Trying to fix our sex life is like pulling teeth

[chamenange]

Stress + 2 small children + various other things and our sex life dwindled to nothing about 5 years ago.

We are both severely lacking in confidence sexually, and not particularly compatible.

So, we pottered along just not having sex at all. After a while I stopped wanting it altogether. Outside of sex we have a pretty strong marriage, we like and love each other, we adore our children, we want much the same from life and make a good team.

Then we agreed to try for a 3rd baby. Bit awkward, trying to have sex with someone you have been living with platonically for years. There always seemed to be a reason why we couldn't do the deed. Excuses excuses. Then we had a long chat, agreed that we needed to work on things and that if we were going to have this baby we needed to go for it.

We tried. Dh completely failed to get aroused. It made me realise that we had a problem rather than just having let things slide.

We had massive conversations about everything, we both had separate counsilling sessions, we were honest about everything, sometimes painfully so. There was tears, shouting, talking, long letters explaining.

We came to a point where we both agreed that we didn't want our marriage to end over this, and we would try, take things slowly, 'rediscover' each other with no pressure to go all the way.

But it just hasn't happened.

We are so awkward and embarrassed.

Every tiny step has been me. If I never whispered a word on the subject again dh would never ever ever ever bring it up.

We STILL haven't actually had sex. It has been months since we first spoke about it. We did have one rather awkward session, all insigated by me, which I don't think dh enjoyed much.

One thing he said months ago was that he feels unsexy because he has put on weight, and that he wanted to get fitter. He has taken up swimming every morning, and I am very encouraging and supportive. I also told him he is attractive to me.

But I am now screaming inside my head "FOR FUCKS SAKE YOU HAVE BEEN GOING FOR A LITTLE SWIM EVERY MORNING FOR 6 WEEKS NOW AND WE STILL HAVEN'T FUCKING HAD SEX".

I have asked him to go for a medical check-up. He sort of agrees but then doesn't.

I end up feeling so resentful. This is partly fueled by my very powerful aching for another baby, but I am very aware of this and try to keep it in check.

I feel like I have the only man in the world who never wants sex. I am not unattractive. I am loving, I am a nice person. I am not overweight. I don't have BO or 3 noses. Why is this such a big deal.

He is like a Harry Enfield character. All "oh gosh, oh dear, goodness, jolly jolly embarrassing, shall I make you a cup of tea dear?"

Last night I snuggled in to him, we chatted a bit about our lovely weekend, I kissed him a bit and stroked him, and asked him if he wanted to, y'know...

He reached into his pants and said "oh, well I'm not aroused I'm afraid"

FFS throw me a bone here. Could he not have said "oh there's an idea!" and started kissing me back?? Apparently not.

I ask you, HOW am I supposed to get anything remotely resembling a sex life out of this?

I could easily fancy him and enjoy having sex with him, but I find his manner, the things he says and his attitude to me and sex completely sexless and about as erotic as a dishcloth. He doesn't mean to be like this. He says he wants to revive our sex life. He just has no idea. It is like trying to get amorous with an embarrassed dead fish.

I think his first choice would be for no one to ever mention sex again, but he loves me and will work on things so I don't leave him.

I said lightly "oh well, another night then, kissed him and rolled over".

I could have said "well I'm sure we can do something about that" and upped it a notch, but (a) even a blow job isn't necessarily going to work, and (b) I need some encouragement. This is really hard for me too. It probably seems like a small thing, but my overtures last night took a lot of courage. And I got knocked back again.

It's like pulling teeth.

If I never say a word about sex again we will live for the rest of our lives never having sex again.

So many people taking the time to reply. Thank you all. I have read the replies but been feeling too muddled about it all to know what to think or post.

Still no progress. But when he is only at home 2 nights a week it is not surprising we're not getting anywhere fast.

