If you’re a landlord, what is a normal level of support/involvement in this scenario?

[Thkuuu]

I’m an accidental landlord and recently moved in my first tenant. She is lovely and conscientious and I have a feeling she’ll take good care of the flat, but she needs a lot of extra support setting up bills etc. She’s quite young and not from the UK, and this is her first time having to deal with utilities, broadband, council tax etc. because her previous tenancies were all fixed term and with bills included.

I know that this won’t be forever - she only needs to set up the bills and accounts once. I do really empathise because I am also foreign, and remember how stressful it was trying to figure everything out for the first time. It can be really tricky if you’re not used to the system.

I’ve been there to answer all the tenant’s questions, and we even had a long phone call during which I explained everything she needed to set up and how. I don’t mind doing some hand holding, but what I do mind is that she’s been getting a bit arsey with me, and quite demanding. I get the feeling she thinks I should be doing more and/or that it’s my fault that it’s a complicated process. I think the fixed term contracts with bills included gave her an unrealistic view of what you need to take on as a tenant.

Would be curious to hear from others what level of support/involvement is normal in this kind of scenario? I’m really keen to be a good landlord and on friendly terms with her, and I don’t want her feeling aggrieved about not getting enough support, but I also feel like it’s not my responsibility to help her figure out the minutiae of broadband contracts etc.

Very minimal. Had tenants from overseas, gave a couple of pointers re council tax etc, that was it. If you weren't managing the property yourself or you weren't so nice, she'd have to ask friends wouldn't she?
Given all you say, I suspect she may be under the impression now that you're not just being nice by helping, this is part of the job of the landlord. And she's getting arsey because, from her POV, you're not performing the service she is paying for quickly enough.

I think you need to give her a very clear reset on what is her responsibility, what is yours, and what you're prepared to do as extra to be helpful but isn't actually part of the service. And suggest friends may be better placed to help with recommendations etc.

I think you've been extremely helpful already - the fact that she's now becoming more demanding is worrying. I'd take a step back and keep things on a business basis. Explain to her that it is up to her to sort out broadband, etc by going to the provider and ask there.

Surely, even being from abroad, she must understand these basic things?

Does the Uk not have a agency or serviceto hwlp such a person nee to the contry and ways of the home set.up services?
Of course a landlord only wants the $$.

Hand this tenancy over to an agency immediately.
I predict shes going to be a nightmare tenant.

@AmarilloArmadillo @Petrine thanks both. It was my instinct that it had gone a bit too far, and as Amarillo says, I think that by trying to be as supportive as possible, I inadvertently gave her false expectations of what my role as a landlord is.

I think it's the combination of being from abroad and being young (i.e., this is her first time ever setting up any bills, not just in the UK)

We do but its chargeable so the Tenant would rather get Op to do it for free
OP step right back or you will have nothing but trouble (might be too late though) and as you know now Problem Tenants are a MUCH bigger issue to deal with than previously
You are not her Parent, presumably she has a job and can use the internet so she should be doing all for those things without any inupt from you

Letting Agency! They’ll set her straight.

I agree with others that you should transfer to a letting company. The current legislation will make it far more difficult to resolve issues with the tenant and it does sound as though you will have issues.

I really disagree with taking on a letting agency at this point, they charge upwards of 15% for the service of being a glorified postbox in my experience. Can easily turn a small profit into a negative. I'd set some clear boundaries now and give her a chance. Things should settle down once she's all set up.

The normal level of support with this process is none.

i suspect she has unrealistic expectations due to previous experiences.

utility companies are a fucking nightmare at the best of times.

I did consider using a letting agency. But between the cost and my own (terrible) experience with letting agencies as a tenant, I felt happier trying to do it independently. I also thought the tenant might treat the place better if they are dealing directly with me vs. a faceless letting agent.

To be fair, she was very understanding about some teething issues with the flat. I hadn't been living there for a while and she wanted to move in ASAP, so some things needed to be resolved after her tenancy started - she was very good about this. So I'm hoping she's just frustrated (which is understandable when you're on hold with utility companies for hours), and has gotten the wrong end of the stick re: bills, rather than being inherently difficult... but time will tell.

Definitely time to draw a boundary, though - thanks for all the feedback.

