Question to adults with AS

[KnowYourself]

So, I am getting more and more convinced that H is somewhere on the spectrum. He is probably 'doing well' as he isn't displaying some of the very blatant signs of AS but nevertheless.
Now, he is also a very angry person and it comes out in a passive-agressive way which is driving me nuts tbh.

My question is: Can you expect someone with AS to control his anger and stop being PA/emotinally abusive?

Some of H responses are hurtful but I could deal with it if we could have a better communication/knowing more about AS.
eg: Was going to tell the dcs a few days ago about the death of a relative. DH knew about it. I asked the dcs to come over which they were not keen on. dc1 lied down on the sofa and DH started to tell him off because he wasn't sitting down. Wrong time, wrong comment.

However, I can not and will not accept EA comments.
eg: Something happens between DH and dc1. H gets upset and then proceed to blank me out, not talk to me, just being awkward and difficult. I do not want to accept responsability to manage his anger and make things smooth because he can not manage his own anger of that makes sense.

But is that realistic?

sorry I see you were addressing OP there. BTW I have sulked with the best of them, didn't put that down to AS (I know, I'm not diagnosed!)

First of all, I am sorry if I am not using the right terms to explain my H's behaviour and its consequences. It is ever so difficult to understand sometimes what is exactely going on and I certainly wouldn't dream to say for sure that he is PA or AS - not for me to make a diagnosis as such.
However, it would help me a lot to try and categorize/understand where his response are coming from.
So if I have offended anyone by using the wrong terminology, I am really sorry.

To explain my bit about PA, I think that H is sometimes doing things in retaliation. His way of doing it could be defined as PA (as 'I am angry, I will put the clothes away but not yours that I will leave in a hip on the bed'). Having read around AS, this seems to be entirely possible, just as another AS person can go in a rage and be 'verbally abusive' in that their words are extremely hurtful to the recipient.
Having looked at a previous link on this thread, this autralian support group also refers to abuse, verbal abuse, emotional and physical, stating that this can happen in AS-NT relationship and should not be tolerated under the cover of AS.
And then there are also the comments that are inappropriate or the actions that aren't quite what they should be and these, even if they are hurtful, are certainly AS and should not be labelled as abusive.

I am quite interrested by seaofyou comment though because it raises 3 points for me:
1- If you are PA, do you always want to hurt the other person with your behaviour or can it be used as a 'defense mechanism'? If I understand well, we can all have some PA behaviour in some ways or at some point in our life, but it doesn't mean that we all have a PD of some sort. More that it can be use as a 'safe' way to put your point accross wo looking aggressive as such.
2- If a AS person is struggling to 'read emotions', does it automatically mean that they will never do something to hurt someone?? I might have a piece missing here but I would imagine that someone with AS will still have an understanding of other people feelings, even if they can not read them through facial expression etc. So why is it that they would never hurt someone intentionally? When people are angry, that's what tends to happen. They release their anger on someone else by sending their hurt to them and hoping for a relief).
3- Finally, if I am looking at my dcs, when DH puts one of them down, again and again and again, enough for that child to tell me that 'Daddy thinks I am an idiot', does it means my H can not do anything to change that because of the AS (because he can not see that it's hurtful, only sees his pov -it's just a scratch so why are you crying?- etc..) Because if this is the case, then the only way for me is to get out of this marriage asap to protect my dcs.....

Pink, the reason i am still here is because I've always felt DH loves me, despite whatever is happening....
Face blindness... I don't know. I don't think that H is on the far end of the spectrum and can not get anything at all. Or at least he has developped some coping strategies that would hide that. His face thought gets completely blank, emotionless as soon as we enter an area where he is feeling unconfortable with. And he is obviously unable to put himself in my shoes (like not realizing that on the day of my gran's funeral I would be sad and upset).

Thepinkpussycat - thank you. My father is almost 70 and is def AS and you've just described our family! Even down to the tire-gauge Christmas present... although in our case it was a tape measure! or one year, a jar of vitamins!

ok know firstly forget about AS or any other dx ....as you are blaming a dx when possibly your dh may just be a nasty man!
Also he has gone through life fine and not questioned in school etc on this AS. Does he have motor/sensory/diet/receptive-expressive language differences/obsessions/ToM/ anxiety etc you have not really described a person with AS but simply an EA man.
But as you are convinced dh has AS of course he can be an arse and have AS also but the AS is usually unintentional esp literal that often ends in arguements, and blowing up quickly with overload/stress.
He is cutting and angry all the time....this isn't AS...this is a lot more...stop making excuses for this unacceptible behaviour and EA and tell dh you can't take no more the way he treats you and dc. He needs to sort his anger issues out now.
Personally you need to stop reading and getting further confused and deal with 'here and now'. Ask him to go to GP and express your concerns over AS and if possible you go too...ask to be reffered to CMHT for assessment of possible AS there are a lot more adult dx clinics around these days.
If your dh can't read emotions...he can be taught to read them from you/your dc in a formal way....photograph and video footage of each emotion of each person and teach him one by one..

Finally you can change his behaviour response if it is AS, bit more difficult or impossible if it is something far worse. Someone with AS does not intenionally do the behaviour they have no insight but can be taught to behave in different way. What do you do every time your dh puts your dc down...do you shout at dh? Do you ignore? What does dh do when you respond back? What does he do when you ignore?

