Ex-DP - need advice

[CardyMow]

I have been in an on-off relationship with Ex-DP for over 12 years. Brief history: We got together when he was 23, I was a single mum of 17. While I was working, he was having an EA (at the time I thought it was more) with the next-door neighbour. Forgave, we moved, he moved out into a flat-share without leaving me, I fucked up and cheated on him (revenge, at the time, for the thing with the neighbour), we split up. We'd been together for 18 months.

We got back together 6 months later, his depression (which he's always had, but has good times and bad times) got worse, we split up after another 6 months.

We were apart for 3 yrs, in which time I got married and had DS1, then divorced when I found out Ex-H was cheating on mewith a so-called friend (Karma?). I got back with Ex-DP almost straight away, and fell pg with DS2. We were together for 2-ish years that time, but he couldn't cope with my dx of epilepsy, and me 'needing' him, we split up.

Got back together after a yr apart. Then my epilepsy got worse, he couldn't cope, so a yr later we split up again.

We were then apart for 2 yrs, and after I split up with a very abusive (physically, sexually and emotionally) partner, Ex-DP 'caught' me while I was still recovering, and chased me until I gave in, basically. We got back together, I had DS3, then Ex-DP walked out again when DS3 was 4 months old.

Every time he leaves, he instantly bcomes the person I fell in love with again, so when he chases me and promises me things will be different, his depression is better, etc, I cave and take him back. But within a couple of months of us being back together, he reverts back to falling asleep as soon as he gets in from work, arguing, making me feel like I'm going mad, making threats that he'll leave me if he can't spend at least one day out of his 2 days off a week with his Mum (without me as she hates me), Letting his Mum treat me like a total c*nt and never standing up for me with her blah blah blah (don't want to drip feed but on this thread I will probably have to).

As soon as he has walked out, he starts offering to help, coming round to mow the lawn, giving me a break from the dc, doing housework for me etc. I think that he doesn't mind doing it when we're apart as it makes HIM look 'nice', but he wont do ANYTHINGH when we live together, as it's expected of him.

Sorry for long post. The question is, he's being SO nice and helpful right now, do I forgive him for treating me like a slave when DS3 was newborn, and walking out and leaving me when I refused to be treated like that when DS3 was only 4 months old? He is saying he wants to get back with me and take things slowly, but I think deep down, he'll never be able to cope with a live-together relationship, and I will never be truly happy with a part-time relationship. (Which I told him bluntly before we got back together LAST time). BUT, so help me god, I'm wavering when he's being so nice and helpful and has told me he wants to get back together. We've only been aprt for 11 weeks. Help me be strong, and figure out WHY this keeps happening.

Should also add, I had an AMAZINGLY awful childhood, has affected me for years, but leaves me with low self esteem, and some 'unusual' coping techniques. He ALSO had a bad childhood, and we BOTH have Narc mothers. I have learnt to keep mine at (very) arms length, he hasn't.

Sorry for length, and thank you for any advice / help.

Of course he can take the baby out, for an hour or so. He just brings him back if he needs fed. It doesn't have to be that difficult (I EBF). You feed him before he comes round to take the kids out, off he goes, any trouble back they come.

It seems like you're throwing your hands up as though you don't have any choice about it, but you do - it's your home. You have the choice to let him in or not. It seems clear that if you keep engaging with him you will keep getting on that same roundabout you've been on for years and years.

I'm sure it's quite convenient for him to come round, offer to help out and have those opportunities to get to the shops or relief when you're sick, but in your particular situation where you keep getting drawn back into an unhealthy relationship, ultimately it keeps you in his thrall.

I know. And I have read another thread on this board today that has made me 'see sense' a bit, that lady puts me to shame with how strong she has been.

Problem is, none of us drive, so if Ex-DP took dc out, he would have a 40 min bus journey to town, which means that if DS3 needed a feed, then it would be at least 40 mins before he could get him back to me. And a park isn't going to work for DS2, as DS2 is SN, and again, the only sn accessible park equipment is in the town centre, a 40 min bus ride away. It's not so much ME throwing up problems, as there genuinely BEING problems.

