WHAT DO YOU SEE? Sorry Very Long

[azzurra]

A few days ago I asked my husband if he could look after our 3 year old son for two days: the nursery is closed and I have run out of holidays. He told me that he had to go into work implying that he had something urgent on. Son is with babysitter for two days whilst we are both at work: when the babysitter comes in this morning she asks: ?how is it at work? to which my husband replies ?very quiet? I bit my lips not to say anything and look as casual as possible but when we left for work I did ask him to remind me of the reason why he could not spend the day with his son. ?Appraisals to do? was his answer. This is probably just the last drop. We both know that things have not been good between us for a long time: we would fit very nicely into the definition of a couple who have been together too long to have anything to say to each other: communication is just related to daily events and our son. I would love to say more and to try to explain how I feel and I have tried: I have tried to talk, I have sent emails to him but the result is always the same: stonewalled: my husband has created many barriers between the two of us. I am too tired to change this: it is difficult to talk when it is obvious that the other person would rather watch tv or surf internet. Difficult to have a conversation when you are reading your paper during breakfast, difficult to have any intimacy (very sore point) when the first thing you do when you come to bed is switch on the radio. I have given up on all this. For years I have been made to understand that watching TV, anything no matter what was always better than coming to bed with me. If asked about the issue my husband has always closed himself in an impenetrable silence. This is a subject that CANNOT be discussed under any circumstances. On all other aspects my husband is the ideal husband: understanding, patient, accommodating, ready to help but I find it hard to define our relationship as ?marriage?, we may be housemates, friends anything but not husband and wife. WHERE do I go from here???. I suppose nowhere. I do not dislike or hate my husband. I resent his indifference. In the past months I have deliberately reduced any communication to the bare minimum hoping for some sort of reaction but NOTHING has happened. Please do not say I should leave him. He is a good father and my son is my treasure. I just feel incredibly frustrated and unable to talk.

I see a dead relationship that is draining your life away. Unless he is willing to co-operate with you and try to rebuild it, then you need to consider separating and giving your son the chance to see that relationships should include love and companionship.

Couldn't read and run, - but not sure I have any good advice to give, I'm afraid.

It sounds like a sad-but-salvagable situation, - but only salvagable if your OH is prepared to meet you halfway. Sadly, it looks like he has decided not to. You can't save your marriage by yourself - he has to do 50pc of the work.

The predictable answer to withdrawing sex and affection is that he is having an affair, - do you have any suspicions in this area? It doesn't sound like he is, and it is totally possible that he isn't, but it just seems so maddenly predictable that, nine times of out ten, that is what is going on.

I know you said not to say it, but if he doesn't want to try, there is just no point continuing.

The only other solution is for you to lower your expectations and accept the marriage as it is. If you choose to do that, bear in mind that you'll be teaching your son strange things about relationships.

First of all your childcare issue need to be negociated in advance, sit down with the diaries & plan ahead, he needs to take equal responsibility.

Secondly, he may not want to discuss this but YOU need to, so he has no right to devalue your feelings in this way.

Ask him to make time for a talk without interuptions or distractions, give him the choice of when it can be if he has a particular programme to watch/listen to that can't be avoided

Do not take No for an answer & if he is vague "oh yes soon darling" pin him down to specifics.

If you are a couple then you deserve a chance to discuss ANYTHING that is an issue. Good luck.

What i see is 3options

1.Accept that you will have to live like this for the rest of your life. Or, say, until your son is an adult and leaves home. On one hand this will keep his home together. On the other it gives him a very unhappy family. Thats assuming you can both live like this for 15 years without getting depressed/illl/having an affair

2.Engage your H in the project of improving your marriage.you cant do it alone

3.Leave

Where is your self respect?

If your H behaves like this to you, what do you get out of this relationship, other than a roof over your head and a home for your child?

If he won't even try to understand how you feel, then how can that be "love"?-( his for you?)

Either you discuss couples' counselling and he agrees to go with you- or you find the strength to leave - and maybe find someone in time he gives you the kind of love you want.

"Please do not say I should leave him."
Why not?
You would still have your son, and your son would still have his father. And you wouldn't be tormented by this loveless relationship.
Is that the example you want to set for your son?

Is the lack of sex/intimacy at the root of this problem? As you also describe him as the ideal husband otherwise. We're things always like this?

If sex is the biggest problm.... Low sex drive in men does happen but they are often unwilling to talk. Get god of the 'sex starved marriage' by michel weiner Davis. I've also just finished 'the sex diaries' by bettina ardnt. Not as salacious as it sounds but a lot of insight into sexual problems and negotiations.

