What do you do if one of you wants to get married and the other doesn't?

[RitaMorgan]

Anyone else been in this situation? How did you move past it?

Oh, sorry Dave, I misread your last comment. You said your partner has the same view points, not what I read....i hope my partner has the same view points. Sorry.

I am totally ambivalent about marriage. All I would say is that if one of you doesn't want to get married, then make sure you take steps to protect yourself by seeing a solicitor and enshrining some of the rights that marriage would give you without actually taking that step. Any partner who isn't prepared to do that isn't rejecting marriage for philosophical reasons but simply because they don't want to commit.

Thanks tired of waiting :).........ha, it was more of a rhetorical question really. Sometimes I need to get my frustrations written.

Hi Dahlen,

I don't fully understand what you mean?! Are you saying that people who don't get protection by a solicitor are not committed?

Not completely, because there are always people who simply haven't thought about it. But if it's been discussed, and the answer is still no to either marriage or legal protection, then yes, I am.

I simply must be the first person you have ever encountered that does not require those two things and still feels 100% committed to my relationship with my partner, I must be the exception to the rule.

You do, of course, have the right to live your life in whatever way you see fit without worrying about what some stranger on the internet thinks. However, while I don't doubt that you feel 100% committed, the truth is that in the event of separation or death, one of you could suffer in ways that simply cannot happen if legal steps have been taken to prevent it.

Yes, I see what you mean Dahlen, I think the point I am trying to make is in the eyes of the law......live in partners (especially with children) should have the same rights as married couples (especially in today's society). All I'm saying is that the law should be changed. Agree with you that people can get married if they want and everyone should have the freedom to choose which way they live.

It's been fascinating to read through this thread!

It's me that wants to be married and for ideological reasons, my DP does not. We've been together 3 years, no kids or house yet. We're mid-30s and not at all religious. I have never wanted to marry anyone before.

My reasons are sort of legal/financial but mostly that I see being married as a differentiator between this and past relationships. This relationship is special, different, and I hope forever, and I want that acknowledged. I know that marriage is not a guarantee of forever, but it does demonstate commitment, imho.

He does want a mortgage and kids with me though, and thinks that should be enough. For me, they show commitment to a roof over his head and to children, but not specifically to me, and our relationship in and of itself. I want some form of commitment to me - separate to income and offspring. AIBU?

I hate the idea of a wedding ceremony as much as he does, but I do want to be married and I've been tying myself up in knots re how to move forward. This thread has given me food for thought re possible solutions though, thanks :)

I know someone who lived together and had 2 children, he cheated on her after 15 years and married OW within 9 months.

I know I have been hurt, but that must have hurt SO much. It's like, treble insult.

Abitwobbly

Yes, I know of similar situations.

The first is the former partner of a friend's BIL. They were together for 15 years, had a 13 year old son. She so wanted to get married, he "didn't believe in it".

He left her suddenly for an OW and married her within 6 months. She was utterly devastated - still is, two years on.

The second, a couple I was friendly with through work. They were together for 25 years - no children. Both had been married before, quite young, no children. She also desperately wanted to get married throughout the 10 years I knew them. Sadly she died of cancer in her early fifties.

Within 6 months he then got back together with an old flame, who had also been married and divorced. They were married within 12 months.

I still feel very sad about that - none of my business, I know - nevertheless, I can't help thinking of how much my friend wanted to marry him. Needless to say, we are no longer in touch except for Christmas cards!

muriella

You really need to look into the legal/financial aspects, especially if you have children.

If you have children together, and you separate, there are significant advantages in the financial protection you have if you are married compared with cohabiting.

It's hard before you have children to know whether you will want to continue working or not. Whether you are married or not, if you stay at home for any length of time then you stand to lose a great deal in terms of salary, pension, and the ability to earn as much as you did before you had a career break.

That means your ability to recover your financial position is undermined, and of course your mortgage capacity is diminished.

