Whilst I'm sorry for those being gazundered you really can't blame the buyers can you?

[Twiglett]

I mean if you could save 20 - 30K on a purchase you would wouldn't you?

It's a lot of money. And I'm sure it makes a huge difference to the purchasers.

And it's up to the vendor to decide whether to take it or not. You can always say no.

That's the power of the bargain surely .. isn't it?

I have no issue with buyers offering less than asking price but not when you have already agreed a price and are due to exchange contracts within hours.

Until the practice is made illegal, it will continue to happen.

So I'm with the OP on this, although I'd never do it myself.

And a buyer can only get away with gazundering if the vendor agrees to it.

I considered withdrawing the original offer and putting in a lower one after the mortgage company's surveyor valued it under the asking price (completed late August btw). I decided against it in the end because I knew I would be doing something wrong, because I was not being gazundered myself and because the vendor was pg as well. So I am 30k less well off but can feel good about myself

'So I am 30k less well off but can feel good about myself '

Much, much more when you factor in the interest you will pay on that sum.

And let's not forget that it's also still legal for a vendor to gazump and demand more money.

Again, not very ethical, but should have been made illegal to avoid situations like these entirely.

Hmm yes it is "dishonourable" etc. but frankly it it came to losing 2 or 3 times my annual salary I would be logical about it too

The market has DROPPED massively in the last few weeks, no one could have forseen it

over 25 years at a modest 5% that 30K would cost a family over 53K

yes quite

I think people have realised that the market is about CONFIDENCE and not much more than that

And the CONFIDENCE has gone

A house is only worth what someone will pay (or what it would cost to build)

You say the buyer can decide not to accept a drop, except they are effectively being blackmailed into doing so. Particularly when the reduction request comes so close to exchange and they stand to lose the money spent in legal fees etc and the property they are purchasing.

"take £30k off the price or I won't buy your house" No, that's not black mail at all is it. Gazumping is the same, it's blackmail.

but isn't that what should happen at the offer stage MM? Doing it day before exchange means you have just wasted 3 months (or more) of the seller's time and money. 3 months ago, it was obvious the market would continue to fall, and buyers put in offers in full knowledge of that.

'3 months ago, it was obvious the market would continue to fall, and buyers put in offers in full knowledge of that.'

Not necessarily. There had been one quarter of no growth. But not a quarter of negative growth and a huge bailout and the collapse of several huge banks only happened in the past month.

Again, I'm not saying it's a nice thing to do, either gazumping or gazundering, but again, it is the nature of the beast as MM pointed out.

Even now, there are plenty of threads on here from even today where posters are still displaying remarkable confidence in a bouyant housing market.

Really? I was expecting the market to continue falling. Anyone thinking otherwise would have been optimistic. And we accepted an offer that was accompanied by "this market is going to continue to fall, and we're factoring that in so that we won't need to reduce price later to account for it" who did then gazunder anyway. So what was their excuse?

Who knows what they were thinking.

But I really, really wish they would make both gazundering and gazumping illegal.

their excuse MamaC is they wanted to get your house for the lowest possible price.

They won this one. Because you want to sell it at that price. Not meaning this is what you want to happen but you have weighed up your options and accepted this further cut in the price as worth it to you so you are continuing with the sale.

This is your choice. You have a sale that is due to exchange at a price you've both agreed.

Maybe it feels unfair to you but you had the choice to say no. And then see if they wanted your house badly enough or if they're willing to walk away from the money they've put in on surveys and legals to date and write that off and start looking again.

England should have the scottish system

actually, neither gazundering or gazumping are illegal in the Scottish system, they're just less common, although when they occur it tends to be in Edinburgh or the Borders, where there are higher concentrations of English.

yes but a contract is considered binding at the verbal stage

MurderousMarla - Lots of people did complain about gazumping constantly and it was on the back of all those complaints that the government brought in home information packs which were supposed to speed up the house-selling/buying process and, hopefully, cut the practice out. They then - idiotically - decided to abandon the condition report element of the HIP and so it has made very litte to no difference to the transaction.

I also think the line about "oh well, sellers are getting what they deserve after ten years of gazumping" which paraphrases what a lot of people have said on these talkboards is completely empty as it is not likely to be the people who were gazumping in the first place who are gazundering now.

Gazundering at the last minute is a horrible thing to do but, in principle, I am with Twiglett, that the market decides what a house is worth and if that market is falling it should be possible to adjust your offer accordingly (but not blackmail a seller on eve of exchange). I would HATE the Scottish system which makes withdrawing an offer and puts all your costs up front before you even know if you will have the winning bid.

I don't blame them because it is very difficult to resist but I do think it is morally very wrong. Far more wrong for example than having children who swear or don't say thank you, please etc which I have seen argued on here as morally reprehensible before.

I would very much like to see law changes on house purchasing so that once a price is agreed and a contract signed, backing out would cost the person making the decision (buyer or vendor) a great deal of money.

Once the contract is signed you can't back out without penalties. The bit leading up to the exchange of contracts when gazundering takes place.

I think it's about time it was a buyers market tbh.

And no, you can't blame the buyers - if you make an offer and 3 weeks later you think the market has dropped by another 10% (quite likely atm) then fair enough to ask for another drop imo.

How come people consider 200% INCREASES perfectly reasonable yet moan when the market drops by 30%?

I still think you should do all the dealing at the start I completed yesterday and think i could have got another 10k off but decided not to go there as I didn't want to hold up exchange and would hate it done to me.If you are paying more than 2004 prices then you are over paying better to be 'cheeky'{?} and stand your ground than have bad karma in a new home