I can't take anymore - warning long post

[CallyJade]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/1011817-Over-to-the-MN-Jury

The above is a thread I started with a different user name. I have been on MN for about two years now, but am a frequent name-changer due to paranoia! I know all about Shiney's penguins and my favourite thread was about someones house guest who used rolls and rolls of toilet tissue!

The rest of my story is below and is muddled, I'm upset tonight and what I have written below I have just sent as an email to a friend who didn't know very much. And I just thought that I could post it here to ask for some support.

The week before xmas when we were all off work, he decided to stay in
his dressing gown for two whole days. He just watched tv, no
interaction with the family whatsoever. He did cheer up for Christmas
day but then started drinking even more heavily than usual - as in
would start early evening, keep drinking until the early hours, get up
at three and then start drinking again at four - one of these days was
the day that I started the conversation where I said we weren't working
anymore and we would be better living apart. He agreed he wasn't nice
to live with and would move out.

He hates anyone being in the house - wants pretty much silence. I cant
hoover or have a radio on when he is in bed, and of course he's in bed
most of the time. If we interupt the tv prog he is watching he sighs,
or turns it up. we stay in the dining room all the time now to talk and
he will pointedly shut the living room door. His mum was staying last
year and when she commented on something in the middle of a film he
threw the remote down with a crash. She's dying of cancer and he wont
go and see her very much, wont do anything for her.

Anyway, since then, he alternates between completely ignoring me (which
is fine) or being concerned. He went to see my mum last Thursday
and slagged me off to her. He is drinking heavily every night and
slamming doors and stamping around and deliberately dropping stuff on
the floor to wake me up - at all times of the night. I sleep in the living room on the sofa.

He went back to work today - he came home early saying that he was
having a nervous breakdown and apparently walked out. He did go to the
Drs tonight and asked me to drive him, which I did. He came out and
said he needed another appointment next week and made one. Then as we
walked out he said that the dr had asked me to go along too - 1. to get
my opinion on his depression, 2. to talk me into going to marriage
councelling. The dr gave him sleeping tablets and signed him off work
for two weeks. (oh joy) Apparently he asked for stronger tablets or ADs but she wouldn't give them to him.

We decided to go and talk away from the kids so just sat in the car - I
started to explain that I just couldn't live with him anymore and he
cut me dead saying he'd heard all that. I asked what he wanted to say
and he said he loved me and wanted us to stay together. I said that
wasn't going to happen. Then he said that if I wanted to move out I
could but he wasn't going anywhere. he said I am an unfit mother and he
couldn't leave his kids with me. I lost it completely and told him
exactly what he was like to live with - he asked me to take him home
and I said he had to finish listening to me first. Apparently now I
have kept him prisoner against his will, attacked him while he is
vulnerable, the Dr has signed him off with stress and I am obviously
not supportive at all because i have just made it all worse by losing
my temper. This being the first time in over a year that I have
bothered to argue back.

I really laid it on the line - how the kids wouldn't stay in the house,
how he'd let DD1 down both on her birthday and to do with her Christmas
party. How we all tip toe around, not daring to invite anyone over,
make the slightest noise etc. How the kids didnt want to live with him,
how unhappy they all are.

He got back and immediately started drinking - DD1 realised what had
happened and tried to reason with him but its all my fault, he is
completely blameless.

He just went into DD2s room and asked if she was "one of the ones
complaining about the noise at night" she said she was never here, he
went on "well its not me its the pipes under the floor, if you think
its me you'll have to fucking video me to prove it" at this point I
went up, telling him to leave the kids alone - he turned to DD2 and
said "tell your mother we're having a nice chat" which of course she
did. So then he called me a tart and told me to fuck off. Several
times.

He takes every opportunity to put me down, has called me fat, I dont
speak concisely enough, theres no need to talk to him as have nothing
interesting to say, I wont do anything with him (like put up a tent or
something) because he will start to yell at me that I'm doing it wrong,
I cant drive, I cant put shopping away properly, Christ, you name it
and i'm useless at it.

My DDs are 21, 19 and 17 - the two oldest have longterm boyfriends with whom they stay with most nights now. My youngest spends a lot of her time at my best mates house.

He has never done anything for the kids - ever. I do it all. He is now being ultra nice to them, for example, I went out New Years Evening and he checks that DD3 had got home ok. He never does this. The implication being - your mother is out gallivanting and doesn't care about your well being.

