Baby Jogger City Select or Britax B-Dual? Where to buy?

[Wingdingdong]

In two minds about getting a double. I have DD who's 2.9 and DS 10w. Before DS was born, we decided we definitely didn't need a double - DD's good at walking, we thought we could do buggy board and sling combo, etc.

However, DD suddenly seems much more tired plus I realised that many of our trips we'd walk 2 miles one way and get the bus back, not easy with a buggy round here as most of them already have two buggies on. Maybe I was optimistic expecting DD to walk 4 miles, especially with the amount of uphill walking! We're now using the car more and as a result I get absolutely no exercise. The sling's fine for short trips but we tend to go out for the day; DS is already the size DD was at 6m. Plus it's a PITA having to adjust the harness all the time to swap the kids around. We have a Nipper which we use for both kids, or a M&P Herbie still in pram mode as seat can't be used till 6m - but DS is running out of room and obviously DD can't rest in it. The buggy board is useful but on the Herbie I bang my legs with each step and DD has to lean back and forwards round the carrycot - it's particularly difficult uphill, which is where DD needs the lift. Also she keeps jumping off and running away, or alternatively saying she's tired and needs to sit down, and she has to get off and on again every time we go over a kerb.

So, I think we need a double but probably not for very long. I want to use it as a single afterwards. I want a parent-facing seat, at least for one of them; I want to use a Maxi-Cosi Cabriofix with it. I intend it to replace the Herbie, but keep the Nipper as well as I love it.

Main concern with B-Dual is lack of footrests - how much of an issue is this? DD is tiny, but DS looks like he might be bigger... Main concern with City Select is the price - nobody lists one!

Anyone know where I can test either of these (SE London, can do central London or Kent as well), and where there are good prices to be found? Also opinions welcome.

Thanks!

I've read your message a couple of times because your eldest is quite small and wondered if you would get away with a BJCS because weight / pushability is a big issue. But you say you have to go up a hill and to be honest that's where I ruled the BJCS out for you. How big a hill is it? But I am not convinced the B-Dual is your answer either especially as the chances are the baby will go in the bottom et ie not parent facing. Plus with both of these pushchairs to be utterly honest, you won't keep them as a single afterwards. Theres probably only two tandem pushchairs at present that I would keep as a single afterwards and those are the Peach and Pear (but only an Apple to Pear conversion). I honestly would say the B-Dual is the better choice but the seating position for the toddler isn't the best. I would rather say to you, bite the bullet, and either pick up a cheap side by side eg Baby Jogger City Mini or Nipper double (light but watch the width!) or Air Buggy Mimi (very light and slimmer) or TFK Twinner Twist Duo consider a second hand Pear or ideally a Peach Blossom. Theres also the Mountain Buggy +One if you were thinking of spending money on a new BJCS (circa £5-600 at a guesstimate?) Sadly the other good options need a car seat until 6 months. I will have a think if I have missed anything else.

i bought my BJCS for $400 from winstanleys pram world about 6 weeks ago. THe second seat for a further £120 but you can pick them up loads cheaper on ebay 2nd hand. I bought a carrycot from ebay for £30. They sell new for £90.

I agree with Tiggywinkle that weight is an issue with the BJCS, it is a heavy bit of kit but i push my 16kg 98th centile 2 y/o DD around in it now up and down hills and and am 52 weeks pregnant and the weight doesnt bother me too much. I might just be odd though .

that should say £400 not $400. oops.

Have you just got one child in at the minute ThePleaser? Its a different kettle of fish with two in plus about 9-18 months worth of time!

52 weeks pregnant is certainly odd!

Thanks very much, both of you. DD's around 12.5kg.

The M&P buggy we have currently is ~13kg, so there's not much, if anything, between it and the two tandems in single mode - I'd definitely be happy with that as a single. As for pushability, trying to steer the M&P with a buggy board is like steering a tank. We do have the Nipper 360 as a lightweight single if needed anyway. We don't have storage space for a double as well as the current two buggies (well, 3 actually, as I have a BJ Performance for running too!), and DH has ruled out buying another single in 6-12 months' time so if we got a twin now, we'd be left with only the Nipper as a single for DS later, which is not parent-facing. Until DS was born, DD was still using the M&P occasionally in buggy mode and always insisted on it being parent-facing. I also don't want to get something too similar to what we already have with the Nipper - which rules out P&T, Mountain Buggy, etc.

The hills aren't that bad (Greenwich) - big for London, but we're not talking Peak District. One of the reasons that I want a double is because I want the exercise, rather than taking the car - e.g. DD's nursery run would take waaaay too long if she walked (uphill all the way) and she won't stay on the buggy board (which whacks my legs going uphill anyway) so at the moment we drive. I don't get time for the gym any more so a buggy workout is not a negative in my book.