Artermis - interesting idea about a RIGHT to sex. Not sure what I think about that. It has made me remember a furious argument (in our old house so at least 6 years ago) where I said that if he didn't want to have sex with me I would go elsewhere, and him absolutely breaking down and begging me not to, and swearing that he did want to have a physical relationship with me, "a whole relationship" he called it.

Secret - I have heard about the turkey baster method. It would feel like admitting my marriage is fucked. I want to have sex with my husband. One day I would like to concieve our 3rd child by having sex.

Italian Lady - thanks for the sympathy and the luck.

Comma - Solidarity, Sista :(

Carmen - I struggle to understand it too. It is very sad, and it makes me so angry sometimes. This is it, my one life, and here I am not having sex with the man I love and live with for years and years at a time. No, sex just wasn't mentioned for yeas, baring the occasional pointed remark from me. Yes, when we talked about having another baby we talked about sex in a light hearted "blimey, do you think we can remember how?" sort of way. Turns out we can't.

Totoros - I can't tell him I will leave him unless I mean it. I can't leave him because we have two small children. And we love each other. And we both want to fix this.

Wolf - am going to google low testosterone.

Carmen (again) - it has only come to the surface because of the idea of another baby, but it is a lot more complicated than me "only being bothered" because of the baby idea. Of course I want a happy, fulfilling, functional sex life with my husband. At the same time I feel hugely resentful towards him. I find it near impossible to feel sexy when going through the motions with a man who is desparately self consious and finds the whole thing a bit distasteful. I fucking hate him over this sometimes. I also feel guilty about the anger because I also know that more than anything he loves me and wants to be able to give me a normal sex life, but something is stopping him and he doesn;t know what it is, emotional or physical. It is killing him and he wants to fix it. But then I don;t mention it for a week and he retreats back into the safety of ignoring it and it might go away and I feel fucking furious again that he isn;t doing more to try and get to the bottom of it.

I also feel particularly out at sea over all this because apart from the sex we have a great marriage, and the person I turn to when things are shitty is him. And I want to cry and swear and throw things and for him to understand and hug me and make it all better like he always does but I can't because he is a part of the problem. And I can't talk to any of my friends about it. And I am not really in contact with my family. So it's just me and mumsnet. It makes me feel so lonely and isolated (a pattern handily mirrored in other areas of life where we live in a foreign country and are about to be moving to another one where we know no one) Thank god for Mumsnet eh?

Venus - thank you for your long post. I think I am scared that if I say that the baby is off the agenda, he will hear that sex is also off the agenda. It is interesting that Acanthus said dh prob feels wanted only for a baby. In a way that is true, but only in that I am using the need for a baby to make me want to have sex with him. I want to want to have sex with him because I know our marriage needs us to have a proper sex life. But in some ways I don't want to have sex with him because I feel angry and resentful and not terribly lustful. I want to push him away, not put ALL my fears and feelings to one side to initiate sex, be gracious in rejection, and gently encouraging and selfless in helping him make his first tentative steps back into the swing of things. In my head I'm shouting "WHAT ABOUT ME???" This was perfectly illustrated when we had a bit of a breakthrough a month or so back and he said in surprise "that's the first time you've touched me [on his willy] for years" and I know he thought this was a great positive step but I was thinking "yeah... and when was the last time you touched me down there?" but I didn't say anything and he didn't make any moves in that direction. Pathetic. Both of us.

I am a bit overwhelmed by those 4 steps. It seems like a lot to take on at once.

1. I think our communication is good and we enjoy doing things together. We have lots of weekend activities.
2. Not sure about this - do you mean talking about it?
3. Are people really comfortable casually talking about what turns them on? I can't imagine that (but am not doubting it).
4. I used to try this but I don't think he likes touching me. I often stroke or massage him. I will ask him to rub my back or feet - when he does his usual perfunctory 40 seconds and then says "all done" what do I say?

God. This whole thing is making me generally snippy and grumpy. IT is spilling into every area of our lives now.

