How much negotiation is normal on fixtures/fittings? Are my vendors being just trying their luck here?

[NorkyButNice]

I went over to the house we're buying this week to go over the fixtures and fittings list with the owner. We're first time buyers, so maybe this is completely normal, but they're doing things like unscrewing the loo roll holder, mirror, towel rail and cabinet from the bathroom wall.

Is it normal to remove things that are screwed to the wall?

One of my main bugbears is that the loft-room has shutters that were apparently made by a local company (at the cost of 1000 pounds) specially for the room. She wants us to pay 400 pounds if we want to keep them, as she says there's a room they can use them in in their new house. When we were in negotiations over price for the house, the reason they thought they should achieve full asking price was the 50K they spent installing and decorating the loft conversion, so surely they can't now start stripping out that decor? I don't know if I believe that they can re-use them or if they're just trying to make more money off us.

So is it normal to negotiate on prices for fittings?

Also, I noticed that the belfast sink in the kitchen has a crack in one half which I am sure wasn't there before we put in the offer. I mentioned it to her, and she said they'd been meaning to fix it for ages and never got round to it (obviously implying I'd not noticed it last time). If we need to get someone in to replace the sink (not to mention buying a new one), can I somehow negotiate on that now or is it too late?

Sorry it's so long!

ha ha i tried it on in our last house regarding shutters - i wanted 250 for ones which were about 1k.

they are very difficult to remove without damaging the walls in someway and i doubt it very very much she can use the in her next house. so i would call her bluff on the shutters.

i would definitely bring up the butler sink issue, they cost between £150 and £200.

afraid bathroom fittings arent unusual. but this is what happens if you paid significantly under the asking price (did you??)

Basically if it wasn't included on the house details they can take it, or ask you to pay extra for it. Call bluff about shutters and get stroppy about sink - anything that is mentioned and thus included has to be in working order (you sign a form to this effect as the vendor with your EA)

Like blackduck said if they are mentioned in rhe estate agents literature then they should be included in the sale, it might be worth checking.
From our last house we took things we could use again, like curtain poles and some loo roll holders we really liked

Good luck

No this is the thing - we paid 390, asking price was 400. This was the "move in and do nothing" house, not the "move in and have to spend the first month doing DIY" house.

I don't mind paying something for the shutters, as I would if I wanted to keep their curtains etc, but they really are an integral part of the room and I don't believe that they have a place for them.

The sink is definitely on the details. I have no proof that it wasn't damaged when we saw it last time though I'm certain I would have noticed.

It is normal to take things but they have to fill in the holes, and repait over, ie make good.

Insist the sink is fixed.

Call her bluff on the shutters, but if they take them, they will have to make good and make sure you tell them that.

check the list

they should have completed a fixtures and fittings list which then is returned

ask your EA or solicitor to check before they start taking everything

Don't pay anything and make sure that your solicitor includes a clause that they make good any holes etc left by removing fixtures and fixings. I can't believe how petty some people are - you're paying almost £400k, is it really worth removing a £5 loo roll holder?

The people we bought our house off even took the lightbulbs with them when we moved in, the big fat knob ends.

When you made your offer you should have said £390 to include X Y Z.

I have never taken anything made to measure. Or bathroom fittings.

Call her bluff, one house we bought they wanted £400 for a shed that had electric sockets and a light. We said "no, take it" knowing that it would be an arse to try to dismantle and re-erect somewhere else.

The shed stayed and we saved £400

You should have had a list of what was and wasn't included in the price. If you haven't your solicitor isn't doing their job properly. Having said that, my vendors tried to charge me for the fitted carpets when there was nothing but bare concrete underneath but the EA told them to shove off. I'm so glad too as when they left, it turned out there was a huge stain under one of the beds and I'd have been furious if I'd paid £3k for them

When we bought our old house, the sellers tried to charge us £400 for the garden shed. We called their bluff and said in that case we didn't wat it. of course they left it. I suspected they weren't really going to go to all the trouble of dismantling it and moving it.
Your sellers are entitled to take the loo roll holder, cabinet etc.

Snap, fizzylemonate, except ours didn't even have electric points.

Our sellers left great big holes in the walls where they'd removed mirrors etc. They didn't make good. And they left the kitchen filthy

It's not standard practice for a vendor to go to the lengths of unscrewing loo roll holders, mirrors, towel rails and cabinets BUT they are entitled to, there is a substantial minority who do, and almost everyone will encounter one vendor like that in their life.

Make sure that they are aware they'll have to make good after removing anything and that this is actually enforced. I'd probably make a counter-offer for the shutters, though.

Thanks for all the replies!

The comments about sheds made me laugh as one of the things they want to leave for us (for free) is their rickety, coming apart at the sides, shed. We'd have to replace it ourselves before putting anything valuable in it so I've asked her to dispose of it before we move in.

I've said that the price she wants for the shutters is close to the price I can buy new ones (true - only 50 pounds more) so would it be Ok for me to go round to look into hanging curtains. We'll see what she says to that.

Our last vendor took everything - bulbs, toilet roll holders, curtain rails etc leaving holes everywhere. They even took the 'fitted' wardrobes. We were convinced they were fitted but they argued that they were freestanding - so we couldn't work out how removing them left about 50 large holes in walls.

Then again, the vendor did hide in a wardrobe when we were there once and pretended to have a brain tumour so I'm not sure he was 'all there'.

Gosh, people are so mean. I sold two houses and left newish appliances behind (twice), lovely handmade curtains, chandelier...

If something gets taken, they should make good, as fill the holes, replace the light fitting with something suitable...

Our seller wanted to take the metal switches, then realised it would wreck the plastering and left them behind.

I hate it when it comes down to quibbling about these sort of things when you are buying/selling a place. It seems so daft when you have paid hundreds of thousands of pounds to be stingy enough to take loo roll holders with you.

I'd call their bluff on the shutters as well. If they are made to measure it sounds like it would be a massive hassle to get fixed into their new house without alteration.

With the sink though, I think I would leave it. You can't prove it was cracked after you put the offer in and this is the kind of thing that would really wind me up if I was selling my house. It may make them more inclined to dig their heels in over other things and for the sake of a hundred quid or so, its really not worth it.