If you are married, then your contribution to joint marital assets is not only deemed to be equal, on divorce these issues are also taken into account in the financial settlement:

1.The welfare of any minor children from the marriage.
2.The value of jointly and individually owned property and other assets and the financial needs, obligation and responsibilities of each party.
3.Any debts or liabilities of the parties.
4.Pension arrangements for each of the parties, including future pension values and any value to each of the parties of any benefit they may lose as a result of the divorce.
5.The earnings and earning potential of each of the parties.
6.Standard of living enjoyed during the marriage.
7.The age of the parties and duration of the marriage.
8.Any physical or mental disability of either of the parties.
9.Contributions that each party may have made to the marriage, either financially or by looking after the house and/or caring for the family.

That's from the Matrimonial Act, and none of it applies if you are cohabiting. There may be consideration given to the housing needs if young children are involved, but not on a permanent basis.

So, many women in long term cohabiting relationships suffer terrible financial hardship.

It also isn't quite so easy to resolve the "next of kin" issue as some people believe - as we have seen here on Mumsnet - where the parents of someone's seriously ill DP intervened in his health care against her wishes. The term "next of kin" has no legal definition. It is only straightforward if no-one else in your DP's family challenges your status as "next of kin", even if you can show this was your partner's wish.

Even if you don't imagine now that inheritance tax will apply to you, it may do. You will also be ineligible for any contribution-based benefits.

I suggest you read this helpful guide:

www.advicenow.org.uk/living-together/

There are legal agreements you can sign, but they still won't give you the protection marriage will.

www.co-operative.coop/legalservices/family-and-relationships/getting-together/

Useful summary olgaga, thanks.

In Muriella's case all those advantages to her would accrue equally and oppositely but as disadvantages to her partner if they divorced. Her protection is his exposure. What would be the best arguments for getting married from his perspective?

I would probe someone's reasons for not wanting to marry very, very carefully. I think few people can cite generally political/ideological reasons. From my perspective, someone who argues that they disagree with the concept - e.g. lifelong fidelity and support - is voicing a lack of committment. Personally I don't count that as a political reason. We all know the stats on divorce but marriage is an expression of hope, among many things.

I used to be a marriage refusenik. I could politicise it until the cows come home but really I didn't want to marry my exDP. For various painful reasons I have now come to the conclusion that I am totally the marrying kind, but only to the right person.

Plus Nora Ephron covered this and she's so rarely wrong.

The best argument for getting married from his perspective? In my view it depends entirely on the strength of his desire to maintain not just a relationship with her, but an equal relationship.

OK, I'm musing here. Part of this is from my own experience, part of it is from my knowledge...

It's a big issue, and one that won't go away. If she wants to marry him, she's unlikely to change her mind about that - certainly not immediately - but the risk to him is she might start to think differently about his suitability. At best, she will be disappointed. At worst, he may seem diminished in her eyes by his reluctance to do what she feels is "the right thing".

If, for example, they both wanted children and she decided to go ahead regardless of marriage, essentially she would be accepting that the risk she takes, and the sacrifices she makes, might be greater than his if they were to separate. So she may feel there is an imbalance - that they are not equal.

That's what the Matrimonial Act introduces, the assumption that both partners to the marriage make an equal contribution, and their financial footing after separation should be as equal as the division of assets can achieve. That's why the division of assets is rarely 50-50 after divorce, because it takes into account any "relationship-generated disadvantage".

I accept that there are some women to whom this doesn't apply, btw - women who carry on with well-paid full-time careers after childbirth - but they are not the majority even now. Most women will find that raising a family is much easier if they take a part-time, lower paid, local jobs. That is particularly the case if he works long hours.

So she might realise that if she doesn't want to take the risk of having children without the security of marriage, she'd better start looking elsewhere. Her love for him may not diminish, but her loyalty and commitment might if she sees it isn't reciprocated, and that can have a corrosive effect.

It will also depend on their ages, her understanding of the legal position, as well as a desire for children.

She might come to the conclusion that maybe there are other men in the world who she might fall in love with, and feel loyalty and commitment to, who might also be prepared to show that love, loyalty and commitment through marriage.

So if he keeps refusing, he runs the risk of the relationship dying a slow, lingering death - as her understanding that he is not as committed to the relationship as she is becomes an issue between them.

Ultimately, if he loves her enough to want to have children with her, why would he want to refuse her the protection marriage provides in the event of a divorce?

Thanks, Olgaga, really useful post. Lots to think about for sure.