Support thread for those crazy enough to be extending their homes this year!

[ilikeyoursleeves]

Hiya, after hijacking another thread about massive extensions (not massive erections LOL) there seems to be a few of us who are about to embark on building projects this year. So if you are one of them come join in so we can share all the excitement, nervousness and bewilderment at everything that needs done!

We are currently awaiting quotes from builders for a two storey side extension plus a single storey at the rear. We had our first quote in today which is £64k. Not sure if this is good or bad, it will be interesting to compare the quotes when they are all in. We are also awaiting planning permission but should get it fine as our house already has planning for the extension that came with the sale of the house (but we had to resubmit as we have changed it a bit). Awaiting a building warrant too.

I'm very excited but frankly crapping it re the costs as we are going to have to remortgage plus DS2 will start nursery so we will have 2 lots of chilcare costs too.

ARGH!!!

So I for one need my hand held throughout all this process I just keep thinking of the end product and hoping it will all be fine.

What's everyone else doing and when?

I just tried to call him and his wife said 'he is in bed ill' . Hangover or possible avoidance?

Tried to call the other builder too out of desparation but it's just voicemail, will need to prob wait til Tuesday to get hold of him. He previously said that he could start end May but that was a while ago and he's prob booked up now

Had a bit of a barmy with DH too cos he just thinks we should forget about the whole thing, ie no extension and just move house later. But we love it here, it's a great location, next to the primary school and local shop, great neighbours etc. We could get by for a bit longer without the room but as the boys grow up we will need the space. Can barely fit us all in as it is! I hope he is just pissed off due to the news of the builder and he's not really serious about cancelling it all.

Oh sleeves

I'm sure your DH won't put paid to the whole thing. It's just all very stressful - and he was keen on this builder wasn't he and you were right about him - that's probably why he's got the hump.

Why not let it rest and enjoy the rest of the weekend, put it to one side, and have another think on tues

Have just been thinking I will take some snaps and put them up if / when things start happening

Thanks ISNT, he has been saying one minute that he doesn't want to do it, but then the next he has been saying that he hopes the other builder will be available. So I think he still does want to do it although today hasn't been nice as he keeps harping on that I have pressured him into doing it and we don't really need the extension. I think he is just shocked and angry about the builder too and he is the type who hates any unecessary hassles so thinks this is what the extension process will bring. Hopefully he will realise that us binning this builder will save lots of hassle in the future!

DH also said that when the builder calls back I should just say that something personal has happened to us and we have decided to not go ahead with the extension this year. He thinks that there is a chance that one of the guys the builder works with might be pissed off at the lost job and come back at us in a nasty way- I think DH is being totally paranoid but hey, you never know! Builder hasn't called back yet, wonder if / when he will...

Ho hum.

How has everyone else been this weekend?

Haven't been on in a while but things have been moving along in terms of quotes. We had our first quote from a builder who works with the kitchen designer we had approached for £24k! We are building a single storey extension to our kitchen (about 3.5 x 4 m) with french doors to garden, 2 velux windows, new back door and sliding doors (in a pocket system) to dining room. That sounds like a lot of money to me, particularly as kitchen guy came back with a quote of £23k for kitchen which did not include VAT. So for one room, we are looking at over £50K as the builders quote did not include the underfloor heating which we priced separately, (3.3K) or the actual purchase of the sliding doors and pocket system, about another 1.2k. This builder does not charge VAT, which initially seemed to be a blessing but now needs further investigation as I can't see how he could be building full-time and yet not be VAT-registered?

The guy who drew up the plans for us also builds and we asked him to give us a quote as he had expressed interest - his quote came in at £35k, exc VAT!

Meantime, I had an old kitchen magazine with a kitchen shown which I really liked and found a supplier near me so went to have a look one day, more in the hope that I would hate it in real life and could banish it from my mind. However, go to the shop, chat to designer there, he also had a builder whom he works closely with so, long story short, his builder also came and gave us a quote which I have just received this morning, it's £35k plus VAT too! He would be the favoured builder, really seemed to know what he was doing, willing to give us lots of references - and was quite lovely looking too!

However, I'm just a bit depressed about the whole project now and wondering if I shouldn't just try to get in one of those house doctor type people to rework our existing space. It's not as if we were absolutely desperate for the additional space, the extension to the kitchen is really just supposed to be to accommodate a dining table so that we can devote the current dining area to music, which is pretty important to us, and pretty space-heavy as we have a drum kit, various guitars and amps, keyboard, music pc etc. Howeveeeeer...... I do have to look at the costs of this whole project and all the ancillary bit that haven't even been costed in yet, like slabs for new patio, and wonder how much it is really worth to us, even if we have the money required to do it?