I want to draw some boundary lines, and not let him in etc, but say, when I needed to get my tooth removed yesterday - I have no family support (aforementioned Narc mum, and Dad committed suicide 20 yrs ago), so if I need the dc looked after, unless I can find 3/4 DIFFERENT friends to farm the dc out to one each, (DD and DS2 are SN), then I have no choice but to rely on him sometimes.

See, I REALLY don't want to 'crack' this time, but HOW do I do it? What about if I have a seizure? I would HAVE to call him to look after the dc, other friends that used to do it drifted away when my epilepsy was worse and I was single previously, thye had had enough. Friends I have now are willing in principle to help, but it's not like I can be phoning 3-4 people asking each if they can look after a dc, is it? Not when I'm barely concious after a sz.

So, to summarise - I have epilepsy, DD is SN, DS1 is ok, DS2 is SN, and DS3 is 7mo. No family support at all. Friends unwilling / unable to have more than one dc each due to space. If I DON'T call on him when I am ill, who the heck do I call? Is there someone else, like an agency I haven't tried? (Not SS, been there, their adults with disabilities team is as much use as a chocolate teapot in my area)

I am trying not to get pulled in by it all. It's just hard to stay strong. Which he knows.

How would I know if he had been having an affair? It's just the more threads I read about that on this board, the more I 'recognise' Ex-DP's behaviour while we were together IYSWIM. When he left, he set a date to leave, then decided to try to leave it for a while, but I said no, as we'd told the dc, and I didn't want them any more confused.

He didn't start all this trying to nice and helpful crap until I started going round my friends' houses more, and he got told by a firend that was on the same bus as me that the bus driver had asked for my phone number. (I didn't give it to the bus driver BTW, I want to be on my own and focussing on the dc for now). Within 24 hrs of that happening, he had TOTALLY changed.

To cut the problem right down - far more than it deserves - you and three of your four kids have special needs. The baby because he's a baby, and you because if you fit when you're alone with the kids, bad things might happen. You cannot rely on family, it's all a bit much for friends to take on, and you've got a pair of willing hands in XP. Only he's worse than useless as support, really, since he "can't cope" with inconveniences like staying awake after work, feeding the baby or taking care of his epileptic partner while she comes to.

You are in a bind! I can really see how it feels like you have to accept XP's help, superficial though it is. But you realise that, the more you accept it, the more dependent on his presence you become and the less likely you are to forge a successful life without him.

You really need to be able to source some other support and ditch this nutcase for good, don't you? I wish I knew where to get that help. But I suspect you'll try even harder if you stop, once and for all, thinking dear old XP can step if if needs be. He won't, will he, when you really are in need?

Please go back to all the agencies you tried before, and keep going back. Public services seem to work on a "Say No First" basis, wrong as that is. Join every group you can, contact outreach programmes, join forums and contact community projects. Make friends. You can do it!

I really hope people will be along with specific suggestions :) You are on the SN board here, aren't you?

Good luck.

I pootle about on SN occasionally, usually when looking after the dc gets too much and I need a dose of sanity! I have tried more than once to get help from other agancies - SS did a care assessment on me 5 years ago, told me what help I needed, then told me they didn't have the money to provide it. . when I complained, they said they had to deal with the most severe cases and I'm not as I can cope, day-to-day.

I go to a support group for parents of asd dc once a month, but I can't access the epilepsy support group, it's two bus journeys away, and doesn't finish till 9.30pm. By the time I had caught the first bus, the last bus from town to my house would have gone. Epilepsy action assume everyone with epilepsy has a partner that can drive. .

And oh god, yes, I DO need to get him out of my life, (and tbh he IS a bit of a nutcase, no thanks to his mother).

But HOW? I wish I could wave a magic wand and sort it out. But he 'grabbed' me when I was a 17yo single mum, had not even LEFT the care system due to crap childhood, and it's so hard to take that final step away from someone you have basically spent your whole dysfunctional adult life with, when you don't know any different. While the rose-tinted glasses have gone, it is just, I don't know, easier to 'give in' and let him come back. Even though I KNOW it's not the right thing to do.