Thank you.
You are totally right about the fact I am probably clutching to straws to find 'good' reasons for me to stay and for him to behave like he is.

Dh is :

• not good at making friends or keeping them
• has a narrow interests (ie 2 hobbies that he does on his own, unusual, and walking). Anythingelse is a no-no
• is unable to do 'small talk'
• Seems really upset when he realizes that his reactions were out or his face goes blank
• has never been able to connect emotionally, hates 'emotional talk' or if I am anything other than calm and composed when I talk to him.
• is finding it very hard to deal with his dcs. To be 'OK' they would need to be silent and perfectly behaved all the time. Noise has been a big issue in the past. As is been 'hyper' (which is just normal young child behaviour running around)
• when doing something with them, esp if it is something that he likes, he will go into inappropraite lengths, details they can't comprehend, and go on for a long time. Same with walking (he got very upset that each and every single walk we did as a famly ended being a drag - he wanted to go on a 4 hours walk with dcs as young as 3~4yo in the middle of winter...)
• Avoids social occasions (so would not go out with me to see my friends as 'I have nothing to say to them'). Has actually hardly talked to my parents either.
• doesn't do 'emotional stuff'. He doesn't seem to see when the dcs are upset or playing up. Or realize when I had very bad PND.

Probably a lot more than that tbh.
The 'reading emotions' I am struggling to evaluate because i've always looked at his behaviour under the lens of 'he is being a twat'.
And I think he has been. Which probably explained why he has been able to change some of his behaviour relatively quickly.
But there are other stuff that I feel isn't EA behaviour even though it is hurtfull if that makes sense?
The 'anxiety' side of things?? Again I can't tell as he is never talking about his feelings. In his own words he is 'all in his head'. And doesn't want to talk abot emotions.

As it happens, the 'why are you staying with me' question came up. Very light hearted conversation. He couldn't answer. Stayed blank for a few minutes and then said 'you are cooking unusual foods.' Not taht dissimilar to what he said when I asked him what he thought about getting married 'well you are the person I've stayed with the longest, so you must be the right one'....

It does sound like AS to me.

The face blindness thing, btw, is to do with not being able to recognise people's faces, not his/hers going blank. It is one of the reasons why I struggled with the social side of school, and since then with meetings I have to attend, with recognising students when I was a trainer and a lecturer, and have got very good at asking people who they are, while being embarrassed at having to ask. I can read emotions in others, mostly, so I can see they are at me having to ask.

KnowYourself another link that may be helpful - she diagnosed my ex-h.

Interesting reading, too.

this last post sounds more AS traits now you have explained more...but your inital he's PA/EA which is AS wasn't if you get what I mean? And felt it was giving a bad name to men with AS in general...they are all PA/EA...no they are not.
But what you are doing is giving your dh leway to treat your dc like this...why? If your dh has AS he can learn rules...and fast. But what you are saying about being cutting all time and EA isn't AS side of it ...it is something else I'm afraid. This is what you need to work on with your dh wheather he gets AM or CBT or counselling. Before it really damages the kids self esteem and teach them how to act as dad 'role model'...nip it in the bud...make him aware...film him and play it back then tell him to get help.
My ds has ASD and I don't allow bad behaviour...meltdowns from sensory overload is different...naughtiness is different (when they are aware and doing it to cause intentional harm emotional/physical etc)
So why expect it from a grown man too!

Why did I let H act like this towards me and the dcs?
Probably the best I can explain is like this (Thanks zuzu for the links)

But if the woman wants a deeper, more personal relationship, then there are difficulties. She may complain of loneliness because he is emotionally distant ... [and] if she wants more spontaneity or passion, this man cannot provide it. A woman married to an Apollo man may find herself becoming more and more like him if she follows his lead, especially if she too values thinking over feeling.... But just the opposite can occur if she is someone who laughs and cries easily and is often emotional and expressive of her feelings.... She may become increasingly irrational or hysterical as he withdraws further. Her efforts are provocative and usually unsuccessful. She is trying to get him to react emotionally, by her tears or her anger, her threats or accusations. But all that results is that he gets more cool and rational and draws further away, and she becomes increasingly out of control."
In short, I had PND and then AND so got very emotional for a long time. I needed support he couldn't give me, he withdrew. Then started the cycle. Add some mind games on the top of it and I completely lost my self confidence. Because he was so 'calm' and me so emotional, I believed I must be in the wrong and did not trust myself or my opinions anymore.
It took me a long time to realize my pov were just as valid (if not more as in the case of the dcs).
And then even more time to actually say it in a way that had some impact on DH. So this is something that is slowly changing but I don't trust him enough atm to believe this will stay like this.

seaofchange I wanted to add that I've never thought that a man with AS was automatically PA or aggressive too. :)
but your posts have helped clarify something re aggression/anger management. There is no reason not to expect an AS man to learn to express his anger in appropriate ways.

Thank you all, it certainly has helped me having a baseline on what it is possible to expect which a nice starting point for me.

oh maybe I'll change my name know I spent far to long excusing ex's behaviour for AS..I do know where you are coming from.