What would you think about this conversation?

[OnlyForMe]

Went to bed yesterday and the conversation went like this:

H - Do you think you need the alarm tomorrow morning?

Me- Errr, yes probably. Why? Would you like me not to put the alarm on?

H- Well... It's already 10.30 and you will be tired tomorrow morning.

Me- Is the alarm disturbing you in the morning?

Yes he sounds like he's saying things in a very roundabout way. Is he frightened of upsetting/offending you perhaps?

He clearly feels unable/unwilling to state his needs directly, and yet probably expects you to respond to these needs anyway. I would guess he is frustrated that you didn't "get" his request, which is not good as it means he will be piling up resentment.

Your statements, as transcribed above, seem fine.

How do the two of you usually handle disagreement?

Things like this happen very regularly.

He agrees to do things he doesn't want to.

Another one is 'Friends have said X'. Like the day he wanted to go out with a friend for the day (they share the same hobby). I was working on that we. So H said 'Oh, said that as you are working, your parents could kook after the dcs and we could go '
My first reaction was to be offended that said friend could have said something like this (told him that was a strange thing to say) and then realized that actually what he wanted was to ask if I could organize something with my parents. H looked offended and upset by my reaction ???

He shares very little of his life (I couldn't tell you how many person work in his department or the name of any of his co-workers even though he has been working there since I know him).
Or about any arrangement he has made (eg we were supposed to go and see my PIL this we and spend the day with them. Just learnt in a round abut way - ie NOT from him- that actually we were going just for the christmas service at the church.Which means that the dcs wouldn't get chance to spend time with their GPs as such. And we would travelling one hour each way for a one hour service).

The list could on.

Itsme you are spot on.

Disagreement?? Talking and exchanging different opinions in an adult way? no it doesn't happen.
I can bring things up and he will just stare at me and say nothing. or just 'I don't know. I've never thought about it'. Facila expression always send a different message though.
I am apparently ackward if I point out the downside of his opinions and express a different idea...

Sounds like this isn't working for you.

What do you want to do?

One option, if it appeals to both of you, would be to use a few sessions at Relate to have a safe space to discuss the problems your different communication styles are causing each of you, and learn new ways of communicating.

Sounds like he needs a bit of bolstering of confidence, are you fairly direct? (I know I can be, and it can be a little scary )

Do you and he get alone time? time away together. Do you get to go and do the hobby together?

He needs reassuring that you are not going to tear his head off. Is his mother a tough cookie, does she rule the roost at her house?

The christmas service thing seems to indicate that there is some issue there with communication/forcefulness.

Lost post ....

Yes we do have time on our own. It's just a big silence.
The last few times we went to a restaurant together, he said very few words, I was left to fill the blanks. He couldn't even look at me in the eyes.

I use to do H hobby but I've gone of it for reasons that I have nothing to do with H.
We also used to be walking together but he has put me off completely because he refused to take into account my own needs. I've been physically very tired after 2 dcs and so haven't been able to do the same walks than before. H has refused to take it into account and chose routes that I specifically said i didn't want to do (because I knew I didn't have the strength to do them).

Actually thinking about it, the issue is that, for him, he is either winning or losing. There is no room for a middle ground and negociation.

That "either winning or losing" thing is a big red flag, IME. You do sound fed up, and like your needs are definitely not being taken into account.

I did want to say that I have some sympathy for your husband regarding his issue with stating his needs, as I was the same until fairly recently. For me, it was being raised by (self-absorbed, abusive) parents who made it clear that I was not allowed to have any needs of my own, or at least none that were to be placed above theirs. So I went through life only very rarely and indirectly stating what I wanted, and expecting other people to recognize their own rudeness without me having to say when something was bothering me. Not at all a healthy way to go about things, but I was so conditioned that I literally did not think I was "allowed" to state my needs. And I built up a lot of anger and frustration that I just held inside - not good.

You do sound like there's a lot more going on in your relationship than that, though.

With the other context you've added, I'm thinking maybe the conversation technique in the OP is more passive aggressive on his part? He's not really telling you what's wrong but making it clear something's bothering him, so it's going to bother you, and if you're to placate him you've got to go out of your way to even just work out what it is he wants. Rather than him just saying "Your alarm woke me this morning and I couldn't turn it off. Could you show me how it works/make sure you switch it off when you get up please?". I expect it makes you feel a bit unsure about whether he really wants you to turn the alarm off, or not, when it could have been quite simple!

The lack of middle ground thing is something that my (emotionally abusive) ex used to do very much. It was like if I didn't want to stick to his demands to the letter, it wasn't good enough, and he assumed I felt the same way about my own desires, so compromise was never an option. He actually said to me once that he thought compromise was pointless because nobody gets what they want. I don't know whether your DH is abusive but it's certainly a red flag, and the not taking your needs into account thing too (they're kind of related, in a way - because he wants to continue walking but only at his pace, on his preferred route)

Yes, passive aggressive.

