Thinking of relocating from London to Cardiff - Advice please

[Sycamoretree]

General disillusionment with career, family unfriendly lifestyle, ridiculous West London mortgage and crappy catchment area lottery has resulted in our wistful musings becoming a more realistic plan to up sticks and move our family to Cardiff. DH's family are all in the general area, and it would work for us both career-wise.

Can anyone advise on nice areas to start doing some tentative house hunting/pricing in? I wouldn't want to have to commute more than half an hour. DC's are both pre-school age, so we'd want to be close to a good state primary school.

Also, what kind of price bracket would we be looking at for a 4 bedroom house with a garden in a nice area?

I'm trying to ascertain whether moving to another popular city would actually give us a better lifestyle, or if I'm just kidding myself.

Llandaff is lovely, as is Roath Park. Both of those are less than 20 minutes into the city centre on the bus, and Llandaff has a train station into town.

I don't know the schools so well as we didn't have children when we lived in Cardiff, but everyone wanted to live in Llandaff for the schools. The welsh medium schools certainly used to be favoured as they are slightly selective too, even at primary.

A look at RightMove suggests 330 000 would get you a nice 4 bed in Llandaff

We loved living in Cardiff (although we lived in the less salubrious areas) as there was so much going on in a tiny city

My first response is dont do it!! If youre looking for a lovely friendly place youve picked the wrong one, stay in England. The welsh generally hate the english (and its not all friendly banter)

But I have been here for 15 years now, although if I could persude dh to leave I would.

Cyncoed is pricey and mostly older people but the catchment schools are great (Rhydypennau Primary and Cardiff High School). Other nice areas include Pontcanna (very urban trendy, coffee bars, yummy mummys), Thornhill (we live here, newish estate, close to motorway, fairly good school catchment, supermarket and llanishen village all close by) Roath Park is nice, also parts of Heath and Whicthurch.

Thanks guys - mosschops - do you think the fact that I married a Welshman would make me less of an outsider?!

If we weren't selling in a credit crunch environment I think we have £300K of equity in our house, so it looks on paper as though this could be a smart move. I will get googling on these areas.

Mosschops - presume you are English then - genuinely interested in what you find the negatives are about living in Wales. It's a huge decision, and they'll be no going back in terms of getting back on the London property ladder so I'd have to be convinced we could all be happy there. I wouldn't want to be hankering after somewhere I felt more accepted or "at home". Maybe naively I figured any big city would just be more liberal and open about all comers, IYSWIM.

Do it, London is a dump. Sorry to the London fans. I live here too and have had enough. Had a crap hospital appointment today and on the 20 minute bus journey home, saw police pulling fighting school children off a bus, and 5 minutes up the road breaking up an altercation between fat chav couples outside a caff.

Dont know Cardiff but it's got to be a better environment for raising children then London

You pretty much sum up how I am feeling Salleroo. London was fine when I was younger, childless and building an exciting career in a very london-centric industry. Now my priorites are so different - I see everything through different eyes. I have spent 13 years in this industry and it now vaguely repulses me. I have to pay through the nose for everything - even getting swimming lessons means taking out a second mortgage practically. I drive for 45 mins to travel 10 miles and pay congestion charge just in the vain hope I might make it home in time to kiss my kids goodnight.

It can't go on - it just really can't.

Mosschops I am at wht you say. I live nearby and Hve done all my life. I don't know anyone who is rude yo pwople because they are English.
Maybe it is a Cardiff thing, Newport we are friendly.
Penarth is lovley about 10 mins out of cardiff.
Lots of good schools.
Pontcanna adn Landaff too.

Sycamore - I wouldnt say its without its problems, it will be like a slightly watered down version of London.
We still have plenty of rough chav families here, stabbings, lots of fighting and the weekends in city centre resemble a war zone on a good day. Theres also a huge immigrant problem in Cardiff and Newport. Schools are over subscribed (unless youre lucky enough to fit into the church bracket which luckily we do).
Parking in the city centre is still expensive although not as expensive as London I imagine.
I have worked in a city centre office with 3 other girls who were all welsh speakers and knew I wasnt and they spoke welsh all day long, I left after 4 days, it was unbearable.
I have also been verbally abused by a friend of dh's at a wedding for being english.

However like I said I have been here 15 years now, dh is a welshman and doesnt want to leave. There are lots of lovely people here and Ive got lots of great friends, and generally people are the same as they would be in any major city in the UK its just somewhere I wouldnt choose to live.
BTW I am originally from a big city in the North so its not like Im not used to city living but I find the people and the attitude up north preferable to that of the welsh.
I just woundnt come to Cardiff thinking it will solve all your problems, they will be the same here only maybe a bit cheaper

HTH

Sycamoretree - I live not too far from mosschops by the look of it and am also English. I've lived in Cardiff for 11 years having relocated from Hampshire.

