Mothers and daughters (or just me and my mum...)

[flyingcloud]

Ugh. Where to start.

My mother has just been staying with us for five days, helping us with DD as DH and I have been away for work.

She has gone home very upset with how we treat her (me mainly, DH keeps his feelings in check). She is right, I am so intolerant to the point of being horrible. She is a very vague, forgetful 70 (with no real concept of living in the real world). DH and I have stressful lives, DH has just started a new business and I am working full time, 30 wks pregnant and with a 22mo DD.

She is not sick - she has always been like this. She repeats herself non-stop, she asks the same questions over and over again. Once she gets an idea in her head she will keep at it. She is messy, she breaks things (despite us showing her how to use them each time she comes). She is generally great with DD but gets tired quickly. She leaves things lying around and doesn't really take all dangers into account (whereas others, such as the stairs, she goes on and on and on about). She walks all over the house with her muddy shoes. She makes a huge effort to be clean and tidy but leaves teabags and foodI out and lying around, not using chopping boards or bowls, etc.

I know this all sounds incredibly petty on my part and that is really why I am posting this. I am not overtly rude, but just impatient and often ignore her in a bid not to get snappy and snippy. DD adores her but walks all over her. DH is a tidy, organised person who struggles with her, but as I say keeps it all in check and is perfectly polite. Obviously as her daughter my tolerance and patience are much, much lower.

She went home very, very upset and while I haven't spoken to her my brother said he has and she feels very sad about our lack of respect for her. Which is partly true - she has never really had a job and has always been a fairly dependent person (she inherited money and property allowing her not to need to have a career but she has always needed people around to do stuff for her, she has been dependent on my brother and I for company, holidays and her life in general ever since our father died 16 years ago). She was nearly forty when I was born and we are of completely different generations and outlooks.

How do I address this? I am 30 and my general snippiness with her has only got worse over time. I need to sort it out before it is too late. Equally part of me feels that she doesn't make enough effort on her part (but is she really going to change at her age). I live abroad so don't see her that often, which again makes me feel like I am really an awful person.

You have my sympathies!

As much as I love my mum, she is very similar... Years ago, in my previous marriage, she came to stay for two weeks as she'd moved north, but still had friends and family near us in the south. Every tiny thing that aggravated me seems petty on its own, but after about 10 days of her stuff all over the place - particularly annoying were her many clothes hung on hangers over doorways, instead of going in wardrobes, so they didn't crease! Never mind that we were constantly knocking them down every time we went into the rooms! She'd take up half our tiny fridge space with loaves of bread, but the final straw was when she decided to cut her fingernails in the sitting/dining room while I was eating dinner - her cut nails pinged across the room into my food! Funny as it sounds, that was the final straw and we ended up having a massive row and I threw her out!

We're close again now, but even though she has four children of her own, I've had to constantly pick up full mugs of coffee and tea she leaves on the floor, etc...

I don't have any helpful advice to give, but just wanted you to know you're not alone!

But if you can't stand her company, I don't understand why you would have her to stay? No she won't change. You presumably asked her to come and stay - to help with your daughter. Could you not have found a way round this eg one of you simply could not go away as one of you had to be there to take care of your daughter?

Especially if you are concerned for your dd's safety in your mother's hands?

I'm struggling with your post as I'm not sure what advice you are looking for.

The only thing you can control or change is yourself. I think the thing you need to change is your attitude and control is your temper....

Your mother is your mother, it sounds like she has been ditsy and clumsy for years. Accept her for who she is.... if she loves you and supports you in your life that is really all you can ask from her. She came to help you and yet all you've done is complain about the things she hasn't done right. That seems so ungrateful. If she isn't fit enough to be of practical help then don't rely on her to provide it. Don't judge her on the way she's lived her life - you wouldn't like to be judged by someone else on the way you live yours.

Our parents are just people, flawed human beings that deserve our love and understanding and appreciation for all the things they have done for us. Don't be so quick to judge her.

Yikes, familiar patterns here. My nan had exactly the same thing of forgetfulness, repetitive conversation, clumsiness, not really making the effort to respect other people's boundaries/rules etc and she regarded any socialising outside family as not real socialising. Whenever she stayed with us there would generally be some sort of argument or barely concealed tension (and one memorable year a broken oven - don't ask). It wasn't her "fault" as such, she wasn't doing any of it to annoy, but boy did it wind my parents up.

Sorry, this is more empathy than practical suggestion! The only useful thing I could add (and I realise this may not be an option at all, and it would only work for visits not DC-sitting anyway) is that things got MUCH better when my nan bought a little flat locally to stay in when she visited us. She still spent all day of every day of the visit with us, but as a daytime visitor rather than house guest, and somehow it seemed to put up a behaviour boundary which hadn't been there before. That and my parents would quietly keep her away from breakables.

If I had an answer to the wider problem of redeveloping respect for someone you've fallen into a decades-long pattern of snippiness with, I'd unhesitatingly share it. But sadly I tend to agree with you that it's unlikely this type of person is going to be making much of the running. So any shift in attitude would have to come from you, and be as much for your own sanity and mental health as her feelings. Consider the future benefits. My dad at over 60 is still locked in this pattern with my nan to some extent, and now she's ill and it's just sad for all concerned.