Hi annh

Can you spend the £££ getting the build right and put in a cheaper kitchen? Ditch the designer and do it yourself?

There seems to be a theme with people getting cheap units eg ikea, then putting good worktops and appliances in and bobs your uncle v nice. it's what we're doing (as much as I would love a posho kitchen we just can't afford it).

Then you would have the room of your dreams and you could always update the kitchen later if you really wnated.

Or have you got your heart set on it?

If it makes you feel any better....

We are being quoted £120K not including vat, and not incuding kitchen bathrooms etc.

sleeves like I say I'm a wuss and agree with your DH to just tell the buildre you have decided not to go ahead. No point in stirring it all up.

I'm sure your DH will calm down and all will be fine.

Well I ended up having a bit of a breakdown last night. The whole builder thing really shook me as I realised just how much we had been putting faith in him and to find out he is pretty shite has made me so worried about handing over so much cash and trust to someone! I ended up in tears last night in bed due to combination of hearing about the builder, watching a prog on TV about the election re the economy and public sector cuts (I'm public sector), and I sat and worked out my outgoings and I really realised how stretched we will be. I have been keeping a spending diary since Jan and I am spending more than I thought I was, we could still be OK but we wouldn't be able to go on decent holidays etc for a few years until the kids are at school. So the reality of our lack of money really hit me plus we would obviously be paying full VAT now so that adds another £12ish K onto the build and wouldonly leave us £5k for a bathroom, downstairs loo, flooring and decoration. ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

DH and I had a heart to heart, he was lovely about it and said we'll get by but also said if he had the choice he wouldn't do the extension as he feels our life should be full of experiences ie, holidays etc and not just paying for a bigger house. I can totally see where he is coming from and would be willing to delay the extension for a few years even. DH keeps swithering though, one minute saying let's not do it then the next saying yes let's.

I looked into cancelling the mortgage money but I think we will have a £3k penalty, although we actually don't have any of the money yet. So if we won't get a penalty I think I would consider delaying the extension.

Re the builder, he called back this afternoon when I was out so I called him an hour ago and told him that we are getting trouble getting the money so we are just leaving it just now. He didn't seem that surprised TBH and said to contact him in the future if we need him (!!!). I think he knew what I was going to say though cos his joiner had just been round finally delivering the french door 'brochures' so he must have called him. I put inverted commas round 'brochures' because instead of brochures to choose our French Doors he gave us 2 leaflets for conservatories WTFFFFFFFFF!!!!???

The other builder just called there too and said he is still interested in our build and will look over our plans tonight and call back tomorrow, he said he could start in July!

So girls, I need help to decide... WTF are we going to do? Go ahead with new builder or cancel mortgage and enjoy a few years with no money worries?

ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

BTW ISNT what you getting done again for that quote? You are London eh? Yeeks, but I guess it's about what you can afford so if your quote is fine to you then it's OK I
think?

annh I feel your pain. As you might have guessed! We need to win the lotto!

Oops sorry for maaaaaaaaaaasive post there.

Oh sleeves.

It's down to you and DH, your family, your desires, your lifestyle.

What can I say? We are not planning on having a "proper" holiday in the foreseeable future, and are happy with that. We are really lucky that we have a family place we can go, and we go there, it's just English seaside but it does us.

When we are done with this house we intend to live here forever and raise our family and grow old here, so it's worth the sacrifice IYSWIM. We do this, it's done, we work to get the mortgage down ASAP, cross our fingers that work is OK (DH is public sector and mine is public funded as well) and go for it.

Why don't you wait and see what the new builder says? And try and look at it from a positive POV - if you hadn't been to see the neighbour you'd be still having this shitto builder and it would have been a disaster. What has happened is good, not bad IYSWIM.

Maybe sit down with DH and think exactly what lifestyle you want, what your family want/need, what is important to you, prioritise?

I don't know.

Re the quote. Builder said that was top whack and we said we need to get it down to £100K and he said that is doable if we drop a few "nice to haves" so fine. We have had two other ball parks but they were just working out on £psm so were v rough. One was £75K + vat for shell, other was £120K + vat for shell.