I can understand why mosschops feels there is some anti-english feeling, however, both DH and I are English and have settled here really well. So well actually that we could not imagine ever moving back to England. People often asked me when I moved her whether my DH was welsh and were quite disappointed he wasn't, but no one even considers me not welsh these days so there is no problem at all. My children (DD6 and DS2) were both born here and consider themselves Welsh despite my brainwashing them! There are an awful lot of English people (particularly in North Cardiff - Llandaff, Rhiwbina, Thornhill, Llanishen etc) due to the amount of professionals living here that moved here to work at the hospital, university and elsewhere. I genuinely only had problems with my Englishness when I first moved here and made a big thing of it myself if you see what I mean. I've found the welsh to be very friendly and chatty and would find it devastating to move back to the south-east again where everyone is too self-important and rushed to give you the time of day.

The area of Rhiwbina is also a nice area with great primary schools (excellent Estyn - welsh equivalent to Ofsted - reports). The other areas recommended would also suit you very well.

This page here has some properties in Cardiff, this one being very close to the countryside in Rhiwbina.

The first thing to be aware of, moving here with pre-school children, is that the nursery system is different here to that in England. Here, the nurseries (age 3 plus) are located in the same grounds as the primary schools. Applications go in by the January prior to the September after their third birthday. There are no voucher systems here, you apply to the council and the school itself. There are however private nurseries around for children aged 2 1/2 plus for around £9 per morning or afternoon and they are generally well regarded with quite long waiting lists.

Hope that helps, any other questions then feel free to ask.

Thanks Hockeypuck - it's good to hear from all sides - it's a major life decision so not one to wander into blindly. My main issue is with how hard I work, for how long, for a really good wage, but that london prices mean my lifestyle is not great and I just don't get to see my kids enough. My DD 3 is in nursery as of this september at a nursery attached to the local primary school, so similar to what you describe I think. It's free and 5 days a week.

you will get free nursery education for five mornings or afternoons a week here in wales.

Agree North Cardiff is the best

Also agree that the welsh may be preferable to southerners but Im only saying that as a northerner

mosschops - I'm inclined to agree with you on that point

Yes, sa mosschops says, the nursery here is free at that age.

sycamoretree - you say your DH has family in the area. Do you have the option of visiting for a few days to really get the feel of the areas you like, the housing options and the nature of the place?

Yes, he has family in Newport and Bridgend, so that's definitely something we'll do once we manage to make a short list of target areas.

Come to Cardiff. Tis lovely.

I'm English too, DH Welsh, but haven't had any problems other than mild teasing. And frankly, as a Lancastrian, I've said worse things about Yorkshiremen in my time

Nice thing about Cardiff is that it isn't too big. You can commute really easily - even the worst journeys from the outskirts are better than most in London. We're not too far from either countryside, or beaches. Be aware that much of South Wales is pretty poor though, so if you're after a life surrounded by ponceyness, you could be disappointed.

Nice areas are
Pontcanna (though I understand there could be an issue re the nearest English language secondary school there)
Penylan - schools are changing here and might be better by the time your DCs get to school.
Heath has the best people

"good" secondary schools are supposed to be Cardiff High, Llanishen and Whitchurch.

Also Penarth is a nice place, Stanwell school is supposed to be a good one.

The truely fabulous thing about Cardiff is that you would be living in a very cosmopolitan city but be close to the coast and countryside. Crime isn't a terrible problem and most of the schools are reasonable. Whitchurch comp is a big school but still offers a good standard of education. You may wish to look at the Vale of Glamorgan which is mostly green belt and has some very nice villages. This incorporates Penarth and Cowbridge both great little towns. Penarth is a victorian coastal town with a pier! Cowbridge is a market town, very home counties (if you are worrying about being English!) Both perfectly commutable for Cardiff city centre (say 45 mins during rush hour).

Have lived in Cardiff most of my life - if you have kids look at Penylan (tho' this is not currently in the catchment area for the excellent comp. Cardiff High) Radyr (Radyr comp) and Rhiwbina (Whitchurch High). Cowbridge comp is excellent. Most Primary schools in Cardiff are ok.

Oh it also has alot of green spaces in the city centre itself (which is compact and has some lovely Victorian arcades). I dont speak Welsh and it is not a problem my husband is English and he has never encountered any problems.

Gwaelod-y-Garth is a little known secret in North Cardiff -check it out. The film The man who went up a hill and came down a mountain' - made it 'famous'.