Blimey....she has come to help you out and all you can do is pick??

I'd be worried about her health and metal state if it were my mother, and I am not surprised she is upset really.

You need to reign in the horridness and feel a lot more empathy I'd say.

...and I hate house guests at the best of time but she was only there to do you a favour!

Bloody hell, you're an ungrateful person. Are you for real? Next time pay someone to look after your daughter for you, it's not your mum's job.

"She repeats herself non-stop, she asks the same questions over and over again. Once she gets an idea in her head she will keep at it."

This really sounds like an age thing. At 30, you are in your prime, so perhaps find it hard to empathise with this. However, I'm nearing 50, and I can already find myself repeating things. By 70, I'm sure I'll be much worse.

OK, thanks all.

I appreciate all your replies, even the blunter ones. I realise that this is my problem. I promise you that I am not a horrible person though, I am particularly hormonal and have been very depressed this pregnancy. I am trying so hard to make a success of my life and probably can't see the wood for the trees.

She doesn't just come to help out. She comes to see DD. She doesn't like anyone else helping her when she comes to stay, she insists DD stays home from the childminder. I have offered to pay for someone to come in and help her, but then I am paying childminder fees (I have to pay when DD is absent as this is France), and then paying someone else too, but as I said she doesn't like it, she prefers to do it all on her own. This will change as her recent visit has highlighted.

DH and I have no choice about our work trips, we work in the same business and occasionally have to attend the same events away.

In common with LadyMedea, I'm struggling with your post too as you come across as being deeply unpleasant and ungrateful.

Your mother is 70? Of course she get tired. Women half her age can feel worn out by caring for a 22mth old. And of course your dd 'adores her' and 'walks all over her' - that's what doting grannies are for.

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Obviously as her daughter my tolerance and patience are much, much lower I'm not sure where you're coming from on this, other than to imply that you are within your rights to treat your mother with less respect than you'd show to hired help.

If that's your attitude to the woman whose tolerance and patience nurtured you to adulthood, I would suggest that next time you need help you hire it - and see how far others will tolerate your allegedly covert rudeness.

Your dm's visit was only 5 days duration. What joy did she get out of her trip, especially as presumably she won't be making another before Christmas? Did you at any time express pleasure at being in her company? Take her out for a first-rate meal, or otherwise show her that you were grateful for her help? Or were you as disparaging to her while she was your guest as you've been to her here?

Whenever I go away from home I'm filled with immense relief and gratitude to whoever has been in charge in my absence if my house and its occupants are all in once piece on my return. Muddy footprints - I have visions of you doing a Sherlock Holmes with a magnifying glass as soon as you got in your front door - can be wiped away in minutes, broken items repaired or replaced, or are you so anally retentive that you choose to cherish possessions more than people?

I'm not surprised your dm has returned home extremely upset by the way you've treated her. You were impatient with her and ignored her even though she did you an enormous favour by leaving the comfort of her home and travelling (how far?) to help you out.

Unbelievably, it seems you haven't even had the decency to give your elderly dm a call to make sure she got home safely.

If your dm's visit has left you feeling 'like I am really an awful person' it's because you know full well that you have behaved badly to her. And I guess the above will give you a clue as to what I think of you as a person.

"She comes to see DD. She doesn't like anyone else helping her when she comes to stay, she insists DD stays home from the childminder."
Your use of the word "insist" suggests you think she's being unreasonable. But if she's coming all that way, and DD goes to the childminder, she would be on her own in a strange place for no reason, so I can see her point there really.

I'm not really sure why you are so resentful of her and everything she does. You sound a little like a teenager. Did you not have a rebellious phase when you were growing up? Perhaps this is your repressed rebellion.

Having said that, it can be annoying having visitors.

OK, I get it. I deserve all of that but I am still really upset. But I guess I deserve that too.

I always show gratitude - I did buy her a small gift, which she didn't seem to like. It was an item of clothing that I thought she would like. This time I have just been too tired, too broke and too overworked to take her out, but we usually do when she comes to stay, regardless of whether she looks after DD or not. As I said DH has just started his own business, we are really stretched financially and DH is working really long hours.

I have (long prior to this visit) bought her an amazing Christmas present which I did because I knew it would make her happy, she has known about it for some time. That is another reason I didn't take her out as I have probably overspent on her present.

I get that it's wrong of me to try and defend myself but just to go a little further, the footprints have stained the carpet and she has broken the same thing three times, despite asking her not to use it and paying someone to come in and repair it on previous occasions. We are going to lose our deposit which we can't afford to do either. DH (who is a very tolerant and kind person) feels that she doesn't respect us or our belongings, because she has never had to work the way we do.

I think that people of that age are incredibly set in their ways and like their own routine, (in some ways like toddlers). My FIL is the same age and , lovely as he is, is hard work sometimes, there is a much bigger generational gap between us and him and us and our 21 year old DD, for example, even though the difference in years is exactly the same (25) .

I think you have to have a little more empathy and patience with her.