So sorry for the mega long post but I didn't want to drip feed. Congratulations if you got this far!

:(

I hope he gets the medical help he so desperately needs, and I agree that he needs to move out.

You poor, poor thing. Your life sounds absolutely horrendous. I don't really like to ask this, but why are you still with him? He is very nasty to you and you sound as though you are doing anything you can to make things better.

If you can, I think you should persuade him to go to AA as his drinking seems to be a big problem. Also, maybe his mother's illness is affecting him but he doesn't want to admit it? Going to the doctor's at least is a step in the right direction.

I don't really know what to advise you, but thinking of you and your DDs xx

Hope that someone will be able to help with more constructive advice.

I was still with him because I didn't have the guts to change things. And, to be honest, when you live with something for years you normalise it. Actually, when I started on MN, it was reading the relationship threads that made me realise my life isn't normal.

He knows now that we are not together anymore but is adamant that he will not move out.

I have said that any abusive behaviour, such as the banging around at night, and I will call the police and they will remove him.

And, he admitted that he only went to the Drs to persuade me that he could stay.

Oh love, poor you, your poor DC.

I've had similar to this but with dope not booze.

He really does need to leave.

I hope that you can find a way to make him see sense and do the right thing.

God what a miserable life you have all had, thanks to this self obsessed twat!

He might be forcibly removed if he is making you a victim of domestic violence, and in my opinion, you are. The noise and intentionally depriving you of sleep is one.

So sorry for you. Are you sure in your mind it is done?

I am completely positive that it is over - I have even rung up Child Tax Credits today and told them we are not a couple anymore. And believe me, for me to do that, means I am completely emotionally detached.

DD1 thinks we should just find him some where to live and move him in - with or with out his consent.

I have separated our finances today and as soon as he gets January's wages he can go. We have enough money to pay a deposit, and i am fortunate in that I can pay for us all to stay in our house.

He is being ultra quiet tonight. He knows it won't take much to get me to call the police on him.

You are doing absolutely the right thing in getting rid of an abusive alcoholic. Because that's what this man is.
Just checking though - is the home in your name? if his name is on the tenancy/mortgage then you might need to check out the legal position before throwing him out, though the noise/abuse/sleep deprivation mean it shouldn't be that difficult to get him out if he refuses to go.

CJ - you don't need me to tell you that you are doing the right thing - but I will anyway You are doing the right thing :)

You clearly have DD1's support which is great (it's sad she has to be in this position, but good she's supportive).

I don't know what else you can do, other than what you have said - have you tried ringing womens aid? (Just for general advice - clearly he needs to move out).

As SGB said, where you do stand with the house?

Thanks everyone.

The house is owned jointly, so I know that I can't get him removed by anyone other than the police and reading about it, I would need to get a type of injunction.

I nearly rang womans aid last night but ended up talking to a friend instead.

You see the problem is I am having trouble accepting the situation is as bad as it is. One, because when the situation develops slowly you just adapt and two, when you are seen as a strong person it is difficult to believe that you have just let this happen for so long.

How awful :(

Can you change the locks next time he's out? Or is there a risk he'd get violent/angry?

People quite often advise changing the locks on MN, but I dont see that can do anything other than inflame the situation and force a confrontation. This is a man who is depressed, drinking and very angry. So he comes home one day to discover that he has been prevented access to his own home. Every single one of us (however rational we are) would be angry at that if it happened to us and its perfectly likely that damage would be done to gain access. He's not even rational, so what would he do?

Said on another thread how desperate situations can easily become your 'normal' and you can start questioning your own outlook. This isnt normal, but then you know that really. Its affecting you and its affecting your children. Please stop questioning yourself and start believing your instincts.

Get some advice from a family law solicitor as a first step. Maybe having someone like that to hold your hand (plus all the support on here) will help you to start out on a very tough journey, but one that will ultimately make you and your children much happier.

Yes you need legal advice. If you are married then you will probably need to issue a divorce petition. He may then take you more seriously. Can you afford to pay him half the equity in the house ( or maybe you rent?)

We own the house in joint names. I can afford to buy him out by DD2 and I taking out a mortgage between us to cover his half of the equity.

However, at the moment I do not want to suggest this. It is something I want to keep as a last resort. DD3 is still at school in the first year of A levels and I would like the breathing space of waiting til she finishes before DD2 and I do anything that can't be undone easily.

