Want to make my marriage work but not sure how..

[BirdFromDaNorf]

I don't know how to phrase this very well and it's not just one thing in isolation, but I just want some help because my DH really irritates me. We are arguing a lot, I don't want to spend time with him and I'm now thinking about how much easier life would be if we were separated.

He's a stay at home dad in the week whilst I work full time (self employed) and he works evenings on the weekends (his choice, because he wants us to save for a deposit for a second house). He is a brilliant dad. But he's crap at house work, shopping, knowing what time boys need collecting from pre school, buying birthday cards, planning meals, paying bills, tidying, washing, ironing, - anything and everything that I used to do when he worked and I was a stay at home mum.

We've got the role reversal thing going on in some ways - ie: I work and provide the money for us to live on. But he's not doing his bit for his role. Instead, this week, he's been making the boys a tree house. And a brilliant one it is too. Apart from the fact that he used the business card to buy the wood for it without telling me he was using it.

The house is a crap hole and now he's at work, I'm supposed to tidy, hoover, clean, wash, and iron am I? Because he's fecked about all week making a chuffing tree house? Every week there's a project, or something that needs doing. He never just gets his head down and does the jobs in question.

It's driving me nuts. It makes me think "He could have the boys in the week and I'll have them on the weekend". I just want it to stop, I want peace and quiet and an orderly life. His fecking about is driving me around the bend.

Does anyone else have this? In isolation, none of the issues are enough to get divorced over but part of me thinks it would be good for us to separate so I can get on with life.

Any thoughts please?

You are going to have to treat him like a child with a star chart, do a division of chores schedule on excel and colour code it, you are going to have to do him some kind of time sheet for the day, i.e Monday put washing on, when finished hang on line, and make sure he sticks to it. Tell him that you have no problem with his projects but you work full time and should not be coming home to a shit hole.

Tell him that the wood for the tree house is not a legitimate business expense and cannot be used as a purchase on your business and that you are really pissed about it as now you have to be seen to be paying your business back the money for the wood.

What be the point of having a second home if he cannot maintain the home he already has?

May be a daft question but have you spoken to him about all this?
Do you think you could have a serious discussion about this probably not in the way that you have posted?
It sounds from your post that what you need is to switch roles....

Fabby - you have a point, but I think if , as a until-very-recently SAHM my DH had treated me like that he'd be out on his ear.

I think boogiewoogie may have a point. Maybe your DH is better suited to being a fab weekend-and-evenings dad. My DH is a great dad, but I know his priorities are not the same as mine. I really don't know what kind of SAHD he'd make. Better than me in some ways. I'd hope that if we sat calmly and discussed it we'd be able to reach a compromise. If not, then I do wonder if you need to swap back.

Thank you Fabby and Boogie for replying. I'm sat here festering on it, torn between tidying up the house and cleaning or leaving it to shout at him to fix it and sort it out.

I like the Fabby suggestion. I don't know if he'd go for it. Perhaps we can agree it so that I do what he wants me to do in terms of contributing to the house as well?

We try to discuss this, but it ends up in a screaming argument. I would happily swap roles back but I earn much more than him now than he would be able to get. So I am working whilst we have the opportunity to earn the money.

Is this what marriage is sometimes, for better and worse etc, someone being crap and you chivvying them along, like their mother? It's not very enjoyable. It's not what I want it to be for next 20 years.

What does he say when you talk to him about it? Does he want to go back to being the main earner? Can you afford for him to be the main earner if you earn more than him?
The thing is, while a SAHP is likely to be doing more of the housework than the WOHP, the SAHP's main 'job' is childcare, so domestic shitwork is a shared responsibility to a certain extent. I usually suggest that people look at how much leisure time each adult in the relationship has ie time to see friends, indulge in hobbies, go for a walk, but time that is spend without doing either childcare or chores. If it's not roughly equal, then nor is the relationship.
Unfortunately it is possible that at the bottom of it, he has a deep conviction that domestic shitwork is women's work and if he actually does it his cock will fall off. So he does the childcare, but leaves the rest of it for you because you;re a woman and that's what women are for.

Have both of you on a domestic schedule, so that you both know what is expected of you on a day to day basis, even down to who baths the kids on what days.

At least then he can see how much you will be doing, you work too so you do need to be able to sit down when you get home.

I know if my dh gave me a list of stuff I was supposed to do as a sahm, I would not take it kindly. I think SGB has it right.

Get a cleaner

IMO seeing dad make a fab treehouse is a fantastic thing; at least he wasn't sitting on his arse watching daytime shite TV

OP, I hate to say this because it won't actually help you any, but if my DH suddenley decided to spend all that time making our DCs a treehouse, I would be ecstatic. He is pretty rubbish at doing stuff with the DCs, so I would be amazed if he did anything like that.

Sod the housework, go and enjoy the treehouse with your DCs.
Also, don't give him a list of jobs to do. Just imagine how pissed you would have felt if he had done that to you when you were a SAHM.

I have met Nick Robinson! He has a dog!

Really, what's it called?