We took FIL to Egypt with us a couple of years ago and sometimes it was like having a toddler with us, he was out of his comfort zone and he leaned on us for everything, he did say he felt like a burden to us a couple of times but we did try very hard to not make him feel left out.
He will do anything to help us out and we are very grateful, my SIL takes advantage of his kindness however and uses him as an unpaid taxi service/child minder on a regualr basis.

Cretaceous - I get that, of course DD should be home when she is there - but it's not me insisting that she come and mind DD either, as others have implied. And it's not me insisting that she look after DD on her own.

She's probably not at all bothered by your spending/ amazing presents if she feels disrespected and sad.

I know you feel bad, but really your op is quite quite selfish.

I'd really want to investigate the dottiness just to reassure myself it's not something more sinister and the rest of it you HAVE to put down to generational differences and let it wash over you.

My ILs are kind, thoughtful people, that's not to say I am not driven to the edge of sanity when they visit, both late 70s now and they come for two weeks at a time as they are so far away, but it is my problem and I would be mortified if I felt they had felt sidelined and upset when they left.

Maybe you are just spreading yourself too thinly and have no tolerance left??

Oh God, I hope you are not my DD speaking from a place 30 years in the future. I can see all that being true of us (and I am 40 and she is 6mths old). Oh dear oh dear oh dear. I therefore advise you to be kind to her, (feel almost tearful at this vision of my lovely cuddly baby being so irritated with me in later life...)

I probably have become resentful of a lot of her characteristics, and while I am trying to preserve the relationship for her's and DD's sake I am doing a fairly crappy job at it.

She is a terrible snob for a start and has been very rude about my brother's girlfriend to me. My brother's girlfriend is a wonderful, intelligent, ambitious girl with a heart of gold so her snobbery is completely unfounded.

She has always slightly abused the kindness of others during her life, she has no qualms about turning up at friends' houses unannounced or inviting herself to stay. Throughout our childhoods it was always friends parents ferrying us about. I now have a complete horror of asking for favours to the point where my friends think I am a little strange, but I don't like putting other people out at all as I saw the reactions that she didn't see when we turned up yet again with a large suitcase for a long weekend. If ever we wanted to have friends over it was always a huge palaver and she would always complain if we wanted to go away and stay with friends. I was a rebellious teenager, but managed to never get caught. She was the queen of guilt trips.

But I admit that doesn't excuse my behaviour and I need to look past all of this, as she is a genuinely good person who doesn't lie, thieve, cheat or steal and has always loved us unconditionally.

You describe my grandmother. TBH, it sounds to me that this lady may be in the early stages of dementia.

You need to stop relying on her to help, invite her to visit by all means, but she is not to be used as child care, not solely. She is your mum and has raised you, you need to respect her for that.

You need to make the best decision for your DC, and that is to ensure they spend time with their GP and enjoy her company.

You do however need to look into child minders/au pairs.

Gosh not all of that makes sense, I am still crying pretty hard.

Her snobbery is unfounded in any situation, but it annoys me especially in the case of my brother's girlfriend as it is quite thinly veiled.

She never allowed us to go and stay with our own friends who were out of her own social circle, again snobbery.

Ah, cross post. You sound like there are more than a few issues you have with her actually. You ought to look at addressing them, as they appear unresolved. Some of your irritation may actually be rational afterall.

Not sure if Stately Homes may be an idea for a thread to have a look at. Her controlling nature with you seems to have been quite advanced.

I know how you feel flyingcloud - with me its my MIL. She comes to see DS, not me. She needs hand holding with everything and is also a very dependant person - firstly on her DH (FIL) then when they divorced, on her sons (my DH and BIL). Now my DH has passed away, it has fallen to BIL and me (to some extent).

It is nver the big things that irritate me - it's the little things - like her stuff all over the house - not in one place. Her hot drinks where DS can reach them. Her need to 'help' which ends up taking three times as long as if I had to do it, and then I'd have to re-do it anyway.

After all the little things, it ends being intolerable. You feel guilty, because they appear to be petty things - but they are hell.

Sorry no advice - just sympathy and

One day that will be you irritating your grown up children

you should try and be more tolerant

I really don't want to bring the other issues into it as I really feel it is my problem and it is not fair to try and blame her. She grew up with her own dysfunctional family.

I have worried about her mental state for a long time, but no one else does and I felt that it was just my intolerance, I don't want to be seen as looking for a scapegoat.

Thanks HM, I really don't feel like I deserve anybody's hugs right now. Other people's perspectives on this have held a fairly harsh light up to my own character.

I think you owe it to yourself to see if there IS an issue with her MH though, if nothing else to satisfy yourself that there is nothing else at play here.

I do sympathise with you, the situation you describe is frustrating beyond words.

DOn't feel too bad - I got similar reactions when I vented about my MIL. There is only so much tolernace you can have - and although there is a big backstory - there is only so much you can put up with when people visit in your home.

And although she may mean well, it doesn't negate your feelings. People who have nice normal parents don't always understand how restrictive people like this can be.

Chin up. You can only do your best - and DON'T negate your own feelings. You can't help feeling the way you do.