Please tell me about the 'balance' in your relationship...

[blueskydrinking]

...and does it work for you?

And did you have to work hard to get it that way or did it just evolve?

I mean in terms of responsibilities, who does what, where your balance lies in terms of family/home/work responsibilities.

As you might suspect, I'm feeling a bit frustrated in this area at the moment, but I'd love to hear other people's experiences first because it tends to come to a head when I'm pregnant/breast feeding(/knackered) and I'm not sure how much is just down to hormones.

TIA

oh and i do all the cooking too lol he has it pretty easy but it works 75% of the time (when i can think without hormones buzzing around) hehe

we no longer co habit and the balance is perfect, I have waaaaay more free time :)

Myself and a lot of female friends my age are very very frustrated with this very problem (too many verys!). It seems like we've fallen into these roles as carers when in actual fact we a) dn't want to do housework/cooking/cleaning/sorting our DH's stuff out etc and b) aren't even particularly good at it.
I work fewer hours than DH (though I bring in the same amount of money, so it's not like he's "the breadwinner") and still everything falls to me. The thing that relly grinds my gears is the childcare issue. It's basically my problem, and h'll try and help if work allows. I have plan my schedule and phone around getting emergency cover so i KNOW DS is going to be taken care of. To DH it's optional; my department.
He's actually a brilliant dad and does DSs bedtime routine almost every night, but I'm so pissed off with myself for falling into this pattern. I have tried to address it a few times but it always ends up the same.

DH and I don't have any set tasks or responsibilities, except that he nearly always does bathtime and I do the bedtime story. Other than that, if there's a job that needs doing whoever notices or is available first will do it. If the house is a mess we'll both pitch in to get it tidy, or one of us will take the DDs out for a bit so that the other one can get on with the housework. At the moment I'm on maternity leave while DH works full time, so I try to do most of it. But if I had a difficult day with DD2 and didn't get stuff done, he would completely understand. In the same way, if I know he's had a long or stressful day at work, I'll try to make sure he gets to relax while I cook or tidy up.

Our house is by no means a show home but it's reasonably clean, I think we have a fairly even balance and there's never any resentment between us

Perplexed - yes, I know what you mean. I'm about to go on maternity leave, and will return mid-2012. DH will, at around the same time, finish up his contract with a university and in all probability take on a less flexible job that he's had for years. So the thing that will change - apart from having two children instead of one - is that his ability to do drop-off and pick-up from nursery, which he's currently in the better position to do, will alter. My job won't change from the way it is now.

Guess which one of us is already thinking about how that will affect the current childcare arrangements and starting to look into whether a nanny is more cost-effective and whether a different nursery will be needed?

Sorry, *than he's had for years. Being a PhD student means that he's been very flexible for years and we've been able to juggle work and sick days and things very very easily.

The list:

DH:

Works full time.
Takes bins out
DIY
Occasionally loads dishwasher/tidies kitchen
Baths DH each evening
Is allegedly cooking evening meal for the pair of us while I'm pg - we'll see what happens tonight!
Takes his turn with the food shopping and is more inclined to buy the 'big' shops.

Me:
Work 3 days a week, take care of our son on the other days.
Even when both at home, seem to be primarily responsible for DS, although this may be of my own making.
Responsible for nursery drop-offs and pick-ups
Take the bins out about as often as he loads the dishwasher!

Take care of all DS related appointments, organisation, buying clothing etc.
Sort out night-time wake ups and early mornings with very few exceptions.
Do the day-to-day tidying, cleaning, washing, cleaning up after and feeding DS. Generally keeping our home in order. Which is relentless with a toddler!!

So it's not that he's lazy... I think I just want a bit of TLC while I'm feeling so crap, tbh. It would be good if the balance could tip the other way for a while, or if he just left some of the bizarre DIY stuff he comes up with and helped on a practical level for a while.

My DH works full time about 90 minutes away and I go to uni and work 4 days a week so we do share most of the tasks and chores - I cook and keep the place generally clean and tidy, he does the washing at weekends and will always hoover on a Saturday, as for looking after DS I do most stuff but he does bath him - we do joke that there are chores that I do and he does (such as dishes and bin-emptying)

The only major thing we came to blows over, or used to until I won, was the day-off thing, he always thought that he should have a day off to himself at the weekend because he worked all week - because I left later and get home earlier (because I drive) he didn't ever click about me being out 4 days a week or with DS 24 hours a day for 3 days - so we settled that by saying that wed take it in turns to have a lie in each weekend - but as our DS will sometimes sleep in too it kind of went out the window - obviously if he's had a bad week I'll let him have an hour or so to rest or lie in and that goes for me too.