I disagree because the OP has already shown she's no idea how to deal with tenants, is emotional about it, and agencies are more knowledgeable about the law and able to be dispassionate about everything. The 15% is a small price to pay imo.

Get really good landlord insurance too. With rent and eviction process cover.

Could you point her to citizens advice? They should be able to give advice and help her organise things

I'm a landlord, you've definitely gone above and beyond! I wouldn't mind helping a little in this scenario, but I'd likely send instructions, answer a few questions and that's it! It's not our job really to do any of this type of stuff at all.

I've never used an agency either. I don't see why I'd pay someone what is quite a lot of money, to do a job I can do myself. It takes up so little time too.

Normal is “no support whatsoever”. Google exists, and she presumably has friends or work colleagues or a university student support service over here who she can ask.

You’ve lived overseas, I’ve lived overseas, you must know it isn’t normal anywhere for your landlord to act as your PA, running your life for you. She’ll be sending you to pick up her dry cleaning or get her car serviced next. Is she by any chance from a country where domestic servants are common? (ME, India, etc)

I'm a landlord and I have absolutely no involvement in my tenants' utilities etc. I do however, use an agent so if the tenants did need help I would expect my very nice and helpful agent to guide them.

Being a first time landlord without an agent is a bold move. I've been a landlord over 20 years and I still wouldn't do it without an agent (especially as you seem to have yourself a rather high maintenance tenant).

Are you fully on board with all your certificates and safety checks? There's quite a lot that you need to have in place.

Not sure why people keep recommending letting agents to help her, I’ve rented a few times over the years and the only thing they ever helped with was repairs and that was often under sufferance, other than the quarterly checks I never had any dealings with them till I moved out.

I am a landlord of nearly 10 years and didn't use a managing agent from the outset, although I do use OpenRent who take a small fee and cover credit checks, contracting etc.
I think it's perfectly fine to manage yourself as a new landlord if you read up on all that is required and take your role seriously, like a job. I have always much preferred holding viewings myself and meeting prospective tenants, you can easily tell who is going to be a PITA vs who will take care of the property.

By contrast I let my house out for a period whist overseas, via a managing agent, "full service". Absolute pisstake, any issues just got forwarded to be sorted out, for 15% the level of involvement still required was ridiculous.

I wouldn't be put off OP, you'd get no value from a managing agent now anyway having actually found the tenant, I'm sure they'd be delighted to take the job on with you having actually done all the hard work!

Agents' fees are a tax deductible business expense for the property owner.

I had a similarly inexperienced and potentially dependent tenant, but it was the letting agent who dealt with her.

If you choose your letting agent carefully they are very much worth the fee. Mine owns the business she runs, is very hands-on, has a team of plumbers, sparks, roofers, joiners etc she can call on at very short notice for emergency repairs, and is up-to-date with all relevant legislation. She does a much better job of managing the let than I would as I simply don't have her knowledge, contacts or resources. Unless you have a similar ability to act quickly and appropriately to deal with repairs or problems then you are being very unfair to your tenant, and not a good landlord, in my opinion.

I'd also add - that there are very few really "accidental" landlords. The only people I would see as being "accidental" are those who inherit or otherwise unexpectedly find themselves owner of a rental property and immediately start the process of giving notice to the tenant. If you have chosen to be a landlord, then that is intentional not accidental.

This is my experience too.
My agent does a much better job than I'm capable of and I'm grateful to hand over my 13%.

The OP's tenant is taking up a lot of her time though, and that is likely to continue and maybe even get worse.

No, don’t work with a letting agency, the £££ will never end. Support with setting up stuff should be naturally time limited anyway. I also have first-time tenants and I emailed them the links for council tax, current gas/electricity supplier and water supply with a note that she should contact them to either open her account or swap to a provider of their choosing. I also emailed the utility companies directly to inform them about the new tenancy and responsibility of bills from
now on. From there, all she needs to do is to respond to letters addressed to her and follow the prompts, and I dont get involved in that.

I'm a LL with over 20 years experience. I generally do not get involved in tenants utilities, council tax or broadband however I once rang to help a tenant set up a gas account but it literally took 5 minutes and the tenant had poor English. I had to explain what tenant wanted then they spoke to her to verify she wanted to open gas account.