So, DH has agreed to go to couple's counselling but has refused to talk about our biggest issue........sex

[TheRealChopin]

When I think about it, DH and I have had issues over sex nearly from day 1 of our relationship. I was quite naive and inexperienced when I met him and just kind of went along with his demands and tantrums over sex. I had also grown up in a highly dysfuntional family but had no awareness of the problems I had as a result of this and therefore failed to put boundaries in place in my relationship with DH from early on.

10 years on I am different person. I look back and feel angry with DH for the way he behaved over sex and angry with myself for allowing him to get away with it.

Besides sex, we have a number of other issues and DH has agreed to jointly go and see a counsellor about these. But he has refused to discuss our issues surrounding sex with a counsellor. I think if we don't discuss sex with a counsellor we will never truly resolve our problems. Am at a bit of a loss as to what to do. Has anybody got any advice?

I know I could start another thread about our issues wrt sex and I know I would get some brilliant advice from all of you, but I would only be giving you my side of events and I think DH needs to give his side too before any advice is given.

FWIW, I think DH has some deep insecurities and uses sex to make him feel better about himself. He says he simply has a high sex drive but I think there is more to it than that, especially from the way he talks about sex and how important it is to him. I know a lot of men are like this, but I have read enough threads on MN to know that not every man sulks and gets angry if his wife/partner says no to having sex sometimes and I am slowly realising that DH's attitude to sex may not be entirely healthy.

I am totally off sex myself. I used to think it was due to tiredness/young DC's/maybe I just had a low sex drive etc etc. But I don't think it's any of those reasons. I think DH himself is putting me off sex because it is so important to him and he is so insistent on it, it has put me right off. I feel like I am just being used to satisfy his needs, like I am a piece of meat.

He doesn't even mind if I don't feel like it, if i just lie there, which I do do occasionally simply because I feel it's wrong to make him go without it altogether as it clearly is a 'need' for him.

I need to find a way to persuade him to talk about our sex life with a counsellor, not the nitty gritty of actually doing it, but the wanting it/demands for it/tantrums over it etc and my right to say no, which he does accept to an extent.

Should we just start going to a counsellor and then when he feels comfortable with that, suggest again that we need to talk about sex too?

Sorry, this post has turned out longer than I intended, and I will have to disappear soon to pick up DD, but will be back later today.

Anybody?

Well I would start the counselling but I would say something in the first session along the lines of "I would like to discuss some issues regarding our sex life but DH is not happy with that at the moment but I would like to address this further down the line." A good counsellor would hopefully be able to draw him out on that a bit.

FWIW I suspect that he knows full well that his demands are unreasonable and that is why he doesn't want it addressed!

Is the larger issue not that he won't discuss sex with a counsellor, but that he seems to want to set the agenda generally? With sex itself, and with what you can talk about with the counsellor? Is part of the problem that if he continues to dictate what will and will not pass, then you will not ever resolve your issues?

Why has he refused for sex to be part of the discussion?

I think Buda has the right idea. However, if the counsellor suspects that your Hi si abusive to you, then s/he may refuse to counsel you as a couple (it doesn't work when there is abuse).
However, sometimes the specific problem of a libido mismatch ie one partner wanting more sex than the other can be resolved if all that's wrong is the two of you have got into this vicious circle of one partner desperate for sex and constantly asking for it, and the other feeling under so much pressure that s/he not only doesnt want sex but doesn't feel able to engage in any kind of affectionate behaviour at all because s/he thinks it will trigger more demands for sex, so the couple become more and more hostile to each other.
However, if he bullies you in other ways and behaves as though he is the 'person' in the relationship and his needs come first, it will be a harder job to fix the relationship, if it can be fixed at all.

Sorry, but it does sound like he realises that his behaviour and demands are unreasonable and that a counsellor is going to point that out and help him work on changing it and he doesn't want that.

A good relationship counsellor would normally bring up the topic of sex as the work progresses as it is an important part of any relationship and all areas will need to be looked at to make the counselling work. You could speak to the counsellor privately and ensure that the topic of sex is covered. Perhaps once he feels comfortable with going to counselling, he won't feel so against discussing sex. You can also see the counsellor on your own to discuss matters, in tandem with couples counselling.

I feel so sorry for you that he's treating you like this. You really should stop feeling guilty about saying no to his incessant demands - you say you feel guilty about him going without, but he doesn't seem to feel guilty that you're doing things you clearly don't want to do. How come this is acceptable to you? No-one NEEDS sex, that's just nonsense. If he has some psychological issue making him feel anxiety over not getting enough sex, then that's something he has to deal with, not you acquiesce and be bullied. No decent man would be so unbearably demanding or throw tantrums and no decent man would be able to be excited by their partner just lying there, clearly not wanting sex and letting them 'get on with it'. He clearly has some deep-seated issues that he's taught himself to block out with sex. But that should not mean you have to tolerate this.

Whenever someone says that a topic is not up for discussion with a counsellor, what they usually mean is that they don't want their own unreasonable behaviour exposed. It's the same with the person who doesn't want to talk about, or disclose, an affair.

Sex in a romantic relationship is a huge issue and more pertinently, it has been a significant problem in your relationship. It is madness to think that a therapist can help in any situation where there is a massive elephant in the room.

In your situation, I would be saying that staying in this marriage any longer is absolutely dependent on therapy. If he wants to set the agenda of what that therapy must comprise, you will not engage in it and therefore your first condition is broken.

It might be worth however getting some therapy yourself and avoiding couples counselling completely.

Are counselling sessions that cut-and-dried wth an agenda "set" by one of the couple? Him in this instance? Surely, if there are issues in your relationship that need to be explored, then you agree to start the sessions and go where it leads. Which may be anywhere.
I can't see quite how a counsellor could agree to not discuss something that is clearly a major issue. It's going to be the elephant in the room. It's got to come up.

Is your DH "the boss" in your relationship in other areas too?

I think you should start going to the counsellor and start working through the issues. I wouldn't be at all surprised if the subject of sex comes up at some point in the counselling discussions and that's the point at which he can decide if he wants to discuss it or not. Putting pressure on him now will just dissuade him from going to counselling at all.

Sorry, WWIFN. Posted my bit about elephants before I saw yours!

FWIW it sounds like the issue isn't sex. The issue is how he behaves if you refuse to have sex... although we have only heard your side of the story so we don't know how you turn him down... that's something to be discussed in the counselling sessions rather than here.

Nocake, I can't imagine how any type of turning someone down could justify a grown adult sulking or throwing a tantrum...