It ends up being swings and roundabouts though - just stuff you work out along the way, but if you want an equal balance sometimes you do have to be firm with certain men who think a women should cook, clean, shag and shutup - my cousin has one of them and after 7 years together that's basically what she does - I personally couldn't stand for it, but that's their choice and probably a whole other thread!

perplexedpirate I completely agree about the childcare. And yep, tortoise I was the one trawling round nurseries / childminder & nanny lists to find suitable childcare...

pozzled I wish we were more like that. It's very lucky I think, for there to be no resentment there.

It's not the work really is it?
It's the fact that you are unable to have a discussion about it without him throwing a strop.

That's a big pain. And in the long run very serious.
Many of us here have experienced the same in abusive relationships - where things start to get really bad when children arrive. Up until that point, it's sort of managable to run the house with little support.
It's a different thing when you are exhausted and vunerable.

Have a think about it - are you going out of your way not to nag/go on because you are afraid of his reaction?

I don't think who-does-what should be linked to income. If you earn 30% of the family income I don't think that means you should necessarily do 70% of the household jobs. Surely it should be down to time - if you work (including commute) 30% of the hours of your other half, you should do 70% of the housework. Actually that's a bit simplistic isn't it, it might be that housework 30% of a paid job + 80% housework adds up to the same as a 100% job and 20% housework. Or whatever. But you should have roughly the same number of hours of work. But then one job may be more stressful and need more corresponding downtime.

I'll stop now .

I I suppose its 50/50 in our house. There has never been any discussion regarding who does what. If I?m at home (I only work 3days a week) I clean, if I have time, sometimes the house is spotless sometimes it is just liveable. If I get everything or nothing done doesn?t matter- dh gets home and is happy, if there washing/dishes/baby bathing to do, he slots straight back into family/home life and gets on with it. He knows how hard it is looking after the dc and that means sometimes nothing gets done. If I have done things great it means we?ll sit down together that much sooner that evening. When he has the dc alone when I?m at work its the same. He?ll do what he can and we?ll do the rest together.
Although for all that we have had to have a word re the cooking. And like your dh, to mention any grievance is to insult my dh gravely, and always ends in an argument as he sees any dissatisfaction as a personal attack and that he?s at fault. He gets very defensive, and suddenly resorts to telling me how lucky I am and that ?most? women aren?t as lucky a me to have dhs that do as much as he. Needless to say this attitude gets a short shrift and I can argue with the best of them- if that?s how he wants it. Personally id rather a civilised discussion, but it would appear that he doesn?t. With the cooking I realised that Now that I have two dcs and us to feed I don?t want to do ALL the meals ALL the time. Previously if he was alone with the dc while I was at work I would prepare their dinners in advance/put something in the slow cooker. Now I demand that he does the cooking for us on 1 day a week. Still not equal- but better

We both work ft, i earn more. Chores are pretty much split, although i do a lot of the 'remembering' side of the childcare for our DS (11 months) such as getting his stuff sorted for the CM the night before or making/ keeping various appointments, but that's mainly because DH is very forgetful and DS would get there with half his stuff missing or wouldn't get his vaccinations on time. We take turns bathing and feeding him so we both get a rest and both also get to spend some nice time with DS too. I was the one who got up in the night with him because i BF him and was on mat leave until 9 months. I still get up on the rare occasion he wakes up during the night and can't re-settle. We share the cooking. I shop for food, because DH just drives me mad if he comes with me. Again, he doesn't tend to food shop alone as he'd come back with things we don't need and forget the things we do. I also work from home 2 days a week and take care of DS on those afternoons as he comes home from the CM at lunchtime. I feel like i do most of the 'juggling' purely because of my flexible working full time arrangements, but DH is really very good for the most part, although does sometimes need a gentle reminder (such as "i'm not home till 7 tonight, please can you prepare/ cook dinner, get DS into the bath and prepare tomorrow's sandwiches?")

stoprainingplease that's a lot of maths :)

It's true that I'm as irritated about not being able to chat to him about it (without it turning into a drama) as I am about anything else. I can also argue as well as the next person, but the arguments are ridiculous (end up being about who said what and how and not even about what we were talking about in the first place) and then we have to recover from that before we even start to deal with the problem and I just haven't got the patience. It IS weird.

If I try to be diplomatic it just doesn't seem to be sink in. I brought up the nights thing the other week - pointed out that DS would need to be used to being settled by DH so that he didn't feel abandoned by me when the new baby comes - and we didn't argue and he did get up... once. And now appears to have forgotten the entire conversation.

