough, and you have tried and you should be proud of yourself for that, not ashamed

you are hurting at the moment and you have a choice of 2 things, both of which will seem like a bad decision while you are hurting as much as you are, but only one choice puts you in control

do not consider his feelings in your decision making -he didn't consider you when he made his choices sorry if that sounds harsh you have to consider what is right for you and the DCs

and 1 am is never a good time to make 'strong' decisions

So sorry you are going through this. My husband has strayed too and it is like a knife in the heart. I am slowly recovering, but it is taking a long time. I do understand you must be terribly upset, but is there any chance of you having some time away from it all? You might benefit from a break from the acute sense of pain and loss that are so close to you everyday at home. It sounds to me like you need time to work out what is really best for you. Please don't feel ashamed for staying either, you have done what you thought was in the best interests of yourself and your dcs.

thank you workshy, you do not sound harsh at all.

I am now so tearful at keyboard I can barely see, this is so not like me, I try to keep it together.

yes, 1 am is way to late, I need to go to sleep. I seem to be ok, then there is a trigger. He is sorry he has caused so much sadness, but it is very shortlived.

seeing it all written down is terrible, I have read that whilst lurking.

I am so ashamed, if it were me daughter, who is an adult, I think I would advise her to leave such a heartless man.

GodKG, bloody hell am sobbing now, I did not realise quite how emotional I am/was.

It has has gone on for so long I thought I was cold and emotionless, if anyone could see me now, I do hurt, so much. We have so much and are so lucky.

I have such a hard choice to make, I do not believe he will change, when he has a drink, he does not know himself.

thank you so much for your responses at this late hour.

He really has had too many chances hasn't he? Maybe some people can get over one mistake. But when they do it again, what they are saying is they can get away with it. That you will forgive them again. These infidelities have damaged the love and respect you have for him - you sound like you know his character.

Can't help himself when he's drunk? Then he should have given up booze the first time he cheated on you.

He thought he had you in the palm of his hand - how wrong he was.
And in case you weaken - just conjure up that picture you saw of him with his trousers down - don't suppose he was using a condom was he?

Don't beat yourself up. You are not the one who has behaved badly. It is not your fault because you were a decent enough person to give him a chance to become as decent as you are.

Sadly through life it becomes apparent that not everyone has deep morals to guide them. You have. He hasn't.

Put all the blame squarely where it belongs.

In time I hope you find someone deserving of you. They are out there, but yours doesn't sound like one of them I'm afraid.

And yes, if he felt that bad the first or second time, and it wasn't his fault 'it was the drink'.. well he wouldn't have touched a drop since.

So Sorry.

If you are still awake.. remember that in the early hours of the morning, with tiredness and heightened emotions, things always seem so much worse. Sleep on it.. then make some plans to move in the direction that you decide to. x x x

Darling nothing will cause this man to be faithful, all the while he has opportunities. This is nothing to do with you, or the state of your relationship, it is entirely and exclusively about your husband and his own issues.

It sounds like you are realising that now and coming out of a kind of fug. That's okay. You did what you needed to do while you coped with childbirth and very young children. Perhaps you're just seeing things with more clarity now and realising that no matter what you do and no matter how things are between you, your husband will never look a gift horse in the mouth.

You don't have to work on it at all. In fact you as an individual cannot work on it and you can't work on it as a couple either. It is beyond either your or the relationship's remit. He is the only person who can stop this and he won't.

There are so many potential partners out there who are completely unlike your husband. You have got to trust in that and have faith in yourself, constantly telling yourself that you and your children are worth so much more than living with an habitual adulterer. Happiness is out there for you to take and trust me you will be happier in an instant the moment you realise that it is no longer your concern who he's with or what he's doing. The feeling of dread between episodes will also be banished from your life forever.

What a wonderful life that would be, wouldn't it?

Sorry to chip in so late but please never be ashamed my love.You've done nothing wrong.Please try and take some comfort from the wise women of Msnet and try to get some rest.You sound lovely and your ratbag DH. doesn't deserve you. Mx.

All things are possible in heaven and earth.... I completely understand why you don't want to give up on your marriage. But as the other posters have said, in this situation it doesn't matter what you do or don't do, he has a problem with controlling his behaviour, and he is the only one who can change it. Problems in a marriage are both party's responsibility, infidelity is a problem in him, not a problem in the marriage. You are not in any way at fault, no matter what!

Sorry really isn't what's needed from him, a promise to do whatever he can to be a different man is required. Point him towards www.survivinginfidelity.com and 'Not Just Friends' by Shirley Glass. These should become his Bible (useful for you too). You need actions, not words.

