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Original poster

Family row - gay sister wants to 'borrow' cousin's DS for protest

51 replies

Rhinestone · 06/12/2011 21:37

Hi, family dilemma and I'm caught in the middle. All views appreciated!

My DSis is gay and currently a university student where she is very active in student politics and the LGBT group. Her group is planning some kind of rally / protest in the New Year at a local church which has apparently said it will never allow civil partnerships to take place when the new legislation comes in.

My DCousin has a 2 year old DS. Apparently my DSis left a message on cousin's answerphone asking if she could 'borrow' the DS for the day of the protest in order to highlight that LGB families are increasingly visible and they have DC too. Apparently she didn't so much 'ask' as 'tell' that she would be borrowing him. This is hearsay - I haven't heard the message myself.

My cousin has flipped out over this, mainly over the implication that my DSis thinks she has the right to tell her that she will be borrowing DS for a protest. However she is also unhappy about him being a prop and unhappy at him being at a protest like that. She worries it may be scary for a 2 yr old, it might turn violent and she is also worried about what he might see, i.e. same sex couples kissing - nothing wrong with that of course but she doesn't think it's age appropriate.

However DSis is assuming that cousin is being completely homophobic and has taken great offence and my mother and aunt had a row about it. I am very close to my cousin AND my DSis and am therefore trying to sooth feathers. I can see cousin's point of view and think she has the right to say no without giving a reason.

How do I mediate and try and calm my DSis down without making it worse? And yes, I could stay out of it but I want to help.

OP posts:
EmpressOfTheSevenSnowflakes · 06/12/2011 23:19

I'm a lesbian mum & I agree that your DSis is out of line. I get the impression she's never been responsible for him before? Do she & her friends have the slightest idea what looking after a 2-yr-old involves or do they think he's just going to spend the whole time being happy and well behaved for them?

SolidGoldVampireBat · 06/12/2011 23:27

She's being daft. I wouldn't take my own DC on any kind of demo, no matter how passionate I felt about it, unless and until DC are old enough to want to come of their own free will. I don't like seeing toddlers on demos anyway, they are people, not props and even a benign and placid demo can be alarming for a small child.

KRITIQ · 06/12/2011 23:59

Maybe this is too obvious, but wouldn't it have been better for your DSis to ask your cousin and her DS to come to the rally with her? If it's a family-friendly event (with stuff going on for kids), it should be okay for a toddler, but if it's not, he'll probably get bored and fussy and not be very happy so mega bad idea. Her request is badly thought out and rather silly. But, as for the child seeing same sex couples kissing - far better to see human beings showing love than hate, so that part of it shouldn't be an issue.

chipmonkey · 07/12/2011 00:02

I would almost let her take him. And then time how quickly she brings back the screaming toddler who ruined her day! Wink

But seriously, he's your cousin's child and what your cousin says goes. I wouldn't let my 3 year old go off with a bunch of students regardless of sexual orientation. The comment about the kissing did sound homophobic, the rest of it just sounds sensible.

And IMO, bringing a child who isn't yours and saying he is, does undermine your credibility.

Original poster
Rhinestone · 07/12/2011 00:45

Just to reiterate in fairness to my cousin, the 'seeing people kissing' objection is about very overt sexual behaviour as opposed to homophobia. I expressed it badly as I made it sound like it was purely about same-sex couples and not the behaviour in general.

Without outing myself even more than I have already the concern is over two guys in particular who are friends of my sis and thus known to the family. They are very 'in yer face' about their sexuality, which is absolutely their prerogative but they like to be fairly provocative and my cousin doesn't think their behaviour is appropriate in front of a 2 yr old. For what it's worth, I agree with her.

OP posts:
ModreB · 07/12/2011 07:10

It's not her choice. It is not her child. He is 2 years old FFS, and his parents have the absolute right to say where he goes, who he goes with and who he is around, regardless of the reasons.

I had to think very long and hard about taking DS3 on a protest march earlier this year, and he is 12 years old FFS

creighton · 07/12/2011 07:44

rhinestone, ask you sister what provisions she is going to make for your nephew on the day? how long will he be out in the cold? what if it rains? what food is she taking for him? what if he wants to go to the toilet? is she going to bring him home when he gets tired or frightened?

if she needs to have a child accessory for her political protests, tell her to rustle up one of her own.

Alouisee · 07/12/2011 07:52

I'd never take a child to a protest. Foisting adults views onto a 2 year old is bullying behaviour.

Bossybritches22 · 07/12/2011 08:01

Agree with others here the issue is taking a 2 year old to a protest in possibly nasty weather with lots of strangers around being noisy & his mum nowhere in sight.

It does make me cross when the homophobic card,like the racist card, is used in such a flouncy way merely because someone is told something they don't agree with.

Tell her to have a good protest & ignore the sulks, the child is not hers ...end of.

difficulttimes · 07/12/2011 08:57

Using a 2year old child as a 'prop' and a misleading one at that in a protest that may turn violent, even if it isnt lots of riled people shouting may be scary in itself, Is quite a bad idea tbh

No way on earth would I allow a very young child of mine to attend a protest, they are unpredictable that is the nature, I can understand how anyone could risk a toddler getting caught up in that.

