Please help - Terrible row with husband

[Esme69]

I am SAHM of 5 young children. My husband works to provide a good living for us all, I have help with the kids and home 5 days a week which I am grateful for. This help means though that my husband has time to pursue his leisure pursuits, he plays golf once a week and is out most evenings at meetings to do with community stuff, chamber of commerce etc, so I do most of the bedtime stuff on my own.

He does very little around the house, but does cook from time to time, but becuase I do not work and have help, i assume responsibility for most of this stuff.

We have had problems in our marriage for some years now. He has abused alcohol in the past, and still from time to time overindulges but he has really tried to take himself in had and most of the time when he goes out doesnt get drunk.

But the real problem is that he is never really relaxed or happy. Never content. He says nasty things to me when he is annoyed, he also has said snide and belittling things to friends and family, and the general consensus on him is that he is basically a good person, but also very selfish and with a nasty tendency to stay stupid hurtful things, which, as a friend said to me recently, he has no idea the hurt and upset he leaves in his wake.

I do have an idea though becuase I live with him.In the llast 18months we have gone to marriage counselling, 2 sets of counselling sessions, around 9 months apart. I never really feel they worked becuase the counsellor was too nice and didnt really try to get to the root of our problems. It all stayed on the surface. I think my husband has deep seated issues, anger is always just below the surface, he seems resentful of me, or life or something, bitter, is always inclined to slag something off before praising it.

Last night we had a row. He told me he was sick of how I tried to control him, how it is always the same old shit with me, that I am uptight, (becuase I wanted to leave a pub at 1am after he had already had or 7 pints and the kids would be up at 6am) and he told me that I am a drama queen, and that seeing as we were going to stick together for the sake of the kids, I'd better get on some drugs or medication, some "happy pills" becuase he was sick of me the way I am.

I lost it at that point. Told him I hated him, that if he wasnt happy he should piss right off, and that many of our friends have been at the receiving end of him bile and think he can be a shit, and wonder how I put up with him (this is true, but I shouldnt have said it becuase now he want to know who said that and I cant tell, it wouldnt be fair on them.

I feel depair. I want to make this work for the kids. But whilst I do not hate him, I really do not like my husband as a person very much, and I am struggling to see how we can come out of this, make it work, somehow, or even live together amicably, I just dont know what to do or think...I guess I want someone to tell me if they think it is even possible to make this work in any way, as I want to avoid divorce, becuase my parents split up, I know how it felt and dont want to infilict this on the kids.

Esme, sorry you hear you are on the end such grief.

It does sound like your OH is harbouring a fair amount of self-loathing. Either that, or he is just a shit - some people are, seemingly without reason.

Neither situation is good I'm afraid & it will most likely be down to you to initiate & progress any betterment on the relationship.

UA is right in that the regular manifesting of such behaviour is deeply damaging to children. I do however think that separation should be the last resort. Sadly, it may be the only option after all else is exhausted.

His protest that you have some responsibility is the classic retort of the immature. So, you must take the upper-hand. I've posted on another thread that invariably in these situations, someone must lead & shoulder not only their part, but also that of the other person - because they are incapable of doing it for themselves.

For how long & to what depths, is usually unknown. There may come a time when you've simply had enough & no-one could blame you.

The fact that you have posted on here seeking help is a small, but significant step.

I honestly think that if he will not attend counselling with you, your time scale is limited as to how much you can do to change his outlook. A slammed door, but not just yet.

It sounds such a tricky one, a fine line between a modicum of civility & the nastiness you described.

Again, it does sound like he has a lot of self-loathing in there but sometimes, people just prefer to wallow in their own mire.

I hope things improve for you soon.

Esme

So sorry sweetheart - just keep your head, talk low, talk slow, don't say too much. Just watch and take things in, you do not need to react to every cutting remark, ignoring them can be very difficult but sometimes it is the best thing to do. Seethe then breathe.

If it becomes too much and a retort is required I found a bright smile and a "Really? Is that what you think? Maybe you could look in the mirror sometime sweetie" usually shut him up.

Remember - he has eveything to gain from your loss of control. Keep calm and start planning - get a building society account with a pass book - no post will come to the house and put an amount away each week or month. No matter how small, it is yours, you may one day need access to money that he has no control over. Please trust me on this. If everything works out fine and dandy you can spend the money on a romantic holiday for the pair of you.

If not - it is there when you need it. Ask for money from family instead of Xmas and birthday presents.

Just keep your wits about you and remember yourself in all of this - you are not just a wife and mum.

Thatbloke - Thanks for that. You hit the nail on the head. My husband is full of self loathing, low self esteem and other issues.

He has no self awareness of this so I do not think it will ever change..

He is very keen for us to go for counselling again. I am not so keen anymore, as i feel counselling has failed us, but I suppose I owe it to all of us to try yet again, even though it is not going to change my husband in any meaningful way.

Lamplighter = thanks too. I will try and keep my cool, not easy in the heat of an argument when you are hearing the most hurtful things.

My husband is like a child, immature, selfcentred, sensitive only to himself whilst being very hurtful to others. The problem is not so much that I question whether i have any love for him anymore, its more that I am finding it hard to even like the man anymore.

Esme, it sounds like your husband is having problems trying to balance what he thinks he should and what he wants to be. Only he can deal with this. Have you spoken to him about him receiving solo counselling. I'm not saying that this is the answer for you as I'm sure that his constant blaming of others (mostly you) has had an effect on your own wellbeing (I have a theory that poor mental health is contagious, like flu). I think that you too need to see someone. Maybe he can change, maybe he cant, but you can change Your life.
Or maybe this is another arguement, in your married life that you will resolve. Only you can decide what to do.
The fact that he blames everyone else and does not take any responsibility is not encouraging.

Dione - Thanks for that. Yes, he does try and keep up a certain image at times. He has agreed to go back to counselling, and I think at first we will go for solo sessions.

I dont have much faith in counselling though, becuase my experience is that the counsellor sort of sits on the fence, and never pulls either of us up short on unreasonable behaviour. So my husband thinks this is great, because he knows he is not going to be told he is being unreasonable.

His constant need to attribute his faults to me and to the demands on his life are quite draining and also make me lose respect for him. He does accept that our marriage was damages badly by the binge drinking years but he thinks i ought to have gotten over that by now.

I dont know. He is not a bad person, but extremely immature, self centred and very vitriolic at times, so not easy to live with, but its not even that, its the little kindnesses that I miss, he never makes me a cuppa, or rubs my back or anything like that, unless he wants sex!!

I'm glad you are going for solo counselling, I think it will do you good, help you to clarify and prioritise the problems that you are experiencing. This will empower you when it comes to couple counselling. In the meantime, try not to let him make you take sole responsibility for your children's happiness. He is playing on your fears of divorce and that is wrong. You may fear the effects of marital breakdown on the children, but if things continue as they are it is only a matter of time before his abdication of responsibility onto you is transferred to the children and that is certainly not a healthy environment for them to live in.