Is My dad right?

[redderthanred]

Long story cut very very short but basically neither my brother nor sister will talk to my dad. Its been this way for years and he cant understand why.

I only see him once a month or so, for about an hour, ususally on his way home from golf. We have no kind of relationship at all other than this.

Ive been involved in the past in trying to get them to talk to him, and ive tried many many times over the years to explain to him why they wont talk to him but he just cant see it.

My relationship with him is rubbish - if i actually think about it i end up very very upset, so have sort of detached myself, accepted it for what it is and thats how i deal with it. They dont want to do this.

He said to me yesterday he would like to see them and he texted them both but got no reply. He was being all sad about it and i said that, seeing as they were grown up i could do notihng about it. ( i am the eldest sibling)

But that as noone of the issues have been resolved and he has said that they wont ever will be, that its unlikely they will talk to him.

One of the issues is that we are not welcome in his house. We have been barred from going, from all family events and he is not even allowed to call us from his house. We can only speak to him when he calls us from work. Its been this way for 5 years.

He said that should have nothing to do with it at all and that he is still our dad and that is all irrelevant.

Is he right?

In a word - No. take it there's a complex stepmother situation?

Why is he not allowed to call from his own house?

who is not allowing him to do this?

There is a very complex - or actually not so complex at all, stepmother situation.
In that she hates us and has made no secret from that. Has barred us from her house. Has spread rumours about it and admits it.
The reason i only get 1 hour visits on the way back from golf is because hes not allowed to go anywhere without her knowing.

All in all its very sad. But i cant feel sorry for him. He should have never of let the situation get like this - they got married when i was 20. Im 33 this year.

Hes told us all he is leaving her. He has told me he will sort it many times. hes asked me to get the others together because hes going to tell them how hes going to sort it - and then fails to mention it when he sees them at all.
He once said he would take a stand and if we coudlnt see him chritsmas wouldnt happen in his house. You know what - the rest of the family all went round - including those who have blanked us un the street, or slagged us off, or called us names and even though he knows thats true and thats all been admitted - he chose to spend xmas with them.

He spends time with her grown up children doing things for them that he never did for us - all while not being allowed to speak to us from his house.

and he doesnt understand why they dont want to talk to him.
i dont really know why i do other thani feel sorry for him and so DD can see her grandad.

what we have been given as a reason before is that she apparently feels threatened by us ( his children)

Its all very sad really. but i just wondered if he was right and we were all being horrible to him.

What a horrible situation.

But its your dad that is allowing this to continue, until he changes it it wont change!

I can understand why your siblings have cut contact tbh

"seeing as they were grown up i could do notihng about it"

Well that's it in a nutshell really, isn't it? He has set ground rules that I think would seem somewhat odd to most parents, but it's his house and his choice. Your siblings have voted with their feet, as they are entitled to do, exercising their choice, as adult human beings, not to conduct a relationship according to those rules. You don't like the rules either, but you have decided to abide by them to keep him in your life, which again is your choice. It is not your responsibility to make your siblings change their minds. It is his responsibility to conduct his own relationships with his own family. Who, after all, is the parent here? Wait, I think it's you...

It is so sad when this happens. He is being unreasonable. DP and his three siblings do not speak to their Dad for exactly the same reasons as your siblings. His wife was extremely verbally abusive to DP, she is a bit mentally unstable and had two children of her own. When SIL confronted her Dad about it, telling him that he was driving his children away for this woman he simply replied 'I've got other children to think about now', basically putting his step children first.

When he got married his brother and SIL were the only members of his family that attended and he put them at a table in a corner and didn't speak to or even acknowledge their presence all day. It also transpires that he and his wife had not told any of her relatives that he has four grown up children. He has lost out massively - he has no idea that he has two grandchildren. In fact I have never met the man, and by the sound of it that's a good thing!

Every so often, he tries to make contact, but none of the ILs are interested.

No, you are not being horrible to him. How are you supposed to have a relationship with him on those terms?

His wife may see you all as a reminder of his past that she doesn't like, but I assume she knew about you before they married?

And sorry, but your father sounds rather gutless to let her dictate to him when he is allowed to see his children.

Well, I'd guess your siblings feel rejected by him. Constantly.

It is not the actions of your SM that hurt them, it is your father's actions.

Your father is wrong.

I am in a similar situation. My father's wife won't let him talk to us. Their children don't even know that they have 4 older siblings.

I felt as if I wasn't good enough for him to fight for. However, I have come to realise that it is his loss.

I have not seen him for over 2 years. He has never met my children and even if he does he won't have a relationship with them.

He always made me feel as if I wasn't good enough (even before he remarried) and so I believe that I am better off without him (although it does hurt that he has picked his wife over me). My older brothers have basically cut ties as well but my younger brother keeps trying. He emailed our father to tell him that he is moving to South Africa but had no reply at all.

I would recommend that you cut ties as well (although it is hard and painful) as this tiny amount of contact seems to be causing you more upset.

He's wrong.

He can moan all he likes about how sad he is about it all, but his actions say he has chosen his wife & that side of the family over his children. Talk is cheap, and while you may feel compassion for him (for whatever reason: what, he's weak? He's bullied?) only he can change the situation.

Snatching moments with you as if you're a dirty secret, well, if you can make that do for yourself, that's your choice - but your siblings have chosen differently - don't guilt them about it. I'd advise you to stop trying to mediate, it'll only make them resent you.

If the genders were reversed, and your mum had a DH who wouldn't let her contact her children or go out without him knowing, I'm sure lots of us would be pointing out - that is an abusive relationship, help her get out.