I kept trying not to let myself be drawn in 2 years ago after I split up with a different, abusive ex, but I was too weak to say no. He offered to take the dc and I on holiday...and I felt obliged to get back with him. (The dc had NEVER been on holiday). Due to the contraception probs, I fell pg with ds3. Now I'm in an even worse position than I was 2 years ago.

I had no time (3 months) to recover from the abusive relationship before I fell headlong back into a relationship with Ex-P, despite me telling him repeatedly to back off and give me time. Now we have only been apart for 11 weeks this time, and he's already trying it again. I just don't ever get enough time to 'build myself up' so that I can remain strong when faced with the support that I need. Even though that support gets withdrawn as soon as he has his feet under the table, so to speak.

I'm sorry, I hadn't fully understood the background.

I think as garlic said you need to go back to the agencies that should be supporting you. Write to your MP and/or local papers? They even agreed you should have something in place, so I think you have to keep at them. I know it takes a hell of a lot of energy emotionally , but it's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease.

Are there any charities that deal with the specific SN your children have? Have you explained your difficulties getting to the Epilepsy support meetings? There are sometimes local initiatives like community car drivers to enable non-drivers to get to appointments/meetings etc? Maybe you should post in SN and see what help might be out there?

I also think you should talk to Women's Aid about counselling regarding your abusive relationship history, so that you can make it truly history.

Btw, you shouldn't be grateful for the ex's help & it shouldn't be conditional on having a relationship - he is your dc's father, he owes them support.

You know what it's like when you get rid of a neglected toy, and as soon as DC notices it's gone they make a big fuss? You say "You never play with it!" and they go "Waah! But I love it!" Your ex is a bit like that with you, isn't he? Not bothered as long as you're on the shelf gathering dust, but suddenly attached if you go out of his grasp, so to speak.

Because of this, and because you're floundering a bit on your own, I second buzzsore's advice to call Women's Aid. This childish behaviour is typical of a certain kind of abuser; WA know all about it. If you can get on the Freedom Programme (it's free), that should prove massively helpful to you in finding out what's reasonable in a relationship and what to be wary of.

Added to which, Women's Aid might be able to mobilise a bit more support for you. I really, really want to encourage you to try every avenue, keep going back, and to ask for help in getting help! You're a poster girl for the kind of circumstances social support is supposed to help with. You need and are entitled to assistance. It's shocking that you've been fobbed off, so please keep asking. And ask Women's Aid, too. They can pull strings sometimes :)

I totally agree that it's like your toy analogy - the minute he hasn't got me, he wants me again. To sit there not so much gathering dust as running around doing everything. And being a bloody doormat for him to wipe his feet on.

I should have known that something was odd with him when I had to teach him how to wash his own hair when he was 23. His mother had still been doing it for him. . In my defence, I was only 17 then, and in the intervening 12 years, I have taught him all the self-care things he needed to know, how to use a washing machine, how to live, basically.

He's now asking me to teach him how to budget, as even mummy is refusing to help him this time (he's bloody 36, I'm not surprised). He has NO idea how to pay the bills and still leave enough money to buy food at the end of the month. Yesterday he asked me how much money should he allow himself for shopping??!! How should I know,, last time I was only shopping for one person, a pint of milk was only 17p!

When you say that this type of behaviour is typical of a certain type of abuser, could you give me some links to read about it, some further info? I know deep down that the way he treats me is abusive, but don't know how to 'quantify' it IYSWIM, and when we are together, he tells ME that I'm the abusive one, that I've got mental issues, I'm not right in the head, witholds affection, etc.

The one that sticks in my head the most, was mid-argument, about him not seeing Mummy enough (once a fortnight for the entire day, ON HIS OWN wasn't enough), was that he "Didn't want to sit in four walls staring at my ugly mug all day". DS3 was only 11 weeks old. Niiiiiiiice.

