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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Should we lie to save dh's licence?

102 replies

goodwife · 23/08/2003 13:10

Moral dilemma here - and due to the nature of the dilemma, I'm going under a pseudonym.
The facts are as follows:

Over the last year dh has had 3 lots of speeding fines. Today he has had notification in the post that he was caught going 85 in a 70mph last week. As far as I am aware, this means that he will get another 3 points, making 12, which means a ban from driving (not sure how long for - anyone got any ideas?). Now if he's banned, then obviously this will have an impact on the family as a whole - he is able to get to work by public transport, and it is possible to get the children to school without a car (he does the morning school run), so not a drastic one, but obviously there are many times when he does things involving the car which he would no longer be able to do, and would therefore be down to me - running children to classes etc, shopping, taking stuff to the tip, etc. etc. Also, once he is able to drive again, the insurance premiums (already huge) would be even huger (is that a word?)

So where's the moral dilemma? Well, we could say that it was me driving the car. This would mean that I would have the points and he would not be banned. But, selfishly, I really don't want to do this - I've got a clean licence, and always have had, and obviously this would also increase our insurance premiums, whereas if he wasn't driving at all they would be manageable. But should I put him and any future inconvenience of me always having to do the driving before my pride? Of course, this would also be illegal (maybe this should have come higher in the list of reasons against! ) and the penalty if we were found out could be a £2000 fine. But how could we be found out - can the camera "see" who's driving the car?
So, your thoughts and experiences will be gratefully received.

OP posts:
scoobysnax · 23/08/2003 19:40

I think there are relatively few of us who don't exceed the speed limit once or twice EVERY TIME WE DRIVE!
I am forever going a bit over 30 mph on quiet roads when there is no one around.
The only outings when I don't speed are when the traffic is too heavy for it to be possible (a lot of the time, I suppose!) or near speed cameras...
I am not a boy racer type driver and have had 1 ticket in 18 years... but there for the grace of god go lots of us...

85mph in good conditions and visibility with little traffic is not poor driving in my book, but 70mph in poor conditions IS!!!

IMO the potential punishment does not fit the crime, so I have sympathy for you both. Pretending it was you in the car however is a whole different ball game...

jasper · 23/08/2003 19:58

goodwwife you are indeed a goodwife or perhaps just a soft touch?

Four speeding offences in a year and three accidents in three years?

Are you serious about covering up for him with the possible risk of prossecution for yourself?

Be wise , woman! DO NOT COVER UP FOR YOUR HUSBAND who is frankly a menace on the roads and needs to learn a lesson he should have learned a long time ago. I hope you don't allow him to transport your kids anywhere.

Honestly, if my husband had your husband's track record he would be looking for a place to stay.

WideWebWitch · 23/08/2003 20:17

Mmm, well now you've mentioned the accidents I'm not so sure I'd go for it either. If you think he needs to learn a lesson then let him. I'd be very cross if my dp didn't slow down when I asked him to (not that he particularly likes it but I don't ask often and the way I see it, it's our lives in his hands so I've every right).

janh · 23/08/2003 20:17

Agree with scoobysnax - there but for the grace of god go lots of us. DH had one accident which was his fault - cresting a brow in a strange town he ran into the last car in a queue at traffic lights (oops).

The same day he got the car back, after being repaired from that, he was doing about 15mph in a housing estate taking DD2's friend home and some wannock pulled out from a side road without looking and ran into a rear door!

Following that, he drove into the back of a car waiting at a roundabout, which failed to go when it should have (ie absolutely nothing coming from the right. Careless but hardly criminal. I recently nearly ran into one which stopped mid-roundabout to let a car out of the petrol station the other side....some people just should not be driving, sorry!)

Three accidents in no time at all. Should I divorce him? Fortunately it is a company car - unfortunately the company operates "3 strikes and you're out" - ie if you make 3 claims, EVER, they will not insure you any more. Now when he has a minor bump (trolley in supermarket car park, anyone?) he gets it fixed with filler at the garage down the road...they do a nice job but still.

janh · 23/08/2003 20:21

DH does 30,000 miles a year btw - mostly motorway. Not a bad record relatively.

eidsvold · 23/08/2003 20:25

i'm sorry but it seems even after the previous offences and accidents he does not seem to have learnt his lesson. I would not take the rap if it is my dh - because it is wrong and it could set a precedent.

