My mother suggests to brother to hide £££ before divorce - is this right????

[pupuce]

Hi all!
I am very upset at my mother's attitude and would like to know what you guys think.....
My mother has told me that she has just advised (and helped) my brother to put some of his money into another (secret) bank account as he is about to tell his unsuspecting wife (and mother of his 2 children - 2nd child being 5 weeks old) that he wants to divorce.... so that he has enough to start again or what ever (this is not in the UK - so not sure about divorce law - i believe it's 50/50 with everything after mariage).
My father has always accused my mother of having done this when she told him she was leaving him (this took everyone by surprise). I thought my dad was talking nonesense but he was adament that she had been staching cash.... but now - based on recent events - I actually believe him as my mother has no remorse/shame about doing this at all (I don't think it occured to her that I was shocked at this!) - I think she believes that it's about looking after number 1 basically!

On top of it all, my dad suffers from severe depression, lives on his own (in another country), has 100% state help as he has NO money at all (he went bankrupt after divorce), and he has not spoken to my mum in well over 5 years. He took the divorce extermely badly (induced its depression). He is unaware my brother is divorcing as we feel he would not handle it well...
But last night I rang him and (cut a long story short) he has asked me (again) for money.... for ONCE I have asked my mum if she would help (she is re-married with a wealthy man)... and she basically e-mailed back "sorry to hear about his sitation but this does not concern me anymore!"

I was gobsmacked......
I have tried in the past month (and so has she) to improve our relationship.... she does not understand many of our life choices and I was trying to open more honest lines of communications.... but now I am gutted...

I really can't stomach her behaviour... is it just me (and if so PLEASE tell me... don't sugar coat it!)
Should I just say nothing ? Shoudl I speak... and say what ???
DH who completely understands where I am coming from, he is also not sure what I should do ... he said I shouldn't judge...

God Pupuce what a position to be in.

I feel very uncomfortable with the idea of hiding cash though, especially when he has children to support. He must have loved his wife at some point and she had his children, one very recently, so surely that counts for something? I think the timing of his request for a divorce stinks.

As for the relationship with your mum, dh has been through this, and whatever he did to open communications never worked. You seem like you have less traits from your mum than your brother, so trying to make them see your pov probably won't work.

Nothing helpful there, sorry, but sending you cyber support anyway.

Oh Dear.

1. NO I definitely don't think it is 'just you'! This is bound to stick in the craw of anyone with any sense of fairness or honesty.
2. The issue itself is really about your brother. The history and your mother's connivance, is illuminating, but the discussion, if there is one to be had is between you and your brother, not primarily you and your Mum, isn't it? it isn't her impending divorce, it isn't her money...
3. Will your brother see it in terms of the effect on his chldren? Does he have any sympathy with the situation your - HIS- father is in, and does he really wnat to inflict that on someone else?
4. How close are you to your SIL? Are you likely to be involved in helping her through the fallout of this, childcare, shoulder to cry on etc; might be worth letting your bro know how hard that will be knowing what you know... 5.Think you probably have to go as far as you can with your bro, and then, knowing your family as only you can, decide how far you wnat to push something that could cause big feud.

I really feel for you.

pupuce that's awful. TBH I think it's totally wrong for him to hide cash and wrong of your mum to suggest it. really sorry that you don't have good relationship with her.
I think if I were you (and this is obviously only my personal opnion) I would say something to your brother, especially if there are children involved it seems horrible to try and stash away money. If you think it's wrong then I would say so. If he knows, you know, then he might think twice about doing it.

BTW what did DH mean by "I shouldn't judge"? did he mean not judge your mum or not judge your brother?

Isn't this what lilibet said her ex has done?

Of course it's wrong - they are his children ffs!!! You said it didn't occur to your mum that you were shocked, have you told her that you are?

Hugs from me too.