Other posters are right, f he really won't respond them I'm afraid it's put up with it or leave. But I'd give a last ditch effort, full informed and all guns blazing - with an ultimatum - rather than just ending things now.

How about going for counselling by yourself to find out what you want and how to go about it?

Do you think if you told your dh you were doing this, it might spur him into realising you were very serious about changing the status quo?

sounds like the candle has burned out, have you tryed going out for a meal spending time together and putting the romance back in the relationship.doing somthing new might put the spice back.

I see a couple living parallel lives at the moment.you have realised this but he hasn't yet.If you are friends then try to talk as friends and tell him how you feel,try to get him to tell you how he sees your relationship with each other and with your child.I dont think it is quite time for a separation but it is time to try to bring those parallel lives together.He needs to recognise this for himself though.
Good Luck

Sounds lonely and hard going

Does he love you? Do you still love him?

In what ways is he otherwise ideal?

Does he stonewall on other issues or just intimacy / time stuff?

Counselling ( for you, or both of you)?

Know it's not the main issue here, but the childcare thing would really piss me off, it shouldn't always be you taking time off work. Insist on splitting unplanned time off for childcare in future.

Have a think about when this dynamic started. What was it like in your early days together and what happened along the way?

thanks, I never talk about this. I would start by saying that DS does not see mum and dad fighting or arguing. When the three of us are together the attention is focused on DS and therefore it is easy to portrait a sense of harmony. When DS goes to sleep we go back to our usual selves: different lives, or parallel lives. Communication is also reading signs: it seems I cannot read his and it cannot read mine. Do I love him? Yes I think I still do and somehow hope for the best. Does he still love me? Sometimes I feel he does, some other times I just feel that he is here because it is easy and it would take too much effort to move somewhere else. I cannot begin to imagine life without him possibly because we have been together so long, or possibly because if not in love I am still very attached to him. Sex or rather the lack of it is undoubtedly a big problem. When I tried to talk about this last time the reaction was: "but we have been here before haven't we?". My interpretation of this is that he knows that there is a problem but he is prepared to do nothing about it. End of discussion. I do not believe he is having an affair but sometimes as astonishing as it may sound I would prefer it, it would make the whole situation more normal. No, the truth is that he loves his world, his sport, his TV shows, his books and I have little space in it. No, I am not prepared to leave not yet at least

What is the money situation?

I stayed on with hope and managed to have not too awful a time, including some very happy times, hardly any involving OH. The kids are OK hardworking young adults, tho they are selfish re their time and effort round the house when here - but that may be their age. I am hoping I may have got away with it, we do both adore the DC.

And am now divorcing him, forgot to say

It sounds as if he is taking everything- and giving nothing.

In fact, it sounds as if you have either a brother-sister set up, or a mother-child set up. Not a man-wife one.

For me, the deal breaker here would be his refusal to talk about something that bothers you so much.

At the same time though, if a man said to me "we have been there before" I would not let him off the hook so easily. I'd say "Yes, but nothing has changed, and unless you face up to the issue then our marriage may well be over."

I do hope you can see that the way he dismisses your feelings is not a loving way to treat anyone.

Granted, he may have a physical or emotional issue that is stopping him having sex with you- he may simply have a low sex drive. But whichever it is, he needs to at least communicate which of these it is.

Nothing will change here unless you change YOUR behaviour in some ways.

That might mean:
seeking counselling for yourself.
persuading him to have couples' counselling.
giving him an ultimatum that if he won't address the issue in an adult way, then you will be looking at a separation.

At the moment, he has no need to do anything- why? because he can get away with this and nothing changes in his life.

You need to start doing something- not just posting here or thinking about it all.

Ameliagrey, yes you are right. I WILL do something about it. I WILL do.

When I tried to talk about this last time the reaction was: "but we have been here before haven't we?"

Your reply to this should be, "Yes and nothing was resolved, so I want to talk about it some more".

Two things occur to me OP - 1) He doesn't talk to you because as far as he is concerned, everything is fine. He has a home, wife, child, job and sex on the very rare occasions he wants it. He doesn't have to make any effort or be accountable for his behaviour does he. 2) How does he let you know he loves you?

I think Al Turtle has some interesting ideas about what to do when they won't talk? - al.turtlecounseling.com/blog/_archives/2005/3/7/407605.html
Might be worth a try anyway... Good luck!