Depressed and fed up of all this...

[realharperlee]

I usually post on MN about my DC but tonight I'm asking advice about my relationship with my DH..

Everything seems so hard at the moment, we are constantly bickering over the slightest things, maybe cos we're tired dealing with quite erratic kids who are from the 'can't sleep, won't sleep' world. I think the lack of us time due to kids not falling asleep till 9.30 (one about the start school, other is a toddler)is a big factor, it's stopping being togethr as we are so bloody knackered!

The bickering is getting so bad he has said he is only for me because of the kids- that has been quite hurtful and then he has retracted what he said and said he loves me. I'm not the most easy going person and do get picky/frustrated/OCD over domestic chores and kids but whereas in the past he would have been quite accepting of my moods he is now just as moody as me.

I think there is someone at work who is close to, she is young, carefree and flirtatious and maybe I'm being paranoid but can't help thinking he is comparing me to her, I've put on weight and really don't feel attractive, sex is out of the question (he has criticised me for not being tidy down there, but don't have time with the kids), I'm just starting to feel really lousy, maybe he should leave but I'd hate to bring my kids up without their father present and besides I love him, I think..

He went for drinks with a pal tonight, came in had a go at me about place being a tip and has now fallen asleep downstairs, can hear him snoring.

Not sure what advice I want from you MNers, I think putting down my anxiety has released some of my tension and sadness.

Hope someone has some uplifting advice, do you think we still have a chance or should he go? I just feel awful

you have every chance :) he's tired, you are tired, the kids are bloody exhausting and the house is a tip. I wish I could send you a snapshot of my house right now! If my sister didn't regularly remind me that this is all normal, I would have collapsed in a heap and cried myself silly long ago! and a day off is a good start. Can you arrange a morning to yourself? Go get a wax and a lovely pedicure (it's NOT a big deal to be 'untidy', but taking time out to do this will achieve 2 things, a- he will notice and appreciate it, and b- you will feel like you've done something positive for yourself. I am not antifeminist I actually genuinely feel better when I've taken care of myself, regardless of my DH and his opinion). Next on the list... try date night? Once a month? In our house it's a bloody mission but we have one Friday evening a month when we either get a babysitter and go out, or at the very least we turn off the phone, TV, internet and get M&S dine in for two. Even a modest budget can stretch to £10 a month for your relationship, and just making mental space for each other is a start. Don't throw in the towell yet... and don't write him off as a cheating arse yet... the girl at work isn't the mother of his children. And even if he's tired right now, I bet he knows how special you are! Reminding him that you know he's special too won't hurt though. It's a two way street after all :)

Maybe you both need some space to determine what it is you both want from the relationship. You say you are OCD over household chores but then say he has moaned about the house being a tip?

It's hard to bring yourself to having sex with someone who does not find you attractive and it is understandable you have not had sex, sex for women does start a long time outside of the bedroom, you have to be happy out of it to be able to want to have sex in it.

Can you not spend a night alone together to talk? Get someone to babysit so you can go out for a few hours to talk.

Thanks for your posts sillyworried and fabby. We have tried date nights but always revert back to the bickering and then noncommunicado/me on MN/him sleeping downstairs.

I'm incredibly fussy/picky about chores - I have bursts of tidying usually if family or friends visit but in the week, am so tired after getting kids ready and off to bed lately I've been leaving tidying until the weekend.

Think I need some salon time but I will still feel ugly and fat. I definitely do think he does compare me with flirty girl at work as they've been working on projects together and coming home to a miserable nagging woman must be hard for him, I try not to.

I always tell him he's special, just not getting it back as much as I'd like

poor thing, HUG! I really feel for you. Its horrible to feel like you're in groundhog day with someone who doesn't appreciate you. I know only too well how it feels to constantly be put down, not touched, ignored or criticised. I think the only helpful thing that I was told back then, which has literally changed my life (I am not exaggerating) is that you can only control one person - and it's you. When I was in your situation it was so hard to stop focusing on the other person, the mean things they did, the horrible things they said, the sad things they made me feel.... but when I did focus on me, and changed how I saw me, everything changed. Treat yourself as someone special, interesting, valuable and important - he will either catch up with you and respond, or he won't. Even if he doesn't you will feel better about yourself just by acting like you like yourself. (Act as if you believe it - sooner or later, you will!)

OCD cleaning is probably a symptom of your stress. Don't leave it unchallenged. It's not something you have to keep doing. You can stop being 'incredibly fussy/picky' if you want to, it's a matter of choosing to stop, taking a deep breath, and replace the fussing EVERY time with a thank you. Thank yourself for doing something positive. Thank him for being helpful (even if it's a small thing). Thank the DC's for going to bed (eventually!). Thanks goes a LONG long waym you will be surprised! You can't change him, and you can't force him to behave better. But you can do things differently for yourself, and ultimately, you will be glad if you do! Keep posting for support, I really do understand how bloody awful it can all get sometimes. But sleeping on the sofa, being a general arse and noticing another woman are all things he can stop doing, and probably will stop doing, when he gets a good reminder that the woman he fell in love with is still f**king fabulous, and she knows it! x

Thanks sillyworried, I think I needed your uplifting words.