As a man, not sure I can help too much, but apart from the testosterone issue and general possibility that he is basically asexual, one thing that was asked earlier that you didn't answer was why/when etc does he masturbate (think that's the first time I've ever written that word - the vernacular would be used normally!)

Just strikes me that at some level he must have some degree of sexuality and that therefore it is more likely to be a psychological issue - if you can work out what does turn him on in the above cases, then maybe that could be a starting point... It's unusual that he would (sorry) wank without using something (fantasy/visual/literary) as a stimulus of some sort.

Best of luck

I also think medical problems might need to be investigated - it doesn't sound like how the average man would behave.

Also, you mention that he has been very self-concious in the past - maybe a little bit of alcohol may also help lower inhibitions when needed. :) Sit down together in front of a romantic comedy with a glass of wine or whatever, and it might, at least make him open to you cuddling up, and could perhaps lead somewhere. How about 'Groundhog Day'? If you've seen it before, it's always a good one to rewatch. It's about an achingly slow-growing relationship, finding out about the likes and dislikes of a partner. It's also a fairly accurate description of where you are at the moment (same thing happening over and over again) Could help him see that it is worthwile to persist. ;)

I'm afraid to say, I think anyone who hasn't had experience of a man with a low sex drive probably doesn't really 'get' this.

This isn't about her 'finding out what turns him on' or 'just going down on him'. He doesn't really like sex very much. There are plenty of men and women with very low libidos too, they just don't tend to talk about it very much (esp. the men).

I had a long-term relationship in my 20s with a man who preferred music /drink / drugs/ watching a film to sex. I was ALWAYS the one who initiated sex - and although he was usually capable, I knew if it was down to him he'd be doing something else. It makes you feel unsexy, because I think for a lot of women, our sexuality is tied up in feeling desirable - well it is for me.

So OP, by all means check out the medical options, and I'd be interested to know if this is 'treatable', but I suspect if this has been the case for years, this is how it will always be. It's not suddenly going to get better. Your DH is who he is.

I think it might be a good idea to consider what that means for you, can you live like this for the rest of your life? Maybe an open relationship would be the way forward? Sorry to be gloomy, but I think it's time for a reality check.

You need to go a bit further. Few ideas:

1/ why not write a fantasy to each other in letters. Let your imaginations go wild and explore each other through words first.

2/ why not masturbate in front if him and maybe let him watch and join in. Men love this. You will need to do a few things- try a wax to spice things up. Surprise him with this. Then give him a object such as a candle and make it all about you and your pleasure. This will tease him. if you are sexual it will arouse him

3/ he knows what you like so you need new things. Read up in new ideas (literotica.com). If you don't surprise him he will get board. But this us why masturbation in front if hum is best first. Don't let him dive in and fail. Let him touch and tease him. He can build confidence this way.

4/ once he has helped you a few times, bund him, blindfold him and tease him. This way the embarrassment is gone as his eyes are closed and he can fantasize away. Work this very gradually- tease, tease, and dint untie him.

5/ in the end nice you spice him up, you can slip onto him one time and make love to him while he us bound. Guys love being controlled and your teasing will take him where he needs to be.

Hope it goes well.

Apologies if I've missed this, but does he masturbate? What was your sex life like in the beginning?

And do you really think that bringing a baby into a marriage devoid of intimacy is a good idea?

I totally feel for you and your situation. How about thinking of this problem in a different way. Rather than focus on sex, perhaps focus on how you can improve communication, so that you get to the point where you are comfortable at least talking about the problem you have with sex?

Some ideas:
You mentioned each having counselling, did you also have counselling together?
You mentioned writing long letters. Could you start by encouraging him to respond to a note with a note. That way he has time to think about it and doesnt feel confronted and embarrassed. Try writing open questions (those where you cant give a yes/no answer) as these are less confrontational.

How do you communicate with each other? In what way is it good and what could work better?