I don't know if that is the case here, but you say your dad has mentioned leaving many times but hasn't been able too. Can you support him in that?

Going against the grain here, and not wanting to offend anyone, but..

If this was a wife and her husband had deliberately isolated her from her family, people would, quite rightly, say that he was emotionally abusive. The wife may not feel that she could do anything about the situation. We see that on here all the time. I'm not sure this situation is that much different.

My mother does all she can to prevent my Dad seeing me. She is a classical narcissist, and I guess my Dad enables her behaviour and has done for the 44 years that they have been married. I know he loves me, but somehow he can't seem to go against her wishes.

This situation is slightly different in that it is a step-mother, not your natural mother, but maybe the principles are the same?

agree with scaredofcows

I agree with ScaredofCows and Hullygully

Fair point, ScaredOfCows. Let us, therefore, mentally switch this and give advice as though the OP had written of her mother being isolated by her stepfather. What would you say to her then?

I think, to be honest, it wouldn't be an enormous amount different, but it's true there would be more understanding of a woman's weakness than of the man's in this situation. (To be fair to myself, I posted before seeing the OP's clarification about the stepmother.) Basically all you can do for a parent who is more or less kidnapped and banned from his/her children's lives is to keep lines of communication open and let them know that if they need help breaking out of it you are willing to provide that help. If the OP's father was looking to get out he knows where he can contact her. I dare say the less patient siblings would rally round too, if he really was wanting to sort things rather than just having a gentle moan about it. You can't live your parent's lives for them, you can only offer help when they need it. He is not seeking help by the sound of it. He is seeking a covert relationship with his own children; their endorsement of the situation he finds himself in, rather than their help in improving it. Until he shows he wants more than this, I don't see really what the OP can do other than what she's already doing.

Yes - once when he told me he was leaving her and really wanted to see us all. I basically begged my siblings to see him and they did. he turned up and didnt mention it at all and then said that he never said that to me at all. he has done this so many times.
Hes not seeking to leave the relationship - they go on holidays and weekends away and by all accounts hes happy with it.

Iva had many many times when he tells me he isnt and it eats away at him, but to be honest if it did - he would have done something about it.

yes, they feel rejected by him as do i. It hurts like hell, but it seems that either doesnt seem to matter or is of no consequence.

Now i have my own child it baffles me how anyone could treat their child like that, or allow someone else to treat my child like that - and to just stand by and watch it happen.

My brother will not have anything to do with him. Dad still sends birthday/xmas money - and my brother sends it back. My sister and i accept it, and horrible as this but i kind of think that i dont get anything else from the relationship - ii might as well take what is offered. last time he saw dd he gave her £20 - she is five.
I just see it as guilt money - she asks where he lives and he just shrugs.

What i would rather would be to spend time with him and actually have some kind of relationship- but thats never going to happen.

I think that men are often a lot weaker in this regard.

Women fail to change situations because of poverty and/or physical weakness (dv etc), but men seem to have this terrible meekness about the women they are with and do as they are told.

You see it all the time with new r'ships, to one degree or another.

i dont mediate between siblings anymore - i did it a few times and the last time was when he said he was leaving her, but it turns out that was a lie - so ive refused since then.

At the end of the day if he's happy in his marriage and doesn't choose to prioritise his adult children - who let's face it don't need him any more, nice though it would be to stay close - there's nothing you can, or perhaps even should, do about it. If the price he pays for a contented life with the woman he loves is that his independent offspring have to be kept at arm's length, it's up to him whether the price is acceptable. He can't then complain you aren't bending over backwards to see him, though.

Personally I don't see how one could be happy with a person that insecure/controlling, but each to their own.

red i can understand how you feel (although i haven't read all your thread ) my dad got remarried 2 years after my mom died and we haven't seen him since. he doesn't know my sister's getting married, or where we all live.

he has said to his own cousin that he is very unhappy but as far as i know he is still there

Annie - yeah. ive accepted it, its sad, but thats how it is and its not going to change.

Just i dont like it when he does this 'victim' thing where he moans and the says he doensnt understand why they wont even talk to him and says that everything that has happened has got nothing to do with it.

it makes me sad and then fucking angry actually.

aurora - :( its sad isnt it really.

He can't have it both ways, can he?

He won't stick up for them like a father should, he won't even recognise them as a father should, he won't stop his second family from abusing them in the street... but he wants them to love him as a dad and accept a few crumbs of a relationship to make him feel better. I say crumbs because that's what it is, isn't it? You get to see him on the way home from golf! - it's not a relationship, you say yourself that you wish you could have more from him. It eases his conscience, but it does little for you, really. That's not a dad.

Why should your siblings accept that? Why do you, especially when it makes you angry? I wouldn't. They seem to have simply faced up to the fact that he isn't a dad to them in any of the ways that matter. Maybe tell him he should just face up to that too, if he isn't prepared to change anything.

yeah - i know.
and usually the whole time he is at mine hes looking at his watch and he wont even have a drink.
he works still - shift work, 4 days on, 4 days off. so has plenty of time. But he cant/wont come at the weekend because of his wife. And i work too, and on his days off he plays golf - so i get maybe 45 mins if i am lucky once a month.

I do it because i feel guilty if i dont.

But of course he has the time to take my step brother on several long days out to check out universitys. But he cant see me for more than 45 mins.
Not even at christmas or birthdays.

Ive tried asking him to come along to things, like picnics or days out and he ususally says he cant, or says he will and then cancels at the last min :(

You know, its just how it is. i cant change it, but it irks me that he thinks none of this is/should be an issue and they ( and i ) are being horrible to him.