I will try to look at myself differently and try the thanking technique (I am always greatful and apologetic to others), my low mood needs to be lifted and you've done that.

I suffered from PND with both kids and think it has returned although I keep ignoring it and it seems to manifest itself in my snappiness and so called aggessivenes by DH.

Wish life wasn't so hard, am knackered all the time, I should be asleep and insted I'm on MN, but it does help.

Thanks SW

He went out for a drink and then came back and criticised the state of the house?

If he's that bothered, tell him to stay in and tidy it.

When are you going out for a drink, BTW?

And, please correct me if I've got this wrong, but are you saying that he refuses to have sex with you because you are 'not tidy enough down there'?

Hi Tethersand, I've probably portrayed as a real arse but am no angel myself with my mood swings. I go out when I can(every 2 months) but we don't go out together.

real, I think you are describing a very normal / typical scenario for parents with young families . it's REALLY tiring and there are faults on both sides in terms of being grouchy with each other / both feeling unappreciated.

It really is not easy when your kids are small. I personally think that the one parent works/ one is at home with kids is especially stressful as each feel the other has it easier and "competitive exhaustion" sets in.

Be kind to each other in the meantime ; and forget about the divorce courts for now

If you 2+bpre-school kids then forgive anybody anything short of manslaughter - it is exhausting, frustrating and can be deadly boring - and everyone gets more depressed/unable to see big picture/loses SOH etc when tired.

He needed a break at the pub, but you need a break away from the grind too.

Some practical stuff from my time in The Grind:

• Sleep. You HAVE to have it. So does DH. Everything else comes from that and you will be amazed about what goes awy If it means shifts with kids, so be it.
• You HAVE to lower your tidyness standards with small kids or you will go batshit crazy.
• You DO need to take a little bit of care of your appearance - for your own self esteem more than anything TBH - get into the habit again.
• Personally, i think its VERY dangerous to stop having sex with your DH, I know a lot of other women disagree with me but I'm a realist not a theorist. Date nights, bath nights, whatever.
• Also, I'd advise getting a few Adult grey cells working - the number of people who want to talk baby poo and so on is a very small minority limited to baby and toddler groups, and btw your DH probably isn't one of them.

ever since iv had my 10 week old baby girl my relationship seems 2 have got really bad. all he does is drink on a weekend and when he is drunk he gets nasty with me and stays out till half 4 in the morning he pinned me up against the wall. hes admitted hes a binge drinker n says hes gunna get help but he hasnt i dnt no what 2 do anymore. i carnt talk 2 him he doesnt listen my doctor put me on antidepresants and he through them away he said they will make me worse when they dnt he calls me names n says he doesnt love me when he is drunk. but when he doesnt drink he is the most loving fiance u could ever wish 4 i just feel so lonely n dnt av any 1 2 talk 2. i do everything in the house i cook clean do the ironing bath the kids feed the kids put them 2 bed tidy up after them all i ask that on a sunday he gets up with the kids 2 give me a break put he drinks on a friday n is hungover on a saturday n he says he carnt be arsed getting up with them. he works in the week 7 till 4 n says he is tired but being a full time parent is a lot harder. wot should i do please give me advice coz im surpossed 2 be getting married nxt april the 28th iv put a deposit down 4 my dress n everything is booked please help im scarde its all my fault !!!!

dalby

Start a thread- I am (clearly) no expert in relationships, but if you repost on your own thread, there are some amazing people on this topic who will offer you great advice.

Thanks Jasper and Whatme, btw I work four days so I suppose this doesn't help with my fluctuating moods, I really can't bring myself to have sex (our kids are light sleepers too..) but will organise some time for me to make myself look nice and feel special. It's good to hear that it's the young kids situation that is making things especially fraught, I really hope it gets better.

We're going to try and stay awake enough to talk, I'm thinking about getting a sleep specialist too for my two as it's been a nightmare over the last three years, if I went on Supernanny she'd have a feild day!

Enough of my selfish rambling..Dalby I'm alarmed at your situation, I'm not an expert but think your man sounds like he needs serious help, I think the house and helping with kids is essential, can't just be you but what is more serious is the way he is treating you, you're not his skivvy and no way should he physically harm you. Have you talked to someone about this, a family member? Your doctor? Please get help as this is a serious situation.

I'm sending you MNer cuddles, why can men be so selfish? Please think of yourself and your kids, you can't get married until this is sorted..

realharperlee, I think the fact that you see your words as 'selfish rambling' speaks volumes

As I say, I am no expert, but even through the fug of tiredness that small children bring, if your husband is refusing to have sex with you because you 'aren't tidy enough down there', that is awful. Is that the case? Have I misunderstood? No wonder your confidence is low. I hope someone comes on who is more help than me.

dalby I am very concerned by your post. You describe:

• isolation
• excessive drinking by your partner
• nasty behaviour toward you and hurtful words
• staying out all night when you have a tiny baby at home to care for
• him not doing any work around the house, trating you like a skivvy
• Pinning you against a wall. That is NOT ok. At all. Ever. He prevented your movement, and made you fear him in order to get his own way. What would you say if your best friend reported that her partner did that to her?
• giving lip service to getting help, but not doing it. Actions speak louder than words, and his actions say he doesn't really think there's a problem, and doesn't respect you enough to try and make improvements for your sake, or your child's.
• Ignoring your feelings
• throwing out your medication. Do you see how controlling that is? How dare he make medical decisions on your behalf?

