My F**king Builder.

[PavlovtheForgetfulCat]

He took all his tools last week, after receiving an agreed additional payment (from the final that we owe him) To clear the loft for the final lot of plastering he said. To be able to gain perspective he said. (he did not do this last time he plastered and there is only remedial plastering to do now up there, the rest is on the stairs, hallway etc). He talked to us about this and that, all nice.

After about 30 mins, I became a bit suspicious, again that he might have done a runner as he took everything apart from a yellow bucket. He took is ladder, why would you do this if you were plastering at height? Anyway, I am naturally suspicious. It is part of my job, it is part of my make-up. DH was a bit worried too, but we put it down to being nervous about this job. And I reminded myself of his reassuring conversation about him completing and DH and I agreed we were being unecessarily suspicious.

He was not coming in monday he said, bank holiday, out with the kids, he said.

This morning, he did not show. Did not answer his mobile. DH and I have been panicking. Eventually at 11am he phones.

And he said:

His younger brother has been rushed to hospital, is critical, collapsed lung (he only has one apparantly) and next 48 hours are critical. it had only just happened. He would try to get his plasterer mate to help him out.

Now. I am very cynical. DH said, initially, he appeared genuine. But DH is a very forgiving person and sees the best in everyone. I don't. DH started to doubt whether this was the truth or a blag. But, we are very nervous about whether this is true or not.

I actually want it to be true, so he that it means he has not done a runner with most of our money and left us in a hellhole. Does not make me a nice person I feel But then I also think he is very elaborate with his stories, has been so far and this smacks of some bullshit.

Either way, this week is dead for any work. and I am getting closer to my due date. And now, calm, chilled relaxed DH is starting to pull his hair out.

Sorry. Half of you probably won't even know what on earth I am banging on about but I needed to vent as I am so annoyed and upset and stressed and fed up it is unreal. I have no space. I am not sleeping as I am sharing with a toddler who talks in her sleep and a DH who is smoking too much and therefore snoring.

Noddy - most of what we paid him was cheque. It was the last 2 installments we paid cash so he could buy materials/etc.

ilovemydog - maybe your right. But he missed 2 days last week. He took all his tools. Including his first aid kit and dustpan and brush. There is nothing left up there apart from one yellow bucket with some rubble in.

Well that proves he has been working for you and thats important.Can you text him tonight and ask for a meeting and just lay it on the line.

Pavlov, DH has asked me to ask you did your architect put this builder forward to you? If so, then he has a responsibility and it is also normally part of the architect's job to certify the payments and have a notification of when they are due.

ilovemydog - agree we would not just get new builders in. We would give him proper notice and formally to put things right, of course. Then, if this is what we need to do, we will take him to court.

Its a shame he has not broken any law. But I might even look into that. I am sure deception is a criminal offence, and I can prove he deliberately took money from us knowing he had no intention of returning, that is deception. I am not sure, but I will certainly look into it.

Pesto - the situation with the architect is this. the builder said he knew some-one who he worked with. The builder was passed to us by some-one, a name, along with a million others. He stood out for a few reasons, we spent a lot of time looking into him. The architect, I did some digging, checked with building control (checked them both out with building control) and turns out he is the old chief structural engineer there, he had a good reputation, and they continued to get work through from him which was never any problem (he semi-retired which is why he no longer works there, he just runs his own structural engineering and architectural consultant business. We felt this was sound. Our architect, he recommended our builder back, but did not tell us we had to use him. He suggested it, but also gave us another name, to demonstrate it was not due to any kind of deal between them, other than they pass work each other's way.

Our architect was employed to to drawings, and then to be the agent. Does this mean he has responsibility for anything? . We need to talk to the architect anyway, he is not going to be happy as he has a very good reputation and this will not look good for him.

noddy - our architect knows he has been working for us to, so does building control, and the building inspector in particular who he argued with. He also signed for the cash, in respect of the work undertaken on our loft, rather than just 'here you go have some money' Not that it will mean very much, if he has no money to give us back.

Oh gosh - this is awful, I'm so sorry. I really thought you guys were going to end on a high note.

Just a quickie with regards to the builder being put forward by the architect - I know when my DP works that way it's only when the architect is there on the job and sees it through - almost like a project manager. In cases like that they usually add about 10% to the total bill for the pleasure! Sounds like the electics may need to be seen to asap - could you sort that out seperately with an electrician, ensuring they're part p registered?

Sorry, I wish had had something constructive to say; some pearls of wisdom

jeanjeanie yes the electrics need sorting asap, they have yet to have their second fix, that was due to be done this week. There is clearly a short some-where and the builder was on it. Yeah right.

You are in a great position to involve the relevant authorities if it comes to that.I really feel for you it is horrible you feel gutted and stupid all at once.I too thought I was pretty sussed with liars etc and it almost made it worse.I really hope it gets sorted this week xx

noddy it does make it worse. I get paid to work with people who spend all day trying to get out of things, who say and do anything to avoid going to prison, to avoid breaching orders or licences. I should have trusted my instinct and I did not and I feel really really fucking stupid.

So, what authorities do I notify? Where do I start? What I want to do is go round there and scream blue murder at him, so to speak, but that will do me and baby no good. DH would not do that, its not his way. But he has agreed to let me talk to him next. Not sure that is a good or bad thing

Oh blimey....Pavlov. Well, maybe take him out of the equation on the electrics and get that done seperately if they look dodgy....best be safe.

jeanie I agree. DH just won't do anything. Lets wait, lets wait. He has agreed I can call him in the morning about the electrics, but when I said, lets get someone else in to check them, he says NOT YET FFS! and when I say, but what about fire risk blah blah, he says I am over-reacting.