Cardiff is lovely. Where you choose to live will prob be largely determined by school/commute choices and £300K equity assuming you will have a mortgage on top will buy you into any of the "nice" areas. You could get into central Cardiff from any of the suburbs, Vale villages East of Cowbridge or Penarth within 30 mins even in rush hour. Cowbridge proper and more westerly Vale villages plus Bridgend will take a bit longer but it will depend where your jobs are. Cowbridge and Penarth are both nice "small towns" but close to city with their own identities and lots of activities plus proper high streets - both quite poncetastic!. Penarth has a small rocky beach and lots of really nice big Victorian houses with bigger gardens than you'd get in Cardiff. Cowbridge very smart but more "country" with lovely villages around with very strict planning regs! School choices also important. First choice to make English or Welsh medium? English - "best" secondaries Cardiff High in Cardiff itself, Stanwell - Penarth or Cowbridge comp - Cowbridge. Wanting Cardiff High will leave you looking at Cyncoed, Roath Park and Lakeside. Stanwell is central and "lower" Penarth. Cowbridge comp not sure which villages are in and which out but the house prices will give you a clue! Welsh secondaries all have similarly excellent reputations/results and choice more down to the primary feeder you prefer, the most popular Welsh primaries are now hugely oversubscribed and you will have to live close to the school to get in - look at Pontcanna, Llandaff and Victoria Park/parts of Canton in West Cardiff or Rhiwbina. Some areas of Cardiff are more "Welsh" than others eg Pontcanna/Vic Park (West) - very popular Welsh primaries and secondary plus close to BBC Wales studios make these quite "Welsh" areas and you'll hear a lot of Welsh in the streets and shops. On the other hand you wouldn't often hear Welsh over in Cyncoed/Lisvane (East). The LEA will send you street maps with catchment boundaries if you know which primaries you are interested in - Estyn reports -(online) will help but asking around/visiting just as important. Estate agents details almost always include school info if they're in catchment for the most popular schools.

dh and i met in cardiff (we are both english) and moved to london a couple of years after getting together. we moved because cardiff was not quite cosmopolitan enough for us. fast forward 5 years and we now have a baby and another on the way and everytime we go back we wish we still lived there.

i have never ever encountered any anti english sentiment. such talk is complete madness. i i cant help but bristle of at the supposed "huge immigration problem." unless i missed something and one of the OP's motivations for leaving london was too many foreigners ??

pontcanna lovely, but quite pricey. penarth slightly further out but great place for kids. if we were to move back, i think we'd prob go for Roath Park or Pen-y-Lan.

Interested to know which industry the OP works in?? i worked in telly in both london and cardiff, and the working environment was so much more civilised in cardiff. no macho hours and stress for the sake of it -- and the job still got down and my "commute" was a twenty five min walk thru a park....

Swotty - yes, similar industry to you hence imagining we could realistically get like for like work in Cardiff. Interesting to hear it's a bit more civilised - more than interesting in fact - very attractive!

And no, not bothered a bit by who lives where - I like cities because they are melting pots - but I'm currently melting down in this one.

I've been back and forth to Wales for the last 10 years I've been with DH and I haven't ever felt any anti englishness during my visits - I suppose I had thought that any major city is used to tolerating if not embracing all comers.

Mosschops - what utter rubbish. I am English and living in Cardiff.

What about Penarth, some good schools there and it's small but near to Cardiff. Or Cowbridge if you can stretch your finances.

Cardiff's lovely. I'm Welsh, DH is English, and we've never had a probelm. My brother lives in the valleys and is a lot more insular, but you won't have a problem in Cardiff - or indeed the Vale of Glamorgan, half an hour's commute into Cardiff; Cowbridge is fab, we lived there for 7 years before we came to Yorkshire.

Mosschops - have also just read your opinion of the 'huge immigrant problem' and am shocked.

Cardiff has had a history of 'immigrants' living here particularly in Cardiff bay (Tiger Bay) and these days is not specially effected by 'problems', no more than any other city in the UK.

How can you voice such awful views about the attitude of the Welsh towards the English and then spout stuff about the problem of immigration!?

I doubt very much that the women in your office were speaking Welsh to deliberately Alienate you. I work in a bi-lingual media environment in Cardiff and we have many Welsh speakes here for whom Welsh is their first language and it makes perfect sense that they would talk to eachother in their own first language. Perhaps if you had given it longer than 4 days and had not had such a chip on your shoulder you might have rrealised that they weren't trying to alienate you.

Lol am I an immigrant then because Im English .... rofl I rest my case!

FYI I have worked at a refugee centre in wales and there is a problem here, its not the problems of the immigrants its the government who dump people here with no friends or family or any real support. cardiff and Newport are both dumping grounds for those seeking asylum and brought here from centres at ports and airports.

I have no problem with people speaking their native language, but I think its rude when there is one non speaker and that person is left to be quiet in an office all day whilst the others talk and is excluded. Its not a welsh thing, I would think it rude in any language.

But of course they werent trying to alienate me, because the welsh love the english right course you do!

plus I imagine your lack of insight into the problems of asylum seekers in cardiff comes from you living in leafy pontcanna, drinking coffee at cameo and meeting up with the other yummy mummies in your secluded little world.

Wake up fgs, this is not a perfect world

At the end of the day, not everyone will love living in Cardiff, but I think most would agree that it is a pleasant city, vibrant with lots to offer culturally. The Ogmore has some lovely beaches for example just 45 mins from Cardiff. You can go for great bike rides up the taff trail from the city centre.

You will enjoy Chapter Arts centre - go for a cuppa and peruse their forthcoming events.

If the kids are a bit ratty have a latte and cake at Cafe Junior in Cathays while they dress up and play with the toys.

In no way does deprivation sit cheek by jowl with riches in the way it does in London

I think it is a great city, the fastest growing in Europe.