What we are getting is single storey rear and two storey side. Taking whole back of house out and two exiating rooms will all be joined in with extension to give one huge kitchen/lounge (about 6 or 7m square) then a utility on the side. Upstairs bathroom knocked through into side extension to make new double bedroom, then side extenion holds family bathroom and en suite for us, all of those need knocking through as well. Our builder's quote includes fitting bathrooms and kitchens and getting it done to plastered.

Phew.

When we get the buiding regs drawings we are going to put it properly out to tender to see what other quotes look like, we have a few recommendations.

Am terrified TBH, this is a huge undertaking and I watch rogue traders too often...

Now that was a monster post!

Oh yes have got both party wall letters back signed now, so that's a hooray!

I know we can only decide ourselves, my heart says extension extension extension but my head says arghhhh you will be skint for ages! But like you ISNT I see us here for many years, we live in a good 'desirable' area, where everyone says hello even if they don't know you, our neighbours are great, we have a lovely garden, the primary school is 5 mins walk away not even crossing a road, the nursery is 100m down the street etc etc etc. So I want to stay put for a long time. The boys are only going to get older, grow bigger, and DH works from home and currently his office is the breakfast bar (not ideal!) which does my head in with all the mess. I can't really invite folk round when DH is working cos our house is so small that friends and kids would be a nightmare for him, so the extension would mean him moving to a room upstairs for his work. Our kitchen has the breakfast bar in the middle of it IYKWIM so we can't have a decent sized table in it, so never have folk round- we can barely fit us as it is (2 adults, 2 teeny boys) so in the future it would be hard for the boys to have pals over etc for tea. We also want another DC one day and there is absolutely nowhere it could go just now, we really do need this extension.

But then we will be so skint we won't be able to afford DC3. But if we wait til DS1 is at school it would be OK.

Hmmmmmmm. IMO we need the extension but I can still see DH's point. However, I think we will either need to do it one day, or move house, but I don't want to move as I love it here and our house is in a great spot in the town. Plus if we leave it then we will get whacked by the predicted 20% VAT.

Ok, that's helped clarify everything again in my head. I will see what the new builder says tomorrow but I really do think we need to do it. It really is a teeny house, out current sq meter on each floor is the same as your new kitchen / lounge ISNT!!!

I do think DH really does want it too as he is a stubborn git and if he really didn't want it he would have put his foot down ages ago and he said last night that he does thinks it is needed.

Sorry, another masssive post!

Just quick as off to bed.

The other thing is (I think) better to do it and get it over with while the kids are small, than to try and do it once they have school to get to and everything, the upheaval will be worse the older the children get IMO. Also, doing it sooner rather than later means more years of the family having it while its needed. Our neighbours got theirs done and then within 4 years their eldest had got married and moved out and the middle one off to uni so now they've got all the room and suddenly they don't really need it any more.

I'm like you, I love where we live, neighbours are great, nursery, schools and green spaces nearby, is a fab area, and we could never afford to move up to the next level of house here. So extending this one is the thing to do.

(I hope!)

Good luck with the builder tomorrow

Thanks ISNT, I will report back tomorrow after I speak to the new builder!

Sleeves,...are you married to my Dh?!! Your Dh sounds EXACTLY like mine - and our build has been on and off more times than my toddlers sunhat!

I can really empathise with you sleeves- truly I can. There are so many variables of all kinds to take into consideration. One of our big things was the real cost of relocating in terms of time, agents fees and (mainly stamp duty) it would have cost us £15k just to move - and that was almost a quarter of oour build cost.

Having made out decision, we feel that if we can ride the storm and get the build done..then we can always sell up with the benefit of the extension if the Wolf comes a-knocking.

I agree that the economy is terrifying - especially if there is a change to a Tory administration,(..sorry to have to nail my colours to the mast but there you go!).

So I am right there with you sleeves - I can't offer any advice but it might help to know that I know exactly where your head is right now.

Thanks LittlePushka it's good to know others understand our situation! DH & I spoke about it again last night and we are going to go ahead with the extension. Not sure if I am excited or not though TBH as I know the next few years will be tough. But I just need to focus on the outcome! I think I'm terrified too in case costs spiral out of control as we have borrowed X amount and can't go over that. The new builder seems to have a good contract so I will state this to him and hopefully agree who is liable if it spirals in costs and how we can prevent that from happening. As long as we have enough left over to do our bathroom, loo & floors then we should be able to gradually decorate over the next 20 years whenever we get money LOL (hopefully it won't be as grim as that!).