You can start by setting your boundaries - what is and isn't acceptable behaviour... the basic list might look like this:

• Absolutely no contact with any of the OW
• Complete transparency on his phone/email/facebook - you have all the passwords and are entitled to check whenever you want.
• His whereabouts are also an open book at all times. He calls to check in with you, doesn't leave your side at a party etc.
• No friends of the opposite sex or spending time with someone of the opposite sex other than in a strictly work environment.
• Individual counselling for him
• Marriage counselling for both of you (this may be best when he's had a bit of time in individual counselling)

These are not demands, they are the minimums for respectful behaviour, breaches of which would hurt you deeply. You may also have some of your own specific boundaries to add to the list.... work out your minimums and be prepared (allowing for very minor slip ups) to stick by them with a consequence.... you are not to prepared to stay in a relationship where you are not loved and respected. Full Stop.

Thank you all for your responses.

Jbuckley, if he had stopped drinking I think things would be ok, he is a binge drinker and turns into a horrible person. The image of him with his trousers round his ankles is burned into my memory.

twange, I have realised over the years that he has no morals, personally or professionally. He is quite sorry now, but I think he is only sorry that I am considering our future as a family, not actually sorry for what he has done.

Hatty, I really do feel like I am coming out of a fug, there is only dc4 left at home now, older 2 dc are adults and not living at home now, and dc3 away at school. dc4 will go away to school in 2 years, then there will be just dh and I.

we are only in our 40s

marsa2, have not heard 'ratbag' for ages. He is one, I do feel much better, but still ashamed I could not stop him acting like an idiot, like a failed wife in some way.

Ok.. definitely add 'Seek help for alcohol problems' to that boundaries list.

Lady, have that book, he gets a bit cross when he sees me reading it. He will never read it.

he feels as there is no ow now, why do I need to read it?

He has offered to go to counselling, I know what will happen. He will charm the counsellor, say all the things he should, be great for a while, then get drunk.

I am also too ashamed that I have lived like this for so many years.

Interesting how you mention he gets cross about that book - its not an easy book to read esp if you are the betrayed party, probably because in order to help your spouse recover and prevent future affairs, you really need to look into yourself to find what character flaws and weaknesses allowed you to behave so badly.

Saying sorry and then brushing things under the carpet is not a successful strategy and this is why you are posting on here I suspect.

he isnt taking any real responsibility for his actions, is he? Or showing you that he is prepared to look at why he has done this, to prevent a recurrence.

That isnt good.

OP try not to feel ashamed, you should only feel ashamed if you've done something wrong. You haven't, you've been betrayed. You have done everything you could to make your marriage work (including forgive him) and he is pissing your marriage up the wall. There's no failed wife in this scenario, just a man whose failing you as a husband.

You say: "He has offered to go to counselling, I know what will happen. He will charm the counsellor, say all the things he should, be great for a while, then get drunk" so you know him enough to know that this will happen again and again then?

I would say make peace with the fact that he is a cheating liar, and then decide whether you want to put up with it some more, or that you deserve more and kick him out on his arse.

Probably the only way he is ever remotely likely to change is if his actions have serious consequences. ie: you leave him. I would, but I'm not walking in your shoes so I know I can't say that for sure.

If you leave, I seriously doubt he will change, but if you stay, he almost definately won't. He should be grovelling so hard to you at this stage.. not getting in a temper about reading a book that you've requested him to.

I wish I could just send you a sample of my life for a day, and let you know how it feels to be around someone who is just decent and kind. It's not all party party.. but it's so nice to be relaxed about your relationship so you can get on with all of the other trials and tribulations in life.

Please please please stop feeling ashamed. We nice ones are easily taken in as we tend to assume others have the same values as we have. You wouldn't wan't to be the sort of person that never gave someone the benefit of the doubt? Don't beat yourself up for being nice. And I've been there too and learnt... that's all we can do really, and move on. Just think of the great advice you will be able to give to your kids! and of course, that's probably the only useful thing he's done in donating his sperm for them. But his usefulness is over now me thinks.

Consequences are the key... he'll either man up or it will be over. Either way you'll have your answer.

If he's not even willing to read a book then he's not up to much...

The shame here is not yours. Don't take it on. If anyone broke this marriage, it was him and his actions. It is his responsibility. Do not take it on so he doesn't have to. For what it's worth, I can understand why you've found yourself here and it must be terribly painful. Now is the time to think about what you want, and accept nothing less.

You have nothing to be ashamed of. If someone wants to drink there is nothing their loved ones can do to stop them. Do not blame yourself for his weakness.

Believe me there was nothing you could have done to get him off the booze.

Ironically if you do go ahead with a separation/divorce, he will probably attempt for the first time to give up the booze. Sadly this may be too late because you don't sound like you have any deep love for him anymore.

Only when they believe you mean business and are ready to finish things will they take you seriously and take a look at changing their behaviour.