The thing is she has already had words with him about it all, so now it is about getting things done, no way should she have to return to a shit hole after doing a full days work. I would hate that if it was me and it would make me feel depressed as if I had to start all over again.

I was lucky, the childrens father was a sahd and he would hoover, dust, wash up, and have dinner almost ready.

So when I came home all I had to do was spend time with my children.

damnit - don't know. Naughty spanially type thing . Is this a test ?

No not a test, just interested in all things Nick.

Although you think you'd like out, the message title is that you want it to work.... which is a positive sign.

I would definitely go with a cleaner, its the best money I spend!! As for times etc, I have a weekly planner on the wall, can put up times, reminders for birthdays and at the start of the week and go through what's coming up.

The boys must love the treehouse, its just a man's focus is so different to ours.

Would you really be happy not seeing your boys at all in the week? Give it time and see if things can change, as a single mum of 3 I can say that the grass is not always greener.

It's really not about male focus being different: I spend time building stuff for the kids and pootling around doing projects. Admittedly I do housework as well, but some days dh'll come home to a tip because we've been out all day or I've been building a den. I see the sahm as being about the children not about the housework, I'm not a housewife.

I work 25 hours but I am the same some days. I go out in the afternoons to my friends and take my daughter out and sometimes my husband comes home to a complete and utter mess (I always joke that we have been burgled!) So what if he is having fun with the kids. My husband and I think having fun with our child is more important than everything being always organised.

Sometimes the flat is really organised and then some days its absolutely the other end of the spectrum! My husband has never once moaned at me though as if I have been out fun places with our daughter then thats more important imo. If you talk to him and then he does those things a couple of days a week and plays the rest then I would say it was a good balance. The children are only young once think of the brilliant memories they will have.

If you split up wouldn't he get the house, and the children would live with him?

And you'd be paying him maintenance.

Would that make you happier?

i have been there. we reached the point were we were so miserable things had to change it was making us both ill/ anxious/ miserable etc

questions to ask:

is your husband willing to change?
are you willing to change?
what are you personal flaws, we all have them, learn from each other
learn to find a way to accomodate some flaws, noone is perfect
understand what pisses you off/ what pisses him off
talk about the fact that your relationship is going downhill

how:

write to each other about how you would like it to be: dont criticse be constructive in how you do it. for example do it in this format:

-what i love about you
-what i miss about us
-agree the format for discussion - things i dislike and how i would prefer them to be. followed by what can i do to help you/ support you
-things i dislike: scenario and the resulting conflict. what you would prefer to happen; same scenario and different result. list methodically but be logical dont be overly emotional when having this discussion - men are very factualmatter of fact. dont get angry
-what can i do to help you/ support you
-what can i do to improve US, how i want us to be
-do we have a commitment on this?

if you both do that and come together to discuss
also, have an agreement that if one of you says something you do not like ie the tone/ inference etc. agree that you can say 'i dont like the way you have just said that and our agreement is that i can tell you that (without it leading to a row)'

agree to quickly apologise/ make up/ not harper on

as an addition

i think as a woman to fix your marriage it is really important that you still love your husband. ie. you want him as the man in your life. if your husband is not the provider this may have an (unknown) effect on how you see him. it will undoubtedly be affecting him also because men want to be in that position. most men i know are pretty rubbish at tidying up too! they need strict instructions but you will need to tell him in a non argumentative way or it will descend into a row. ive been there. he must learn about you more and what you like (ie the tidyness is one). hope you close the divisions

well part of being a great parent is about responsibility. not just playing around...

house work - get a cleaner and let it slide -being with kids more important

ironing - most stuff doesnt need ironing or get an ironer person to do it for you

knowing what time boys need collecting from pre school = that is part of responsibility of being a dad - you shouldnt need to be on his case. if he is late let pre school have words with him

shopping/food etc - make it easier. shopping - online. do it once then its same every week. tick "same as last time" then all you need is small bits and pieces. planning meals -well have the same very week. then the online shop will do itself.

bills - everything on direct debit.

birthday cards - buy a pile and keep in stock or use something like book people.co.uk for card collections

depends just how "great" he really is, really.... if he loving, respectful, has many good points then compromise and find a way...

Haven't read all the replies so this might be a x post, but why don't you start (as someone suggested) putting together a chart of stuff that 'has' to be done, such as ironing, hoovering etc, then putting names beside each task to be completed by the end of the week.

That way you can both see how much effort each of you are putting into maintaining the house, but it will also give him chance to 'pratt' about with tree houses and such which he obviously likes doing.

Had to do this with my DH as he spent so much time pissing about with his bikes that I ended up doing all the house/kid stuff whilst also having a full time job. It's not ideal (and we don't live in an ideal world) but sometimes we have to treat them like kids so they understand what's important and what being an adult/parent is about. My DH would have sworn blind he put in as much effort to the house as I did, but it wasn't until we started 'tracking' what was done that he realised he really was taking the piss!

Oh and someone has also suggested this, and it was the best thing we did too, was to get a cleaner in once every two weeks to do the basic stuff which meant the house got a good clean every two weeks and we now just give it a 'once' over, once a week. Stopped all sorts of arguments :)