I'll have another look at the iCandy but DB and SIL have one and their DD is pretty big for it already at not yet 2... if DS maintains his growth rate he won't fit in the seat as a toddler.

That may also be a concern with the B-Dual. I'm leaning towards the BJCS now BUT I'm wondering how big the carrycot is and whether DS would fit in it, as the seats aren't suitable from birth? He's 63+ cm, 14+ lbs. The M&P carrycot is shaped internally to allow for the bumper bar/carry handle, and it means that the narrowest part of the carrycot is around the baby's elbows - so DS can't get his arms down by his side any more. That's the biggest issue with it, lengthwise he still has room.

Also I cannot find a retailer with a display model. Where can I find one to have a look at? John Lewis sells them but apparently they don't display or stock them, just order them directly from BJ. Can't find any other bricks and mortar retailers of the City Select.

sorry this is so long, lots of thinking out loud going on here...

Its a complete myth that the iCandy Peach main seat is small. Have a look at this. I have had a 9 and an 11 year old in my Peach - all be it briefly but they fitted in, I could do the harness up and I could push them!! The hood just keeps sliding up the chassis and with the liner out, the seat is a generous size! The only downside is that the Peach lower carrycot is small but maybe a surf snug insert or wedge may be an option in the lower seat instead? Not that its advised, but its an option.

The BJCS carrycot is a pretty big one - its essentially the same size as the seat unit and is fairly uniform all the way up - you use the seat chassis to make the carrycot.
Give Kooltrade, the BJCS distributors a call tomorrow and see if they can help you find a stockist with one on show. But I seriously am not sure the BJCS is your answer. It will seem great at first but will slowly get heavier - believe me I have been there and sold the pram on!! And believe me I am no wuss - and have pushed even heavier prams. But when you are getting pains up your arms, then its not worth it.

i just feel 52 weeks pregnant. i am actually 38 weeks and the size of a small planet.

Yes, just my DD1 in it at the moment and very shortly (please god, let it be soon!) DD2 will using it too. THe carrycot seem quite big to me, bigger than the moses basket actually in terms of mattress space. Going forward I expect that DD1 will do a lot of walking leaving the buggy mostly for DD2 but i felt that i needed the security of having a seat there for her if i needed to just strap her in and go. I can put up with the weight issue for that convenience.

In terms of checking one out in the flesh, John Lewis in Oxford Street had them in stock. I went up there before i bought mine to test it out and give it a run around the floor. THey had all the accessories with it so i could see how everything fitted together. THey have a very good service. I almost felt bad buying it somewhere else after they were so helpful.

Hope for your sake you've already had DD2, ThePleaser!

Well, we had a not-so-fun day out in central London yesterday. DS had his tongue tie snipped and I headed straight to John Lewis to avail myself of their excellent parent/baby facilities (and the fact the store's next to the tube station to get home...). DD was fairly distressed by the experience and tired from the boat and taxi journey there, insisted on going in the buggy and fell asleep instantly. DS went in the sling. It rained. On getting to JL, both kids were still sleeping so I bought lunch and waited for them to wake - couldn't eat mine with DS in the sling, couldn't put him down anywhere with DD asleep. DD then woke, needed the loo - struggled to lift her on to the loo and then up to the sink with the baby between us. That's answered the question about needing a double! Also confirmed that DD will use the buggy mostly when tired, i.e. for naps.

So, contrary to what JL phone customer services told me, there is a BJ City Select on display there. He obviously just checked for stock, despite my emphasising display. And yes, the sales assistants were very helpful. They also had the iCandy so I had a look at that too. DD tested out seats.

Thoughts:

• BJCS is definitely heavy! I can see that lifting for kerbs would be annoying/potentially tiring, depending on frequency.

• However, really manoeuvrable and easy to push - on a level surface it feels much lighter than the M&P Herbie & is as agile as the Nipper.

• Side-by-side comparison, length of Nipper and BJCS is much of a muchness, which surprised me. In fact, with buggy board down, the Nipper is longer than BJCS with seat and carrycot.

• loved the configurations. DD made it very clear she wanted to be facing me, NOT outwards. Most configurations worked for us.

• She REALLY liked the two seats facing each other and was willing to face either way as long as she could see either me or her DB (in fact, more interested in facing him than me...).

• loads of room between the seats, DD reluctant to test out the lower seat in 'stacking' mode, but said it was much better than Phil'n'Teds, plus she could get in and out by herself which is a plus.