All of the above is is very serious, and experience shows that his behaviour is likely to get worse, not better. I know that you want to get through to him and help make things better. But, love, the only person you can help is yourself, and your baby. If your partner is going to change, he will have to do it himself, if he wants to. You can't help him, and you can't make him want to change.

What RL help can you call on for yourself?

Here are some options for you to consider:

• call a trusted friend who will listen to your concerns.
• call Women's Aid on 0808 2000 247. You sound so distressed, and WA have lovely people on the end of the line who will understand your distress and not mind at all if your thoughts are a tearful confused jumble at the moment.
• return to your GP. Explain everything you have said above maybe print out your post if you find it hard to say aloud. S/he can then prescribe you more ADs and if you want it -- refer you for counselling. You are very vulnerable right now and going through an extremely difficult time, and I think counselling would be a very, very good way for you to clarify in your own mind what you want for yourself and your child.

Would you also consider starting your own thread, so that advice to you and to harperlee don't start getting mixed up? Just copy paste your post above.

(sorry for thread hi-jack, OP, I just really didn't want dalby to go un-answered, and my reply to her x-posted with yours and tethersend's)

It can be really hard for men to adjust to the lack of sex after kids are born. When that lack is total and appears permanent (because there's no communication about addressing it), it's usually a deal breaker.

I'm interested you say "sex is out of the question", rather than "there are problems preventing sex", or "sex is difficult for me to think about". It suggests a sense of resignation on your part, like you've decided the easiest way to address the overflow of things you're trying to fit into your life is to take one big one out and get rid of it altogether. And that big one is the sex.

It may be this decision "just happened" somehow between you, or you made it unilaterally. Either way, it's not usually tenable long term. For most men, you might as well say "I really love you and look forward to sharing a happy life together, but we'll need to amputate all your limbs first."

I'd start looking at the various factors in the way, and communicating about them.

am i bad person because im dreading my fiance cuming home im scared !!!!!

Dalby, you are not a bad person.
But you are in a really terrible relationship.

You may be in a bad relationship, or you may be in a fundementally good relationship which is going through a low. In order to see what it is you need sleep. In order to get sleep, you need to get the kids sleeping.

Beg, steal or borrow a copy of "Toddler Taming" by Dr Christopher Green. My kids were appalling sleepers (had 4 under five at one point) He does this delayed attention method. Sorted mine out in a couple of weeks.

If this doesn't appeal/work, then insist that you and P do "shifts" - early night for one with an eary morning, later night - lie in for other. Weekend naps too - alternate them.

After getting some sleep you can then tackle with a clear head and a more positive attitude your relationship.

Good luck.

Saffy - My terrible relationship comment was to Dalby ( see a few posts up- she is most definately in one ), not to the OP.

I agree about toddler taming . I loved that book. In fact it was googling Christopher Green that led me to mumsnet about 12 or so years ag

realharperlee - just popping back to remind you that you are FABULOUS!! :) you are an excellent mother, a lovely person and a damn good catch.
Say that out loud now!

glad my words lifted your mood yesterday, honestly, I have been where you are. And I know it passes. Patience and tolerance can be learned, we're not born with them, but practice makes perfect. The whole thanking thing made an enormous difference to me - hope it works with you too. HUG X

Thanks all for your kind and supportive words, although my issues now pale into insignificance compared to dalby- hope you're ok? Please listen to the advice of others, hope you get sorted soon, my thoughts are with you.

Kids finally asleep but because we split them between us, DH has fallen asleep in youngest's room! Will talk at the weekend, hopefully mum will be over to give us a break. Tether - he thinks I need to put more effort into my appearance, tiredness is a problem as he works away sometimes but he says it doesnt help that I've let myself go down there, so embarrassed writing about that.

Confidence - the biggest issue and barrier to sex is we have is having terrible sleepers for kids (will look up this book Saffy, thanks for the tip-my kids are quite strongwilled, nothing exhausts them though!). We then have no time for us and just get irritated with each other. It used to be me who was the snappy moody one but its him more lately and I think his closeness to his colleague is worrying me.

Hopefully booking a treatment and being more considerate of each other may help, deep down I love him, hope he feels the same too.

Thanks all, off to wake him now..

if i leave him where would i go i dnt speak with my mum n my dad lives in spain :(

i left him last night with my 2 kids n i feel like a weight has been lifted n my dad is paying 4 me 2 go 2 spain n live with him n my kids the sooner i get away from hear the better :)