subsidence next door - asked to remove hydrangea

[railingsandsilver]

Live in a terraced house in Bristol and have a lovely mature climbing hydrangea on my exterior wall.

Unfortunately my neighbours have bad subsidence (our place is safe, as was underpinned years ago). Their insurers have 'recommended' that we remove our hydrangea - but their monitoring has shown no evidence of hydrangea roots under neighbour's property, and their report specifically says that vegetation couldn't be determined to have caused what's going on. It seems to be precautionary at this stage.

My plan is to say that I don't believe it's necessary to remove it now but if it shows as a clear factor at a later stage we'll reconsider. But I'm a bit spooked by the 'if you don't follow our instructions, we could hold you liable for costs' wording on their letter. I know insurers like to do this to intimidate and can't legally make us do it if it's an unproven cause.

Does anyone have any experience? Do I just hold my nerve? TIA

@KalantheThe neighbours won’t let the contract for the underpinning. The insurance company will do that. The neighbours will get what they are given. The op could get a second opinion on the roots of her plant - I would be inclined to do that. Then she’s got ammo to refute the requests for removing the hydrangea.

Finding roots in the soil does not prove that those roots caused the subsidence, and it is unlikely anyway.

I would say though, that climbing hydrangeas are known to cause physical damage to the exterior of buildings, particularly any render, shingles or tiles, and they can force their way into narrow gaps and the roof space. So if I were you, I'd give it a fairly severe haircut anyway.

@istherereallytimeforallthat I agree that’s a good course of action. Prune it back and make sure it’s not attacking your house. Agreed - roots mean nothing when it’s a shrub because they are not the same as a mature willow! What other trees are nearby?

What are the other trees? A climbing shrub <5m tall will have a much smaller influence zone than a mature oak or willow so if the damage is widespread it is more likely to be caused by another tree or shrub. If there is anything nesting you can't remove it now anyway.

If you have legal cover with your home insurance you could contact them for advice. Check your house insurance T&C too.

Thanks everyone. To re-iterate, the houses are built on clay soil and have incredibly shallow foundations. Several houses in the terrace have had subsidence over the years. Neighbour has already done trial pits which show no evidence of the hydrangea roots, and the report also states that vegetation cannot, at this stage, be held responsible for the subsidence as it’s severe and through their whole building.

However, monitoring is ongoing. If they later find evidence that my plant a factor, of course I’d remove it. But my concern is that they could then say ‘well, we informed you X months ago it might be a factor, so you are liable’. It’s the way the letter is worded - but surely that is a bullying tactic and legally very shaky? You can’t say ‘we think something might be a problem but can’t prove it now. Unless you do as we say right now, based on no evidence, if we ever do prove it is a problem in the future then we hold you responsible.’ It makes no sense. And I think I would be covered by essentially saying ‘well, if you prove it is a problem, I will address it’ covers me?

If they're likely to carry out underpinning to the house, can they check at that stage if there are any roots? Also, saying it was the plant, they'll be roots growing at other angles - might be worth asking neighbours to dig down themselves a couple of meters near the boundary/close to outer wall and if there are signs of large roots, you'll remove the plant then. Also, if the roots are that large they're causing problems, they'll need to remove roots anyway (whether your plant is there or not) as suckers could well grow.

@ifonly4 - yes they will be doing that work I’m sure and if it’s found to be an evidence-based problem at any point, then I will remove it. What I am querying is - if I state this, surely it covers me legally in the event if it did become proven later?

Surely the alternative would be like taking out medical insurance where pre-existing conditions aren’t covered. If you later got diagnosed with stage 4 cancer they couldn’t turn around and say ‘but this cancer has been growing for years, so you are not covered’ ?!

@railingsandsilverWho are “they”? The insurance they have might try and claim but your insurance will see that off! Believe me - they will! This subsidence will not be caused by your plant? How can it possibly be if it’s every wall? It’s their issue just like all the other houses. The foundations are inadequate for the soil conditions. It’s that simple so don't get sucked into another narrative. It’s their insurance playing non payment games! You need my DH Rottweiler to act for you !