Get thee to a solicitor then! If he won't move out before a financial settlement then you'll have to do what you describe, but you need to get him to take you seriously. When he does he may move out.

I am amazed you've put up with it for this long

he's an alcoholic and he's abusive, the two no doubt are intertwined

until he gets serious help for his drinking, he cna;t be the hubsand and father you all deserve

he needs a wake up call, it might help, he might hit rock bottom and get himself sorted or he might not, but you have your self and your children to protect

I am worried that the 2 weeks sick leave he has off work will extend.

I can see him making himself longterm sick - he won't get paid after 4 weeks - and then it will be that he can't afford to move out.

CJ - then get him out now before that happens - do whatever it takes. Ring Womens Aid, keep this bumped, make an appointment at the Solicitors - just get moving on it.

Don't waste time wondering where it all went wrong, how you 'let' it happen (your words not mine!!) or anything else. If you need to, you can work through those feelings later - right now you need action and to get him out!!

Remember that this is not your fault it's his. He is an adult who has chosen not to get help for his alcoholism and depression. Not only is it not your job to fix him, it's not possible to fix him unless he's prepared to take responsibility for himself.
Right now you need to get him out of the house and it is doable - talk to Women's Aid and a solicitor and get him out ASAP. You may have to either sell the place or buy him out, but given his behaviour, you will be able to get him physically out of there before then.

Been trying to get through to womens aid earlier when he left the house but couldn't get through.

Have decided to go to the Drs too. And spoken to someone who works for the CAB for some advice.

"D"H tonight has said he will move out but it will be "when he's better" as the Dr has told him not to make any decisions at the moment.

I tried to talk about this and explain how unreasonable that is, how we are all suffering and he refused to talk anymore. Walked off and locked himself in the bedroom. DD1 tried too and in the end she resorted to writing him a letter and slipping it under the door.

Oh, and he apologised for the argument last night... but it was still all my fault for picking that moment to talk...

God, I want to give up...

Don't give up - get angry.

Tell him it's OK, you agree with his Dr, he shouldn't be making any decisions - you have done it for him and and he's moving out.

Tell him he has until the weekend to find somewhere to go or you'll do that for him too.

Don't let him linger or he will do what you said earlier, be signed off work for ages and use it as an excuse to stay and mope about making all of you more miserable.

Have you thought about contacting Al-Anon? They may have some good advice.

are you ok?

I am ok thanks, long day at work yesterday so didn't get on here.

I came home and he'd hoovered and cleared up and is being oh so nice. It is very difficult to keep a straight head. Also a conversation with a male friend about the situation has got me doubting myself - this is ridiculous!

I can cope with arguments or being ignored but this is really messing with my head now and I feel so pathetic.

Ok, I can't help seeing this from his point of view, imagine the MN posting:

"DW has decided that after 20 odd years of marriage that she doesn't want to be with me anymore. I don't know what I have done. I know she has changed over the last 2 years, going out more and gradually distancing herself from me. Eventually I lost my temper with her and yelled that I wanted a divorce, when she agreed I felt devastated - it has confirmed all my worse fears. We talked the next day and she has agreed we can try again to make a go of it.

The trying again didn't work very well, mainly because I carried on drinking - I had cut down drastically but I couldn't manage to completely give up. I tried hiding the drinking because I knew it would make her angry, I'm not sure whether she knew or not but it now feels like she is avoiding me all the time,

We ended up talking last week and DW has confirmed my fears - she doesn't want to keep trying, she doesn't want to live with me anymore. Since then i have been trying harder, to convince her i can change.

I am trying, I don't sit in front of the TV all the time now, I have started to join in conversations rather than ignoring everyone. I have started playing a sport with everyone to join in and involve myself in family life more.

The one thing I have not managed is to give up drinking, I am trying and have now been to the Dr for help. I am making an effort around the house and I am being really nice to the DDs and asking them about what is happening in their lives.

I still love her and don't want to leave but what else can i do?"

I also have a nagging feeling that I am enjoying the attention from the drama - how much of this is really what I want? God, I am so mixed up at the moment.

Cally, have a look at Bibi's thread about getting rid of a dickhead.
The thing to remember with losers like your H is that they will often engage in a flurry of niceness when you try to chuck them out but if you back down, the niceness will rapidly dwindle away because they have decided that you don't actually have the guts to get rid of them, and all they need to do is make an occasional effort when your whining gets too loud in order for normal service to resume.