It's strange isn't it that, very often, when both parents are in the house with the DC, the mother is somehow "responsible" for the DC

I think tortoise summed it up on page 1. You don't sit on your arse if the other person still has jobs to do

In our house it has never been about either of us having specific jobs, we just do what we know needs doing until it is all done. It does sometimes take some readjustment when circumstances change ie children/ job circs, but the same principles apply.

And BTW if it doesn't happen naturally then I don't know what the answer is. It must be extremely frustrating!

Have you considered going down the "we need to talk" route? That usually scares the bejesus out of them!

Just as your DH is leaving the house to go to work, you say "we need to talk, can we sit down tonight after the kids have gone to bed?" refuse to go into any more detail and leave him to stew on that all day.

When you finally do get to sit down with him, say calmly "we can't go on like this" and then pause for as long as you can manage.

He'll probably start asking questions but you need to look him in the eye and explain "if you moved out and lived on your own you would have to do ALL your own cooking, cleaning, washing, ironing, your half of the childcare, food shopping, school pick ups, homework helping DIY, gardening, kid baths and bedtime, dog walking (add in every job you do). Our marriage and partnership gives you the opportunity to live here with your family who loves you and do only half of that, which I think is a pretty good deal. If you don't think the same, there's the door. I won't be discussing this again, you either change the way you behave and stop treating me like your servant, or you can leave and I will have one less person to pick up after."

If he's a decent guy who is committed to your marriage he'll probably be so pleased that you are just p-ed off about housework that he'll happily pitch in, and if you see him slacking in future a big sigh and some muttering about packing a bag for him should gee him up.

Problem is you can only do this once, and you you need to mean what you say, but if you're at the end of your tether it's worth considering.

DP works full time.

I mumsnet look after 18month old DD2 and DS2, who has Autism.

I do 90% of the cleaning, laundry, cooking, gardening, organising finances and day-to-day household stuff.

When DP gets home from work, he takes over with DS2, who needs continuous one-to-one looking after, while I cook the dinner (My choice. He's a lousy cook, while I love cooking, and besides, it's a break from DS). DP does bath and bedtime routines with the kids.

Night-times (DS is up half the night, and DD is still BF) are shared. DP tends to settle DS, while I'm in charge of DD. I get a lie-in Sat and Sun. on Doctor's orders. I have Lupus, and a host of other auto-immune conditions, which are exacerbated by stress and lack of sleep.

DIY is split 50-50, as is shopping. We both get an equal amount of 'me time'.

I'm a SAHM to 2 boys (3 & 11mths) and DH runs his own business. He will generally work at every opportunity but he can also be very flexible with his hours.

I get up with the baby in the night (godawful sleeper) and DH gets up with the toddler in the morning. He does breakfast with the kids but then generally doesn't see them for the rest of the day. I do most of the household chores but we share cooking and he'll do all the DIY and is in charge of the garden. At weekends, he often takes the kids out so I can study or have a break. We also have a cleaner once a fortnight so I don't feel a total slave to the housework.

We both go out as and when we want and he's very supportive of my studying. I think we have a very good balance overall because I will not tolerate anything less and he is well aware that without me at home his work life would be almost impossible.

Watching this with interest. My partner works from 10 til about 8 every day - I work 11 - 6 and then twice a week an extra hour in the morning 8 - 9. Everything ends up falling to me, unless I ask him to do stuff and even then, he doesn't always do it. Occasionally he'll do all the dishes. I've given up doing his laundry.

The thing is, I don't mind doing more - he pays more rent, he does work longer hours. But he works in the media, and if he's having a bad day, he can chill out at his desk, relax and stuff. I'm a teacher - I'm "on" all the time. The only time I get 5 minutes is if I set my students a group or individual task. I am constantly knackered. So while I will happily do dinner every night and make lunch for the next day, I DO NOT want to spend my evening cleaning.

He doesn't "see" his own mess, just mine. I am trying to sort this situation out, have started by not doing the laundry, and have made a rota. I know he's willing to sort it out too, just taking us some time.

Lord, when I read these threads it makes me want to weep.

Can we all just agree that these poor put upon posters whose partner's are using them as personal surfs can print off and demand the following tonight:

'YOU ARE A FREELOADER AND A TWONK - UNLESS YOU MAN UP AND START PULLING YOUR WEIGHT WITH THIS FAMILY YOU CAN GO AND LIVE IN THE FUCKING SHED AND LIVE ON MUSHROOMS/NETTLE TEA OUT OF THE GARDEN, I AM NOT YOUR FUCKING MOTHER'.

Nail it to the front door and refuse to let them in until they grow up. You all deserve so so much more.

Can I just say stoptherot's post has made my entire year. Nearly spat out my tea I was laughing so much at the thought of pinning it to the door

runs away to print out 100 copies to disribute to friends and relatives

LOL at 'surfs'