Why the fuck do I have to be nice!?!

[WhoseGotMyEyebrows]

What is wrong with me?! For several years now my ILs have on and off done really horrible things to me and my DH and really let us down. Things that I am still angry about and will never forget.

When I am not with them and it pops into my mind I am so angry. Then when I see them I am all nice and friendly and chatty to them! I don't want to be as I want them to be aware (even if I haven't got the guts to actually say it) that I don't think they are nice people.

Why do I have to be nice? What's wrong with me?! It's like I can't help it!

Def not got aspergers - I'm social, got good friends, emotionally intelligent.
I don't think that I have a disorder and what I describe ^^ is just one part of my personality. In
M just massively sensitive to others, especially people I care about. But u are right it is very wearing!

i'm with you glint - i feel the same.

garlic, that's really interesting, I'd thought it was the opposite for Asperger's

I'm with you OP. I cut off a "friend" last year who made endless horrid comments disguised as friendly advice. I could never respond to her the way I wanted to, so it was a massive relief to cut contact in the end. I know you can't do this as easily with family though, so I agree with the advice to gently call them on it every time they say something nasty. Let them know it's been noted.

Common confusion, curly. Empathy = being able to put yourself in someone's shoes, using your imagination. The other thing = actually feeling what (you believe) others are feeling. One of the usual reasons why autists can't stand a crowded room is because they feel swamped by the different emotions of all the people in it.

Whosegotmyeyebrows - you have answered your own query. You say you could "dump the stamp" if you could make them realise that their nasty comment has been noted and disapproved of (sorry not your exact words but if I go back a page I will lose this post.

For you it is clear that offloading to someone else is not enough to dump the stamp. You have the option of saving up more and more books of stamps and they could fill the whole house - you could trade them in eventually by having an enormous row with the ILs and I don't think that is what you really want. SO you are going to have to find it within yourself somehow to make some comment as suggested by others. I know how difficult this is because I have a relative who is similar and I can dump stamps by offloading but not entirely - I still have angry thoughts about her from time to time. Another relative has given me the same advice as posters have given to you - my relative says "look you don't have to be confrontational, just say something to make her realise her snidey comment (sort of said in a jokey way but meaning it) has registered with you."

I haven't been very successful probably for the same reason as you - there would be horrendous repurcussions for me and my DP if the "balloon went up" so to speak. Also as you and glint say, sometimes I am so taken aback it doesn't register what she has actually said until later.

Maybe baby steps is the way to go - maybe a non verbal reaction from you, rolling of the eyes, or gazing with slightly open mouth. If you practice you will find the right non verbal reaction - I've just tried it and a short intake of breath and a slow turn of the head to my left side with eyes open wide seems to show a reaction of disapproval. Then maybe moving to a "tsk" as the head goes upwards.....then maybe just maybe one of the phrases that others have mentioned. I am going to give the non verbal reactions a go, as I have been told that it is very clear to see when I am annoyed as I have a very expressive face - and you may be the same.

I have a belief that you can only have an argument/row with someone when you know it will mend. For me that is my DP and my 3 sons. Otherwise the stakes are too high and other ways have to be found........be interested in what you think.

still not surer how to get rid of stamp collection, will reread tomorrow, either that or post a whole load of stamps on mn....

MillyTant Have you tried the "what was that you said? say it again I didn't hear you". I think a sarcastic or supposedly funny cutting comment has less power the second time it's said and makes them look foolish. (Must remember to do that myself!)

glintwithpersperation Wow that sounds exhausting! I'm not as extreme as that but I do really empathise with people and can sort of imagine their pain. I wish I was "quicker" with the comments though. For my FIL I've had a tactic for a few months now where every time he makes a horrible comment I try to deflect it back at him using humor. It works if I can think of something in time but I don't have a fast brain most of the time.

I just need to make it aware that it's been heard and it's not OK, then I can let it go, is that weird?

NanaNina That's weird just read your post and you have said what I said above. Yes it is letting it be known that it's not OK with me. In the past they have done horrible things to us out of spite, such as saying they won't look after my dc while I was in labour (they did they were just trying to make us suffer), which was a big panic thing as we have no one else who could help, cue a stressful few months. I never told them exactly how horrible I thought that was so it's always on my mind. They have lied to us to get us to do the things they want and I realised but didn't say anything so now I just think lying fuckers every time I see them. They wouldn't help me get my DH to A&E when he had an accident by either driving him or looking after the dcs so I could, later they were giving me evil looks! They look after their other sons kids loads but don't treat mine the same.