• access to the seat/carseat/carrycot in all configurations we tested was excellent.

• carrycot plenty big enough for DS.

• love the big basket and good access! Also love the compact fold even with seats attached.

iCandy:

• DD took an instant dislike. Not entirely sure why but she wanted out immediately.

• she was kind of sliding out of the seat. Again, can't pinpoint the issue. It was as though she was too big for it, though she clearly wasn't (perhaps this is where the reputation comes from?). I think it's a combination of depth (seems shallower than others, though technically shouldn't be much different - perhaps the liner or shape of the seat makes it seem so) and angle - I think the back and footrest is more upright than other similar seats.

• no room between the seats. DD wouldn't be able to get into the lower seat by herself and I can't see how I could get a 6mo in the lower seat and do up the straps without taking off the upper seat first (but I think the lighter child would have to go at the front/on top anyway for stability???). There's probably a knack but it seemed a bit of a PITA.

• poor basket access in pram mode (and not great with two seats on).

• Can't have seat parent-facing as a tandem (if both seats on, both are forward-facing).

• access to the carrycot seemed restricted/awkward; handle and back of the upper seat made it a bit of a contortionist act.

• on the plus side, it is light, has a good feel, nice to push, etc.

• As a single, it's great (though not sure I'd go for it if I was buying for an only/last child).

• However, the fact that it's a long wait rules it out for us completely - think by the time it came, we'd have no need for it!

Haven't yet looked at the B-Dual but the lack of footrests is putting me off, plus the toddler seating position /second seat may well rule it out.

I want the features of the BJCS with the weight of the iCandy...

Anyway, thanks again. Some thinking to do. And I'll be phoning Winstanley's to check current price too... don't JL do a price match guarantee?

Having had both the Peach Blossom 1 and 2 and BJCS and B-Dual in between the two, I actually wrote nearly the same as you 2 years ago. I loved my City Select for all the reasons you put above and more. Truly loved it. But ultimately it became unpushable - to the point where I had pains in my arms. Thankfully we had the PB2 here and could switch and a year on the PB2 is going strong still and us still easy to push with children who are a year older than when they were last in the BJCS. I was gutted about the BJCS but ultimately you need to be able to push a pushchair and all the features are useless if it hurts too much! At a similar time the eldest also started to kick (accidentally) her brother or pull his feet when facing each other. She hated facing backwards and you can't recline the seats forward facing. I ended up with the children back to back until DS fell asleep and then I would have to unload DD to move DS to a position where he could be reclined! I didn't like the front seat facing forwards as I used to bash DDs feet on displays. Facing each other definitely works the best for as long as it works. Just to add we have since also had the Uppababy Vista with rumble seat, Kidz Kargo Duellette and Kolcraft Contours which are all similar and worked better ultimately than the BJCS ie I could push them on the same route the BJCS couldn't do! But it is all about route and where you go to be honest. I know people who quit with the BJCS long before me and others using theirs with 2 year old twins. It's interesting that the Nipper is longerbut it doesn't surprise me. The BJCS is actually quite neat except in carrycot at the front mode. But the line of the front seat - especially forward facing follows the chassis rather than overhangs.

Hours of deliberation later and I've gone for the BJCS. I checked the growth curves in the red books, but I think the weight issue is going to be less of a problem for us because there's quite a big gap between the kids. I can't see us using it as a double for more than six months, maybe nine for rare occasions, whereas if I had a newborn and a 1yo, both chunky, I can see it being more of a problem. DD goes to school at the end of our road in a year's time; the main uphill route we do is to DD's nursery twice a day, twice a week (but only once with both of them, obviously). When it's cold, dark and wet in the mornings I'd drive anyway, i.e. in about 6-9m time. Most double buggy uses will be along the river (i.e. very flat!) or days out, and most of the time the second seat will be empty.

I guess I also have the opposite situation to you, in that my DD refuses to face forwards if there's the option to face backwards. She insists the Nipper seat is reclined enough to allow her to see me through the panel and also through the mesh back and given a choice, she always opts for the other buggy in rear-facing mode. Since I need the double primarily for when she's tired, rather than to transport two children, the ability to recline rear-facing is much more important than reclining forward-facing.

I am slightly anxious about the kicking but again, she's only going to be going in it when she's knackered and wants to sleep. It's more likely her brother is going to kick her when he's big enough - which may incentivise her to walk more!

Thanks again - you've given me lots of things to think about and check. I suspect the BJCS isn't going to be perfect and I am going to find it heavy, but I think for our purposes (and the fact it's occasional use as a double rather than everyday) it's the best out there.