Oh Pupuce, this is horrible. I would be very angry with my mum if she had suggested a similar thing to my brother (I don't have one but anyway) too. They are his children too and I agree with Lou, the timing of this is tragic for your SIL. I think in your position I'd tell my brother that I knew and strongly disagreed with his actions. I'd explain why too. I think I'd also be incapable of NOT telling my mother I disagreed with her and that I thought her advice was morally reprehensible but I would probably stay out of the situation between her and your father. I think I would try to anyway. You can't know what exactly went on in their marriage and it is her prerogative to refuse to give him any money now, despite her circumstances. Although it does sound as if your father was right - she may have been stashing money etc. I still think this is all water under the bridge and you should probably try to stay out of it. I think it must be very difficult if you and your parents have different moral values but I doubt she'll change her mind so maybe it's not worth doing any more than telling her what you think about this situation in particular and then leaving it at that. I must admit, in your position I think I'd be tempted to forewarn my SIL since I think she is being put in an incredibly unfair position and your brother is behaving very badly indeed. I'm not sure whether I actually would though, it's a tricky one.

Pupuce so sorry to hear about this situation but IMO I believe these events have brought back some pent up anger over your parents divorce.

I agree with Lou that the timing is terrible with your brother wanting a divorce.

As for stashing money away, I think it depends on the circumstances. People usually dont stash money away unless it is for a good reason and basically it is for self-survival.If it is for greed I dont agree with it at all.

As for lending your dad money hmm well if one of my children in the future asked me to lend their dad (my ex) money they would get a pretty nasty answer back.I wouldnt do it end of.

As for telling her anything I would advise her to keep out of your brothers probs as it will only cause resentment towards her from SIL (in case she ever found out about the stashing money)and may cause friction between her seeing her 2 grandchildren.

I just hope the situation gets better,hugs xxx

SOme good stuff to think about ... like "telling SIL" (I am not close to her - have tried but she doesn't seem interested)... certainly the point that if she ever found out she could use that to alter the visiting rights of both my brother and my mum.... I hadn't thought of that.

The tricky bit is that - I know about all of this because my mum told me.... if she hadn't I would not have a clue he is about to leave her. He has told me nothing, He just can't see himself living with her anymore blablabla... of course there is another woman ! My mother is very close to my brother (he can do no wrong!)

I think I might send him an e-mail at work to tell him I know (and he knows I know actually) and that I have heard about mum's suggestion and what I think of it. I can't really make my relationship with him much worst... we don't really have one ! We live a continent away (he is in North America).
I know he would pay child support - he "plans" to have shared custody .... I know for a fact that she is against divorce (she is very catholic), she has cheated on him years ago now he is cheating on him.... I thionk he hiding the money becasue he wants to ensure a good head start (he has a very good job)... to be honest I think it stincks.

I like Blu's 3rd point.... not directly applicable but I will ask him if HE feels our mother treated our dad right...... hmmm keen to hear his reply !

Doormat - as for lending money to an ex - I have no idea what happened between you and your ex... but my mum said one day to my dad (in front of my brother) - I am leaving, I can see you are going to get us bankrupt and I am leaving before the ship sinks... even my brother was astounded ! My father fainted and it took hours for him to say anything! He was litteraly in a sate of shock. She left him and it became VERY VERY bitter - he became clinically depressed. He accused her of stealing money before she left - their accountants said that he never really understood how come they needed so much money to live on (just the 2 of them).... at the time I thought it was sour grapes but I am beginninng to believe my dad (and the accountant).
She makes no apology for the fact that she needs to be financially well off.... her boyfriend (sorry they are not married but have been together for 7 years) is very rich and she has said that it is a good arrangement! He is not sure he wants to marry because if he dies - we (her kids) could get some of his money..... now that had made me laugh at the time.... but maybe he is right to be wary of her ! It is sad but I am starting to have nasty feelings about my mother's morals regarding ££££

Thank you all for your points of view as it is giving me food for thoughts !

pupuce that is truly awful what happened to your dad but you asked about that part of her attitude and I gave you my opinion on what I would say to one of my children if they asked.The comment wasnt meant to be hurtful and I am sorry if I offended you in anyway, but I dont know the full circumstances.