It probably all sounds a bit weird really but there have been loads of examples, mostly about the occassional bit of babysitting as I don't have any one else and lost my mum to cancer 2 days before I gave birth. I was then mentally ill (grieving, OCD, anxiety, depression etc) for the next few years and really needed them and they weren't there at all, in fact they made things worse. They would occassionally offer to have the kids (once a year maybe) while we went to a wedding for eg, then they would change their mind at the last minute meaning we couldn't go and we really needed that break, my mental health needed that break!

So on top of that which makes me angry and bitter and gives me masses of stamps I also have the comments. My DH is stingey (we are very poor at the moment), or my DH is a hyperchondriac/woos/big girls blouse etc (he has long term health issues). They are just nasty.

As NanaNina suggests, your response doesn't have to be verbal. Use your stunned reaction to your advantage and turn and give them a "Paddington Bear Hard Stare" everytime they make a chippy comment. Whether or not they pick up on it at first, you will feel better not letting it go.

Wow, they really are nasty, aren't they?

Don't know if this will help any - I used to work in a place where bullying was endemic. I couldn't believe what people were saying to each other, all in a supposedly friendly way. Like, using your example, they would answer your husband with "It's over there, shirker." If you were also playing their game, you'd go back at them with "Cheers, short-arse." If not, you'd have to keep saying "My name's Garlic," or "Thanks, but don't call me that," and so on. It was a total waste of energy.

The point was, if you didn't react at all to the insult (or, worse, got upset), they would take it as a sign of weakness - and, being bullies, would do it even more.

I had a counsellor who suggested saying "Ouch" whenever it happened. This was good suggestion; it meant I was being true to myself - it did hurt - and letting the bully know I disapproved of what they said. It didn't stop them! But it did make it less fun from their pov, and I collected fewer stamps.

you will feel better not letting it go.

Absolutely!

OP, I can relate to you completely. My MIL would dig the knife in during conversation but always with a pleasant smile on her face and it was always some time afterwards that I would realise I'd been stabbed by her by which time it was too late to say anything.

I saved my stamps until one day I had had enough and blew up at DH about his mother. He tried to sort things out and make her think before she spoke but it was clearly impossible for her and eventually I decided to cut contact with her.

It works really well. I haven't seen her for 2 years, DH and the Dc's still go and see her and I have some peace and quiet while they're away. DH fully supports me in my decision, it would be impossible otherwise.

Whosegotmyeyebrows this has made me laugh a little as I have posted on here several times in the past about exactly the same thing.

I've not read all the posts on here but I was reccommended the "Toxic In Laws" book (from Amazon) by another MNer which was really good.

Point is this: You can't change them but they're not you're responsibility either and unless your DH/DP thinks theres an issue here, you are stuck. After getting angry and really stressed out and remembering all the incredibly cruel things that have been said to me over the years I have finally resolved to take myself out of the situation. So I don't visit them anymore. DH goes with DS but I stay away, don't speak to them and don't get involved.

ILs never notice I'm not there nor ask about me and so I think we're all happy. I know this doesn't like a solution but if yours are anything like mine, you can't front up to them about their behaviour without making everything worse so it is far easier and less stressful to remove yourself from the situation. Fortunately my DH agrees with me and doesn't want to see them either! Good luck x

Hi Eyebrows - yes they really are very nasty people. Would you consider stopping any contact with them as jasminerice and allibaba have. I really think this might be the best option. Would this make you feel better or worse because you couldn't let them know how angry they make you feel, but then you can't do that anyway, so you don't have anything to lose. I can't take this course of action with my relative - too much to lose.

What is your DH's view of the situation - you've probably said but I can't remember. You could trade your stamps in by telling your DH you are stopping contact, and visiting the ILs to tell them this and the reasons, or if this is too scarey, writing to them and telling them the reasons. If your DH still wants to stay in contact would you be ok about letting the children go to their g/pts for short infrequent visits, but never leaving them with the g/pts, lest they start demonising you to your children.