I live in a village that has an A road through it and the number of people that speed through the village - up to the speed camera and then once through - keep on. I have almost seen a man killed through a narrow miss with a truck when he could not be bothered to sit behind me at the speed limit and over took me - in the face of oncoming traffic - I had to brake hard to let him in front of me and had there been an accident the truck would have pushed him into me and my daughter and given that I had the smallest car I shudder to think what would happen.

I have also been almost wiped out and seen other people almost wiped out on a mini round about near me - WHY?!? because people on the main road don't look - to see if anyone is turning into the side road or out of the side road. They are just not looking - or can't be bothered to give way as they should.

15 miles over the limit is a lot of stopping time in case of a problem - with you and the children in the car.

No you should not take the rap. Yes it will be inconvenient and perhaps with you reminding him why it is inconvenient every day of the ban - Hopefully he will learn his lesson. What do you think it will take for him to learn his lesson -which it seems he has not despite the accidents and nine points!!! - be in a serious accident?!?!? That is not a nice thought!!!

Speed does kill..... and inattention and carelessness along with speeding just as bad!!

sis · 23/08/2003 20:28

I'm with Jasper on this one - maybe your dh needs a break from driving to calm the speeding down...

Original poster
goodwife · 23/08/2003 21:02

Just had a conversation with dh, told him I do not want to take the points for him - despite the fact that it makes me feel really bad, and it will be all of us paying for his mistakes. I said to him that I feel he never gets "punished" for his misdemeanors and although we will all feel the effects if he is banned, it will also teach him a lesson. Sorry if I sound self-righteous, but it's how I feel. He knows he hasn't got a leg to stand on, so he didn't put up any resistance, but he did say that if the roles were reversed, he wouldn't think twice about taking the rap for me. How bad did I feel then. But I think I'm going to stick to my guns. So maybe my name should be "badwife".

OP posts:
Amelia73 · 23/08/2003 21:24

I don't think you should take the rap for your husband goodwife. To have been caught speeding three times in a year doesn't indicate to me a safe driver.

Sure it will be inconvenient for you all with him not being able to drive but look at it this way, If for some reason tomorrow you couldn't afford to run a car would you survive without it? Of course you would. Plenty of people manage without cars. And they can get their children to classes do the shopping and get things taken to the tip etc etc.

Maybe he needs to lose his licence for a while to knock into him the fact that he shouldn't be speeding and be more aware on the roads.

Ghosty · 23/08/2003 21:35

goodwife ... I understand your dilemma as I would want to help my husband too in that situation ... but I agree with all who say that your husband needs to take the rap for his own actions.
He needs to learn his lesson the hard way ... and 12 points in 1 year and 3 accidents in 3 years tells me that he is a menace to other people on the road and is irresponsible ...
By covering up for him how far will it go? Will you keep covering up for him until you have 12 points on your license? How would you feel if he killed someone (or himself) in an accident while speeding in a month's time when really he should not have a license and therefore would not be driving ....??
I think by telling him you will not cover up for him you have done every other road user a favour .... and possibly you have saved a life ...

misdee · 23/08/2003 21:38

i wouldnt lie. my dad told my brother when he past his test that a car is a weapon if he abuses it. i have seen many accidents, hate people speeding, was almost knocked down at the pedestrian crossing when the green man was on becuase a driver was speeding and just didnt stop, i had my 2 kids with me at the time. i swore loudly.
maybe a year without a car will bring home to your dh that his actions have consequences. (and just dont bother going down the tip, leave it for him for when he does get his liscence back.)

sb34 · 23/08/2003 23:23

Message withdrawn

bloss · 24/08/2003 00:15

Message withdrawn

EmmaTMG · 24/08/2003 07:37

Goodwife, your DH said he wouldn't think twice about the points if the role were reversed. I would be VERY surprised if he did. If it was you who had so many points/accidents recently he'd want to teach you a lesson too.
DO NOT let him make you feel bad, he's the one in the wrong by a very long way.

doormat · 24/08/2003 11:50

Agree with the majority here.
I would not lie to get my dh out of the crap.Everyone has to face the responsibility of their actions.

Goodwife how would you feel if you took the rap for him and within a few weeks he had an accident which seriously maimed or killed someone?