If he has another woman, then sorry he deserves to be taken to the cleaners as that is not fair to do to your SIL.

I would defo email and tell him that you know about the situation.

I also know what it is like to have a mother who has very differing morals to me and I cant believe the things my mother says to me, so I do know partly how you feel.

Doormat - I wasn't offended at all .... just wanted to explain why I (now) feel my mother is being very selfish (and also not helping me by washing her hands off the whole problem which i can't help feel she is partly the reason it is there now).
Not saying you are selfish - as I say I don't know what happened between your ex and you.

pupuce, I am glad you didnt take that the wrong way.
I have a mother who will apologise to strangers in the street and yet has never apologised to her children for some nasty comments she has made.I wiped my hands of her.

Doormat, when you wrote this :
"Pupuce so sorry to hear about this situation but IMO I believe these events have brought back some pent up anger over your parents divorce."

Did you mean in me ???? If so - well done as I think you are 100% right - I was very angry/upset at their divorce which they managed to thoroughly screw up and basically "kill" our family....

Yes I did pupuce as I read between the lines and felt your anger and bitterness over the situation between your parents. Also the fact that your mother was the instigator in splitting a family.
Sorry.

As Janh said, my ex did this to me, he manged to hide away about £200 per week for the past 14 months, if your brother/mother were putting money into bank accounts, that would be found in this country, not sure about America. Before we went to court we each had access to each others bank accounts and every account that ex paid some money into we could request to see the staement for and it all counted towards his assets. My ex drew it all out in cash so ther was no trace, when questioned about this in court, he explained that he had been living an 'extravagant lifestyle' and had bought lots of new clothes. My arse!!!! This from a man who never goes out and was wearing the coat that he had when dd was a bab. She is now 15!!!! Any how away with these bitter feelings. If your sil has access to his bank accounts because of legislation she could find this out for herself when the divorce goes through. If you tell him about this he can find other ways to do it as my ex did.
You have my sympathies, you are in a horrendous position, you mum is going to stand by her son, especially if her dil has been unfaithful, but perhaps it may be worth havign a word with her. What he is doing would be illegal in this country, and very probably in America too. Hope all goes well for them all esp your brothers children.

what an awful situation. good advice here already, which i can't add to, except that it might not hurt to remind your brother that it is his own children who will be impoverished if he hides money.

sorry about your family situation - it sounds grim

and what moral standards/example he shows his kids..... maybe I should ask him if he would recommend his kids to do the same if they ever leave their wives with tiny babies (he only has boys....) mmmmmmm

I think it's completely wrong. Why shoul he have a "head start" when leaving his wife to cope with 2 small children? What sort of "headstart" is she getting?

Not meant to be terse, children calling...!

message withdrawn

I don't really expect her to give money but I was really upset by her reply ~: "this does not concern me anymore!"
.... it concerns me a great deal and I would have thought it as such she could be nicer about the whole ting. I may be very sensitive though

OK - an bit of an update....
I spoke to my brother last night (quite unexpectedly.... long story... but he was home alone so I "could" speak).
After the updates on all kids I just told him what my mum had told me - he confirmed she had made this suggestion. I then went on to tell him that he needed to think about the consequences of his actions... detailing some of them and to put himself in his wife and kids shoes for 5 secs... and try to imagine how they would feel/live with that deceit!
He seemed to listen....
We're not close but generally I have to say that he is a good guy so I'd hope he would do the decent thing.
He also said that he is trying to get his mariage back on tack (though I don't know what he means and what he feels.... he is an oyster!) but he did say he is not leaving her now with a 6 weeks old.

As for mym mum.... well that is still unresolved..... I am very bitter but I feel that I would probably regret getting angry.... don't know.....