The stamps have obviously caught on and posters are using the term - BlackEyedSusan - yes you could try posting your "stamps" on MN - that might be a way of "dumping them" - how many book fulls do you think you have (A4 size) or do you have shelves/rooms full of them!

OP, I think we have the same MIL! Mine agreed recently to look after our kids so we could go away for a few days for our anniversary and then changed their mind at the last minute forcing us to cancel. This is a trip arranged 3 months after me discovering their son's affair which they know about. They also know how ill i'd been (depressed and suicidal) post discovery. I really needed that trip. I'm really angry still and don't know what to do about it. MIL won't acknowledge that she's done anything wrong and thinks i should let it go, which makes me want to keep it going even more! This isn't the first time they have behaved like this. Allibaba, i like your idea of cutting all contact. What do you do when there's a big family celebration, christmas or kid's birthdays? I presume they never come round your house then?

NanaNina The problem with cutting them off is that then my DH would go and visit on his own (or with dcs). They make a lot of the comments towards him and a lot of the things they have done effect him. He has low self esteem I think and won't stick up for himself where they are concerned so I would feel like I was abandoning him to them.

He doesn't like the things they have done either and at times has been really upset about it but he won't confront his family, his dad in particular just cuts him down! So my DH just lets it go but I know it still hurts. He suffers depression which I think is caused by them and their treatment of him. They treat his brother completely differently.

mollynp I suppose at least they know how upset you are. Mine just got a stunned stare and that was it. My DH said nothing but for the next 48 hours looked like he was going to crumple inwards, it sounds silly but it devastated him that they would do that. My MILs excuse was that she needed to pop out to buy salad . . . we had given her 3/4 months notice! And really is my FIL not capable of buying salad!

The changing the minds thing at the last minute is a control thing. My ex-H did this all the time about every little thing. It's very wearing.

I solved the problem by leaving! Not very helpful I know!

I save up a Wembley sized store of stamps with my sister, and then it all came out at once. A lifetime stamp collection! I have to say that she is now VERY careful what she says around me and my DC. She never apologised though!

Thing is eyebrows if that is the case, would he consider cutting contact, but I know how difficult this would be for him. How do you think you being there protects him from feeling so upset at their comments - maybe moral support.

What sort of frequency is this contact and how long do you have to "serve" for any one visit.

Wow gettingagrip - a Wembley sized store of stamps.

Of course the emotionally healthy way of functioning is to be honest open and authentic and then we don't need to save any stamps - we deal with things there and then .........that's the theory but is just that a theory and not humanly possible in my view to link the theory and practice!

Maybe someone does function like that - if so I'd love to hear from them.

Nananina I think the problem with putting the theory in to practice is that sometimes it takes a little time for the comment to register or you're so shocked that they've said it and it takes a couple of minutes to recover that the moment has already passed for you to honest with them about how it makes you feel.

mollynp in answer to your question my ILs live 2 hours away (fortunately). Any big family occasions on DH's side are with the whole extended family which, as my DH puts it "dilutes the madness". My FIL refused to come to DS1's first birthday (clashed with a football match) and I refuse to go to theirs for Christmas which again my DH is in agreement about and is more than happy to come to my family home.

Eyebrows, my DH does get really down about the situation and how his parents treat me, our DS and our friends (really long back story!). He finds it easier to cope with by taking himself out of the situation too which then makes my decision to do the same a lot easier.

This whole situation really doesn't sound healthy for either of you, either with getting depressed or getting so angry. Talk to your DH, find out how he really feels and then make a decision between the both of you about you want to do and stick to it. I've found that all the resentment I feel about how they have treated me has never really gone away but I don't have to be reduced to their level of childishness and insults as I did before. And the longer I stay away, the calmer I feel. It sounds really silly but in a way I feel like I'm the one having the final word by refusing to engage in their petty spitefulness!

NanaNina How do you think you being there protects him from feeling so upset at their comments - maybe moral support.