Would you be able to live with that decision?

runragged · 24/08/2003 12:11

Goodwife, I think you have done the right thing especially as it wont affect him too much. He can get to work and ccan pick up the kids. I am the proud owner of a dh who gor 4 speeding tickets in 2 months less than 6 months after he got his licence, god I was mad, expecially as it was on his scooter! Your dh wont be able to just fill in the form and send it back as he has already got 9 points, it will have to go to court, but in all likelyhodd it will do him good(!) I bought my dh a bike for his birthday - he had no idea how unfit he was until he started to cycle to work.

As far as your insurance premiums go they wont get that much higher as with 3 accident, 9 points and a stolen car surely you must be nearing the maximum!

Batters · 24/08/2003 12:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Janstar · 25/08/2003 01:20

Have read this thread with interest. Has anyone read in the Sunday papers today about the new spy bug the government is thinking of putting in all cars? Goodwife, your husband would be facing enormous fines every day if this becomes law.

Original poster
goodwife · 25/08/2003 21:50

Well, he's filled in the form and sent it off with his name in the right boxes. This has really affected me badly, though, dreamt the other night that he was divorcing me, and have a continual feeling that I have done something wrong. Your responses have made me see him in a new light - I'm so used to thinking that he's the "good" person, and I'm the hormonal, shrieking, unreasonable monster who is lucky to have such a caring and considerate man. Which he is in many respects. But why do I feel like it's just one more of many things that I am going to have to be responsible for in this family? My burden is not going to be lightened....

OP posts:
anais · 25/08/2003 23:07

Goodwife, I agree you have made the right decision.

I have only been driving a couple of months (well I've been learning for about 4 years, but only passed my test a couple of months ago).

Every time I get in the car I think about what I have control of. A car can do so much damage. It's is a huge responsibility to have control of a car and I wish more people would take that responsibilty seriously. I don't know what the statistics are, but road deaths are a huge percentage of the number of deaths every year, and speeding is one of the major contributory factors.

I am constantly amazed by the speeds and way people drive. It's so easy to get into the habit of doing it and think you're safe. What will happen before your husband learns his lesson?? Does someone have to die before he stops speeding. He has had enough warnings - and as someone else suggested, if he has been caught 4 times, then that suggests he spends much of his time driving above the speed limit.

He is being incredibly selfish and thoughtless and I hope a ban will make him consider his behaviour. This makes me really angry.

jasper · 25/08/2003 23:25

goodwife, re feeling ever more responsible for the family.I think a lot of us feel like this.
Get hold of a copy of "I don't know how she does it" by Alison Pearson and at least you can enjoy a laugh about it. I have just finished it and it did me the world of good

karmaqueen · 26/08/2003 00:38

Every action ahs a consequence. He has been reckless and thoughtless and now he has time out. I hope he uses it to think about what a dangerous weapon a motor vehicle is.
You will cope with all the running around, wont it be a relief to not have the children in the car with him?
Also by doing the right thing you have shown your children that honesty is the best policy.

zebra · 26/08/2003 04:05

Speed limit is 30mph if there are street lights and no signs to indicate otherwise.

Said my driving instructor, 10 years ago, do I wint the prize, JanH?

ps: agree that Goodwife shouldn't take the rap, habitual speeding is arrogance!

spikeycat · 26/08/2003 11:02

well, I lied for my DP. We had just heard his grandmother had died while we were rushing to the hospital to get there in time when caught. He already had 9 points and I had none. He works and needs the car, I don't, he has two duaghters (my sd's) who he needs to be able to drive and see, I don't etc etc....

I don't think it was the right thing to do however, as a few months later he got caught again

wickedstepmother · 26/08/2003 11:23

It sounds to me like your DH needs a sharp shock to get him to rethink his speeding habits. It would appear that 3 accidents in 3 years and 4 speeding convictions in 1 year are not enough to do this. I would not take the rap for him in this situation. Perhaps the ban will be the boot up the ar*e he needs ? Also you will be 'hung, drawn and quartered' by the court if you are found out. If I were your DH I would never ask you to do such a thing.

P.S. I am not a 'halo-polisher' here. I am a fellow speeder. I got caught twice in one week, 1st time 115 in a 60 and the 2nd 118 in another 60. I am not proud of this and as I had been driving less than 2 years they threw the book at me. I lost my licence permanently and was told that I would have to wait 2 years before I could begin to learn again. I am now having to go through lessons and my tests again before I am allowed back on the road and issued a new licence. I will most certainly be taking my speed very seriously when I am back on the roads.