He hadn't initiated sex since I was pg. In fact, we'd been back together almost 2 years, and we had had sex 5 times. In two years. And I have quite a high sex drive, and felt rejected when he doesn't even bother. Made me feel like a big fat ugly frump.

Don't know if you've read this but you might find some of his behaviour there.

And telling you you're the one who is abusive, telling you you've MH issues etc is classic, textbook.

Also, tell him to look for adult learning/life skills courses. He's not your child to teach budgeting etc, you're not responsible for him.

The 'forgetting' thing stands out, tbh if Ex-DP was as 'forgetful' as he claimed to be when we were together, I'd be concerned about alzheimers. The 'justifying' thing, too - when he has spoken to me since he walked out, and he decided he wants me back, he has first admitted he was 'a c*nt to me', and that he was sorry, but he was putting too much of himself into work, work was really a strain.Then he told me that he thinks some of his porblems were caused by side effects from his AD's, and then that almost ALL of the way he was was down to the SE's from the AD's, and now he wasn't taking them, he'd be fine, and that work was much easier now he wasn't 'trying' so hard there. here's ALWAYS an excuse, a way of making it sound like it was beyond his control, the way he was.

Definately tells me, often, that I'm the only good thing in his life, and he couldn't cope if I wasn't in his life any more. And my friends were encouraging me to get back with him, because he's such an 'all-round nice guy'. But they never see the side of him that is sullen, miserable, angry and all the rest.

'Cool job opportunity' - was insistent on going back to catering college at 36, when we had 4 dc, couldn't afford it, when I pointed this out - I was holding him back, and stopping him from fulfilling his dream, why was I being nasty saying that catering was a young person's job and he was too old (How many bosses would employ a 38yo with no exp over an 18yo in catering?).

He used to argue with me that the house was a mess because I didn't get the dc to do their 'fair share' which to him meant that the dc did MORE than HE did??!! Or that I was being lazy (with 4 dc, 2 of them SN, one a tiny baby, and having a disabiltiy myself...)

He repeatedly threatened to leave me if he didn't get his own way over things (trivial or larger matters). He always erm, how do I put it? Discounted my feelings, like if he had fallen asleep when I had asked him to look after DS3 so I could have a bath (he was falling asleep so deeply, whilst holding him, that I couldn't leave them together without watching like a hawk to make sure that DS3 wasn't dropped, when DS3 was 6wks old, I literally had to RUN across the room and catch him), butv I Should have bathed in the day when Ex-DP was at work ,as it was unreasonable to expect him to stay awake after work to hold DS3, as Ex_p was tired. I was lucky to get a bath every 2 weeks, as he wouldn't even let me take DS3 up to the bathroom in the bouncy chair, as it was HIS job to look after the baby so I could have a bath - whivch he then proceeded NOT to do safely. but I was werong to want a bath that often - or after the older dc were in bed, or at any time TBH. Argument I never won, that one!

When I was getting attention due to being pg, or having a new baby, he would 'withdraw' and either become sullen or quiet, or just fall asleep within 5-10 mins of getting in from work, leaving me to do everything.

Arguments would always start out with me asking him, reasonably, why he was treating me like this, and he would get angry, and shout and yell, or just be...obtuse? And when I got angry and shouted at him, it was always ME who had caused the argument. Whenever I would calmly explain that he had hurt my feelings, he would say he didn't INTEND for that to happen, and just COULDN'T see that even if he had hurt my feelings unintentionally, my FEELINGS WERE STILL HURT AND I STILL HAD A RIGHT TO BE UPSET! (BIG problem). And when I got angry with him for refusing to accept I was upset - I was being irrational.

And HE was allowed to get angry with me, but I wasn't allowed to get angry with him, if I DID, then I was a mental case, or I was being irrational, or I was being abusive.

And the getting upset by his 'bad memory'...YYY. AND he would blame it on trouble at work stressing him out.

You asked for links, Loudlass. I recommend all the links and book titles posted in the first page of this thread.