I reckon it would cost us about £15k to move to so I need to keep that in mind as another reason to extend!

Any news?

Is that directed at me ISNT? If it is then my news is the new builder phoned to make an appt to come over tomorrow at 2pm to see the house again and to discuss our plans in more detail. He seems keen because he cancelled some other things so he could come out.

I also called the bank to see if we could 'in theory' cancel the new mortgage and apparantly we aren't even in the system yet, I think cos they are waiting on the surveyors report (?) so I think we could cancel at this point with no great penalty. I told DH I had done this and he said he wants to just press on and get the extension as we would need to get it at some point and all the money dilemmas would be the same in years to come anyway. So underneath his ambivalence it seems he does realise we need the space too...

The builder coming out tomorrow has included things like UFH in his quote so I'm going to see if I can get his price down since we don't really want that. Well, I would want it but not sure if we need it!

It seems so quiet on here all of a sudden? Where is everyone else?

Yes it was aimed at you! Always happy to hear what everyone's been up to though...

Sounds like things are getting back on track for you!

Nothing happening here. Well apart from the usual choice overload!

I am back to my dilemma of whether to break through kitchen wall or not now... I am thinking of ways to keep this extension down to minimum costs and I am thinking that the only reason to knock through is to make the kitchen / diner look more spacious, so we don't actually need to knock through. Plus if we didn't break through then our fusebox wouldn't need to be moved either plus the only breaking through to be done would be to create the door to our new bedroom upstairs. Could prob save about £3k I think?

What do you think? I'm going to run it by the builder too tomorrow.

Sleeves - is your job not a fixed cost job? - just wondering about the spiralling out of control bit of your concern.

Come talk to me about the areas where you are worried the costs will go a bit barmy...

You could ask the builder for two quotes, one knocked through and one not.

i shouldn't have watched builders from hell last night...

Knocked through woud be nice if you can afford it. Again, what is best for your family? We all like to clump together at the hip, and so a kitchen/living space will be good I hope.

Mind you, it is the fashion at the moment, in 10 years everyone will probably be putting walls back in!

Have just started a thread asking about peoples' experiences of garden rooms! We looked at these briefly before but the plush ones can cost in excess of £20k so it seemed like an awful lot of money. This was obviously before we were quoted £35k to extend our kitchen by 3.6 x 4.5 m! So we are moving back to that idea and have posted looking for any thoughts on that idea.

Am also going to see my favoured kitchen guy tonight to see what he has come up with for us. If we did go down the garden room idea, we would still have new units anyway and his plan should need very little tweaking as the kitchen is staying in the existing end of the house anyway.

Sorry for going awol....computer finally died (though dh taken it for rescus one more time ) and am borrowing laptop.

Sleeves, what a lot you've processed since I last was here - I'm so glad its looking back on track, even with the ???s over the kitchen wall! Good for you for questioning everything, and discussing so much with your dh...all makes for more peace of mind later, regardless. Hope new builder is helpful, and I'd agree with asking for two quotes with and without knock through.

I went to see our build after dropping dd2 off this morning, omg what a change: one side wall almost built up to full height, low wall across the back, and other side wall was just being begun (in brick, as per neighbour's request) when I left. The gap between the damp course/new wall and the exisiting kitchen wall is being filled with hardcore atm, and a big noisy machine was tamping it all down. It all makes the garden seem smaller, but its a big garden (by local standards) so I think it'll be ok. Very weird feeling - and the kitchen ceiling half ripped down to put the steel in

I have some storage dilemmas I'll post when I can, but am rushing just now - hope everything going ok for all, see you asap

I am smiling again cos the (new) builder just came over and OMG it was like night and day with the old builder! He asked lots of questions, took notes and photographs and was generally just fab. He said the knocking down of the wall would only cost £100's so I decided to still knock it down. And he said it's all a fixed price his quote so no worries about it all spiralling in costs, unless we decide to add / upgrade things. And we will be getting our velux windows thrown in for nowt too (he made a mistake including these in the original quote but said he'll just keep them in).

He seems really professional and what I liked was that he didn't nose about for details of why the other builder was so crap, again very professional.

We have a start date for mid July, running for 12 weeks so that's not too far away.

Yipppppppppppppppppppppeeee!

Elibean, your build sounds like it's progressing well, must be fab watching it transform!

annh, sorry I have no experience of garden rooms. What would be in it for that price?