To be perfectly honest here. The strain this is putting on our relationship is quite horrific itself.

Well my sister had this fairly recently and she involved the local council and trading standards She had to allow them to finish her extension and re do all errors.They did 90% and then my sister had had enough and told them to go so she has no floor but she couldn't cope with teh stress|!

This is awful.
I hope this mess gets sorted out for you soon.

Can I say that when we had our extension built, the builder didn't ask for any money up front. He said that no builder should need to do that as they all have accounts with the suppliers, so they won't be liable to pay for whatever they order for the job, for 28 days.

If they're asking for money at the start of the job it's not for your materials.
Might be worth bearing in mind if you do have to find someone else.

noddy i remember you saying about that? How did they make them do it, I mean, what was their leverage?

ourlady I have heard that before too, but ALL the builders who quoted us, including the larger loft conversion specialists all quote with installments over a period of time, starting with an immediate/varying payment. So i thought it normal practice tbh.

Pavlov, the good news is that the floor has been fixed.

You will need a part 9 inspection which where new electrical installations have to have certification.

Call the local building control at the council. They are part of the Planning Department, and usually very very helpful. When I was having problems with taking out a retaining wall (I was in demolition mode for awhile ) the builder and the structural engineer were arguing. They both made sense as far as whether it was a retaining wall or not. And was a bit scary looking straight up and seeing the bathtub

Anyway, I wanted confirmation whether it was or wasn't a retaining wall so knew whether to put in support. The Building Inspector arrived, agreed that it wasn't, and everyone was happy. He later put it in writing so if there's a query later, I've done the reasonable thing.

Just don't pay the builder the final payment. Then he can take you to court for payment if he wants, but suspect that he probably won't.

Pav - a loft conversion and about to have a baby at the same time is enought strain on any marriage and thats when it is going right

I found ours very stressful and then ds3 coming early topped it all, but we got there in the end.

I can recommend a good plastered who did all of ours (and extras) in the Birdcage Farm area of Plymouth if you need one.

I hope this gets sorted soon

ilovemydog take me to court? Not a chance!!! I will on the other hand be taking him to court! No question. If I have to pay one single penny more than the amount we were quoted by him, in writing to get this mess fixed. I will take him to court.

Unless of course, he is genuine. In which case I will hope his wife is not an MNer .

I guess there is still a chance I am getting all hot under the collar for nothing and human kind does in fact prove to be inherently good, not inherently bad. But I am not counting on it.

Well, Pavlov, I personally agree with you...BUT, according to DP you could end up in the sh*t if you don't allow him a reasonable amount of time to finish and I'm not sure how you assertain was reasonable is?

What does the contract say? Can you bring the contract to a close? Just that if there is any outstanding money (even if he's not finished) he can make your life hell. You've actually made my DP look at his contract right now!!

With regards to money upfront. NO builder should be asked to bear the brunt of zero cash up-front. There should always be something as it's a two way street - how does the builder know that the client will pay?! Plus, labour has to be paid for - that's not on a 28 day trade account. One thing you guys did all correctly was the schedule of payments - handing over the rest because he couldn't pay to correct his mistake....well, you couldn't have known.

Ooogs really? Oh that would be fab. Hold on to that then and I will get back to you if this builder proves to be a scoundrel, a recommendation would be great.

jeanjeanie - I am guessing I will be guided by the architect, building control and trading standards to determine what a 'reasonable' length of time is. And he can bloody well go ahead and try to make our life shit. I am not afraid of a fight. Unfortunately there is not a time limit specific, not much at all specified to be brutally honest, only what work he will do, payment schedules, that it will be done to building regs blah blah.

I'm so at this school of thought that NO money should pass hands on a big building work until the project is complete It upsets me that people think this is rougue practise - it's not. Sadly it's just an industry where way too many ba*tards take the cash and run. My DP is on a job at the moment and it's been a three-month build....how the heck would we survive? Just imagine all those trade bills that would have to be paid - in his case to the tune of £50,000+ Our turnover is enormous (compared to profit!) and for us to be small and personal it would be impossible to work that way.

Would anyone out there work for that time unpaid and then trust their employer to pay them?

our builder was also a PITA but the work was done evemntually even though he tried to cut corners and use different materials than promised but dh was on the ball.

The plasterer on the other hand was fantastic and it was his handy work and dh's decorating (my choosing of course )that is really the impressive finish.

They finished and buggered off left 2 weeks after ds3 arrived. So I know it is stress, stress, stress.

So you have contacted trading standards?

My local council have a hotline to try to catch out "rogue traders"

I can understand the panic that goes with getting the house done in time for the new arrival and i know you have had a truly rotten time with your sickness.

Fingers crossed and remember, what goes around comes around.

We paid £4,000 in cash every fortnight with a retainer of £5,000 when the job was completed to everyones satisfaction.

Sorry - bit of a rant there composes self pavlov DP has just looked at his contract - gosh it's specific - for both him and the client. Basically, he has 7 days after written letter of complaint to have the chance to put it right. However he shouldn't expect to recieve anything and have the contract terminated if work is shoddy, not as plans or any element that he has overseen (incl electrics) are dangerous.