He should have said.

'I was really annoyed this morning that the alarm went off and would prefer if you gave it a miss tomorrow.'

H- Well... It's already 10.30 and you will be tired tomorrow morning.

Me- Is the alarm disturbing you in the morning?

This part of the conversation doesn't make sense to me. Your response seems like you are trying to guess what he means rather than listening to what he actually said or asking him to clarify. He was saying that you would be tired in the morning. Maybe he was showing concern for you, or he was worried that you would be grumpy perhaps. It might not have been anything to do with him being disturbed by the alarm.

Perhaps you should say, "I don't understand what you mean, can you explain a bit more" or something like that?

Have you both always communicated like this and if so, have you tried any techniques, communication training, body language courses, etc. to help overcome the problem. This can help if either one or both of you are passive agressive. You should work on the basic principle of 'say what you mean and mean what you say'.

FairstiveGreetings, you're right. It doesn't make sense. I used to get very upset about some of his comments, feeling that I hadn't quite understood what he wanted and that in some ways I had failed. So now I automatically try to guess what it is that he really wants to say.
I am always trying to guess all the time and at the same time be as straight forward as possible so we can tackle the real problem.
I suppose the issue here is that H doesn't buy into it so shy away from saying what the issue is.
It probably was the fact he couldn't stop the alarm. It is also quite possible he was angry at me because it was 'my fault' to haver snoozed the alarm and not stopped it.
But now I am also wondering if the issue of the alarm is actually an issue for him too and it is making me nconfortable iyswim.

Itsme, actually I think you are right re his mother. It is actually coming out more and more now (wasn't that obvious before for whatever reason).
My PIL are very conservative in their approach to child rearing and I am convinced that they have crushed any trials from H to express his needs when he was little. Can't talk about it with H though as any attempt is taken as an attack and criticizism of his parents.

Actually it has brought another light to H's behaviours, mainly that he is actually reproducing this behaviour with the dcs. I am totally the opposite (and perhaps go too mcuh the other way), always have the dcs needs in mind as well as how they feel about things. It doesn't go down well with H.

bump

My family were unable to say directly what they wanted, with both my grandmother and mother expecting that you could read their minds and being oh so martyred when you got it wrong. So bloody stupid and do much time and effort wasted.
We were a loving family and I knew that they loved me but there was always this sense of disappointment.
I never really managed to sort it with my mum, but of course it is MY default setting so I have to work really hard to check it with my family and DP.
I second the suggestion of Relate as you seem so sad so I'm sending a cwtch x

But OP he can only operate like this if you allow him to. If he won't say what he means just tell him "I don't know what you mean" and leave it at that. If he wants to make himself understood, he will.

What is he like at work? Does he need to communicate to hold down a job, like most of us do. Talking in riddles and expecting you to 'read his mind' is ridiculous and would infuriate me, tbh.

Fairstive, how wouod you do that??
If I ask 'what do you mean?' he is turtning it around. So it ends up as either

• he is getting upset
• he insists on the first question, doesn't have the real question answered and gets ressentful
• keeps quiet, doesn't answer me at all, I am getting frustrated and upset.

One of the reason I have started asking 'probing' question is because he was saying something that wasn't the issue as such, wasn't answering my direct questions. I was getting frustrated and upset and it always looked (on the outside) that I was the one to look for an argument, get angry etc... because I was always the only one to say what I thought and he kept silent.
It took me a long time to realize that he was actually very aggressive even though he wasn't saying a word.

Only I would talk to him about it.

And if he won't talk about it, I would tell him that it was making me very unhappy and I would be having a serious think about whether this relationship was worth continuing.

I would say that regardless of how he meant it, I felt confused, disrespected and intimidated.

Personally, if he can't/won't talk to me in a civilised, sensible way then I would not be interested in being with him.

But if you want to try, I would agree that Relate might be able to help. Also, he should have some counselling on his own to sort out his communication problems.

Btw I was asking about his work because I wonder if he has this 'problem' with everyone, or is it just you? He could be doing it on purpose to control you and manipulate your behaviour.

I have no idea about work as he never talks about it..... but he hasn't been known to grumble because he didn't get some promotion as quickly as others so it might be that he is like this, to a lesser extend??, at work too.
But as for only using it 'for me', I actually don't think so.

We were at my PIL this we. H wanted to go. He just went and standed next to his mum wo saying a word. She picked up the clue, looked at him and asked 'Oh are you ready to go?'. That was it. Didn't say a word to her (or to me ). So I supposed that is an ingrained family way of expressing yourself??
This thread is actually a nice eye opener. I would prob not have noticed that before.