I deflect them with a giant invisible tennis racket! I have been using humour to deflect the comments back but as I said I'm not that quick, or if they are having a go at him I will stand up for him. This makes him sound like a wimp, he's not at all, just with them he is different.

glad to see this discussion cos i came on to find out if was being unreasonable about something similar.

i dont speak to one of my cousins and and keep another at arms' length for similar reasons, mainly leaving me in the lurch after promising to look after me when i moved to london in my early 20s. anyhow, my bro is visiting from aussi now and although i had told him about these before was going to visit the cousin i dont speak to. i told him i would be angry if he did and yesterday had a long drawn out conversation. bro then said cos i'd never spoken to either of these two and told them about their bad behaviour he cant not see him (i'm ok with the arms' length one being visited) without telling him why. so he was going to go and tell this guy why i am pissed and why he's not brought his family to visit.

i realise this will make things awkard with some of the other family but as i am aloof anyway dont think i will be affected. however, now am wondering if i should have told my bro not to go.

Eyebrows - Love your giant invisible tennis racket! Still wondering how often these visits take place and how long they have to last. You say your DH "can't" confront his parents, but you need to substitute "won't" for can't. We all say can't when we mean won't - sometimes it's true that we can't do something i.e. fly an aeroplane but worth watching the "cant's" for "won'ts" - hope I don't sound pedantic - it's more TA theory.

I think it's time for decisions as this is causing you a lot of grief. You have some options that should be considered - both of you stopping contact, especially as your DH suffers from depression, the visits could be exacerbating this illness. Finding the courage to tell them that how upsetting their comments make you and check to see if this makes a difference.

Are your children fond of the gr/prts and what about how they treat the children. Are they good gr/prts even though they are nasty ILs.

alibaba agree with what you say about the moment passing as it takes a minute or two for the nasty comment to register, so we go and stick a few more stamps in the book.

NanaNina The visiting varies as we live only 30mins apart so depends. Sometimes we might see each other once a week and other times weeks or a month or more will go by without a visit. Just depends what is happening.

At the moment things aren't as bad as they were as I finally had enough of them being spiteful regarding the babysitting. After the wedding issue (missing it because they let us down) and then the fact that they lost me some temping work by saying that would babysit and then changing their mind at the last minute, and of course not wanting to help when I was in hospital giving birth and insisting that my DH pick up our dc the minute the baby was out, plus about a dozen other examples . . . things changed.

I finally had enough and stopped asking them to ever help, which was a bit cutting of my face as we have no one else (which is why they had us over a barrel). We also started visiting a lot less and then eventually when we did need childcare we paid someone to do it which we really couldn't afford. They found out we had paid someone and started acting all hurt and saying "oh but we'd have the children" (my arse you would!)

Since then the once a year or so babysitting has gone without a hitch but the comments still come.

They are good to the dcs and obviously love them a lot, although they do a hell of a lot more for their other grandchildren, days out and things, babysitting loads and generally helping that family out in all their times of need, of which they have had a hell of a lot less then us, yet we still get comments about how we are lucky with all the help they give us! I do wonder though when it will be that my dcs notice that their gps do a lot more with the other children, I'm surprised the oldest hasn't already.

Wow this is long!

I think honesty, though hard to practice, is always the best policy. I think you need to tell them how you feel, and what effect their behaviour has had on your family.

Keeping quiet, and taking their behaviour will not achieve anything. They need to be told their behaviour is not on. Not only will you feel better, but they will realise that you are onto them.

If you haven't got the guts to tell them, write a long letter, telling them explicitly what you are unhappy about, and asking them to stop.

They need to know their behaviour is unacceptable, and you need to confront them about their behaviour. As an individual, you have a right to be treated with dignity and respect. You have boundaries that others should not ever cross, and one of the boundary is 'being treated in a horrible manner' as you highlighted OP. Noone has a right to hurt another person, or treat them in an appalling manner. This is your God given right OP, and demand it!

I think assertiveness training would be useful in this situation. You can be assertive with them OP! You just need start exercising those assertiveness muscles, and slowly they will get better.
Most importantly, you will start to feel much better about the situation, and in addition, will learn not to take crap from anyone.

Sorry some of it sound garbled, but hope you get the gist of it..

I spent 10 yrs being "nice" to my ILs, but the worm has turned, and I now pick MiL up on every single snide, passive aggessive, knife-twisting comment she spouts! I just couldn't bear it any longer, letting everything fester. The thing is that DH and his siblings are so used to being spoken to like that that it doesn't even register with them any more. But, for me, it was a real shock. Sometimes my heart is in my mouth, but I always, always feel better for having basically said, "no, that's not OK to say that to me, DH, the DCs"