However saying same sex couples kissing isnt age appropriate IS a homophobic thing to say IF she thinks its okay to see staight couples kissing.

difficulttimes · 07/12/2011 08:58

Sorry read the Overt Kissing bit, I agree tbh.

QuintessentiallyFestive · 07/12/2011 09:03

What does your sister think about beggars who borrow children to sit on the london underground, or outside stations begging for money? They use children as prop to get more money. Is this ok?

What she is proposing is even worse. I would imagine it is far more scary for the child to be at a rally than spending a day sitting on somebodys lap.

I think your sister sound incredibly stupid and ignorant and self-centered be honest.

She has as little interest in your cousins child, as your cousin naturally has in your sisters cause.

DeckTheHugeWithBoughsOfManatee · 07/12/2011 09:06

I am fervently pro equal marriage rights.

Your sister is being ridiculous though. A child is not a toy, and in any case how does borrowing the child of a straight couple in any way highlight increased visibility of LGB families?

If her thinking is this muddled and her view of the small boy this egocentric and instrumentalist I would question the likelihood of her remembering to feed him, keep him warm, check his nappy if necessary etc. Your cousin is absolutely right to tell her to eff off.

QuintessentiallyFestive · 07/12/2011 09:08

They should find some "real" LGB families willing to put their children through this, if it is that important. Hmm

Parading somebody elses child, highlights nothing but a bunch of morons.

ScrambledSmegs · 07/12/2011 09:13

Do you think your sister has already told the group that she would be bringing your cousin's child, and so thinks she's going to look silly now? It might explain why she's getting so angry and accusing perfectly reasonable people of homophobia.

I think she's being very childish. And I agree with everyone here that using a child as a prop is revolting, no matter what the cause is.

kikibo · 07/12/2011 13:05

Well, while she is completely in her right to go and protest and while it is probably not 'damaging' to a 2 yo to see same sex people kissing, whether naked or not (won't make a difference to him anyway), and while your cousin is totally in control about what happens to her son (I would hope so), I am slightly confused at what the benefit would be to your sister if she took him.

Fine, gay couples exist and have children (either from themselves or adopted) and so they should. However, what does it matter whether your sister takes her nephew? He has an aunt who is gay. And?? So in the end he as an argument is irrelevant, really.

And, besides he is not a dog you take out for the day to where you want. He is a person.

What would she say if you were to say that she was going to come to something you wanted to go to next week?

Beside which, people shouting is kind of scary for a small child.

BurntToffee · 07/12/2011 13:17

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HoudiniHissy · 07/12/2011 13:26

Your Dsis is using the LGBT card to bully you, your mum, aunt and cousin. Reverse homophobia in action tbh.

Tell her straight that sexuality has NOTHING to do with it, but that the child is 2 and it is too young to go to a mass event without his mother.

Your sis needs telling that if she wants to go around insulting the family, go right ahead, but that it's HER that is in the wrong and EVERYONE knows about it.

Refuse to discuss in future. your Cousin needs to say NO. and give no further reason tbh and not discuss it further. Your Sis can think what she likes.

I bloody HATE bullies.

fuzzynavel · 07/12/2011 13:32

She wants to "borrow" a toddler to take to a demo? Oh my god, total nut job Shock

BurntToffee · 07/12/2011 13:52

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BurntToffee · 07/12/2011 13:59

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pollyblue · 07/12/2011 14:01

Perhaps you should show your Dsis this thread and point out that all the posters say it's a bad idea, because the child is too young to be at an outdoor protest of any description. The subject of the demo is neither here or there.

FWIW, your cousin doesn't have to justify her decision, he's her child so it's entirely up to her if he goes. Hell would freeze over before my toddlers were taken to a demo.

There's also 2 or 3 of us who are gay and still think it's a bad idea - are we homophobic too? Grin

Original poster
Rhinestone · 07/12/2011 14:59

Don't worry, it ain't happening! Cousin is adamant and couldn't give a toss what DSis thinks. I completely agree with DCousin, just wanted to get DSis to see her point of view - mainly for DSis's own benefit, so she doesn't alienate people in the family as DCousin, cousin's DH, DAunt and various other family members thinks she's being a complete idiot.

Yes, she is rather immature and naive and thinks her cause is the absolute most important thing EVER and if you're not with her you're obviously deeply homophobic and part of the problem etc. Tbh, as much as I'm pro-LGB rights, she is becoming a right royal PITA, mainly because she doesn't see that anyone else, like a 2 yr old and his parents, have any rights.

Thanks for the unanimous views, she'll just have to get over it.

OP posts:
HoudiniHissy · 07/12/2011 16:05

he he, her being gay won't stop her being a PITA!

maypole1 · 07/12/2011 17:51

I dot understand why she is protesting dose she want to get married in a church?

Tell her when she has her own sprog she can take it to as many protests as she wants

Tell your cousin their nothing to be worried about if her child sees two women kissing he will see far worse on tv