Just told DP I don't want him to come on holiday with us.

[horsetowater]

It's just too stressful. Every holiday is tainted with big rows, either up a mountainside, in a hot city, frequently while looking for somewhere to eat, while lost in a hire car. This may be normal for many people, but our rows are the kind that make my heart beat faster and the kids go very quiet - it's not worth it.

We are already sleeping in separate rooms and this is another step in the path I am taking after 25 years to extricate his aggressive behaviour from my life. The 'separation' has been going on for 5 years but this is not a lot of time considering we have been together for so long.

The kids miss him when we do this, and I do to a certain extent, but I consider it's a worthwhile sacrifice for the sake of a peaceful, if slightly less interesting, holiday.

Or should I just 'make it work' for the sake of the children? Anyone else enjoy single parent holidays?

Yes - the ghosts of outings past - I had that a while ago, went somewhere I had had a row at what had supposed to have been a family day out. I shuddered. It's like a massive lightbulb moment. It can't happen again, hence the no holidays together.

The trouble is we all lose as much as we gain. We lose the laughs, the fun and the frolics, the help with the long drive, the 'science bit' (he's more knowledgeable and more interested). We gain peace (to a certain extent because there are always sibling squabbles) and security (again there are limits because I'm not the best decision maker - more follower than leader).

But the fact is, I can change things. And I guess I don't have to be all things to them - they have enough silly uncles to make up for the fun and frolics. I am capable of being a bit more decisive (!) and sibling squabbles are an essential part of child development (so I'm told by a child psych).

Had a big huggy session with oldest (13) last night. She still needs a lot of looking after.

But we are so enmeshed - friends, family, history, school, work, interests, are all shared.

And just as I'm starting to think - OK, perhaps the kids will enjoy it more if he comes with us, we have a morning out in the snow. The park near our house.

I tell him I'm going to take some pics and catch up later. I don't find them as friends say they saw him elsewhere. I get back home and he calls, having dragged the dcs around the park with sledges didn't actually do any because they were all looking for me. He turns into guilt-laden bollocks, saying I could have slipped and hit my head and am lying in the snow'. I tell him that's ridiculous and he hangs up.

We weren't in the fecking Alps, it was a town park, with a hill. And then dd phones me and asks why didn't I phone him. Why can't he just get on and enjoy the day with them - why drag me into everything? They don't even actually need an adult with them, it's local and we know people. So while I'm home, getting the hot chocolate ready and expecting them to come back fresh-faced and hungry, they're spending one of the best days in the year wondering where Mummy is.

So thanks, dear Life Partner, for helping me decide that holidays just won't work with you involved.

I'd rather live in a shitty house and be happy, leave him. Or ask him to leave. See a solicitor, get things moving. You can choose to live with this man or not. 5 years is a large percentage of your DCs lives spent with parents who are miserable.

The contrast between today, and yesterday when I took dd into town alone was remarkable. We had a lovely day out, despite loads of things going wrong (tickets, wrong information, wrong drinks, freezing weather) - the stuff that happens daily but you ride and smooth over for the kids. But I knew if he were there DP will have made a big issue of and spoiled the day.

You're right of course Lydia. But absolutely EVERYTHING will change if we separate, for all of us. Perhaps that will give me more incentive to fight to stay in the home however - the fight will be between him and me, and protect DCs from uprooting.

Well we had a great time. There were several moments where, as we took the wrong turn, as there was a traffic jam, etc, I was so grateful HE wasn't there to spoil it all for us.

It was very easy. And I wasn't the only 'single' parent there.

Oh didn't realise the holiday was so soon. You will reminisce about the great holiday AND the mistakes in time to come, you can't take action without making mistakes! (Stbx is so scared of making mistakes or having a moment's bad time or inconvenience, that he won't take that risk, and so does not really do anything)

you are going to be happier living apart .
and so will dc

and they can cope with being uprooted for a better qulaity of life (not material but emotional)

Pinkpussycat - there's nothing worse than somebody stifling you with their own fear. He feels uncomfortable so he makes everyone else feel the same. Why oh why did I not understand the definition of narcissist a long long time ago?

He only sees himself - it's amazing to have finally made the diagnosis - I can watch from a distance and understand that his world will only ever be his own. I have tried too long to share it with him and foolishly thought his actions were within his control. He has no intention of changing anything in his world.

Several of my friends where either they were teens when their parents split, or they split when their kids were older teens; the teenager has turned around afterwards and said I wish you had done that sooner.
Please get out of this for the sake of your kids, a small cramped flat with peace would be better than this.
I don't think you have been strong to stick with him, if you were strong you would have got out years ago. Please turn you life and the life of your kids around now.