Can landlord force me out after no-fault notice if I stay?

[BlakeCarrington]

Hello wise Mumsnetters

I hope some of you might have experience in this area. I’m a private tenant who has been in a property for a year and am on a month by month rolling contract. I’ve looked after the place well, paid my rent on time etc.

My landlord has decided to sell up and has given me a no fault eviction notice and 2 months notice which runs out at the end of this month.

I have sorted somewhere else to go, but I can’t get into the new place until end of April. I was thinking of asking him to extend u til then but I doubt he’ll go for it, he’s champing at the bit to sell it.

Where would I stand if I just said I can’t move out until end of April as I’ve nowhere to go? It’s only 4 extra weeks and I would still pay rent. Could he send in the bailiffs or change the locks or something?

Thanks

Utter rubbish. She absolutely has a legal right to stay!

It's a waiver which runs out end of Dec 26

The waiver for other European countries runs out as well, but yes, hopefully they will all be extended.

UK does not have a strained diplomatic relationship

Perhaps not now, but we've had a very strained relationship with China over the last few years, re: Beijing's crackdown on pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong, Huawei, allegations of espionage and cyberattacks, the Uyghurs, China's sanctions on UK MPs and peers, recall of Chinese diplomats from the Manchester consulate...

Citizens Advice:

"If your section 21 notice is valid
Your landlord can’t make you leave your home unless they’ve gone to court to get a possession order and a warrant for eviction - this means they can use court bailiffs to evict you. If they try to force you to leave before this, it’s an illegal eviction - you can talk to an adviser for help to challenge it.
Your landlord can only go to court after the date the section 21 notice says you have to leave.
If you’ve got a good relationship with your landlord, it might be worth asking them if you can stay in your home for longer. Send a letter to your landlord explaining your situation and keep a copy of any reply you get.
When your landlord goes to court, you might be able to ask the court to let you stay in your home for longer. You’ll need to get papers from the court before you can ask to stay in your home for longer.

This is incorrect. She does have the legal right to stay. As you admit, she cannot be legally removed without a court order. The LL would be a fool to start legal action when she has said that she only needs one extra month.

Shelter will support you in staying put @BlakeCarrington.
As he is being so inflexible, you will, unfortunately, need to tell him that you will be staying for one extra month and will continue to pay the rent.

I get the feeling that there are a lot of very sore amateur LL's here who, as suspected, have no idea of what the law says.

That's not the same as a legal right to stay, upon expiry of the section 21 the tenancy has legally ended, she is there illegally.

Its then down to the landlord to enforce the end of the tenancy and remove her, she is in effect in a legal hinterland.

I would absolutely have sympathy if she was looking at homelessness and was staying put until the LA step up with emergency accommodation - but in this case she should be respectful to the landlord, she has asked politely and been declined, equally reasonably.

There are any number of temporary accommodations, hotels, guest houses, holiday lets, air b'n'b etc.

I've stayed in a holiday let before in-between permanent addresses, its the reasonable thing to do.

Section 21 notice DOES NOT end a tenancy. So you're wrong.

@AmandaBrotzman isn’t the bare minimum the notice period set out in the contract to which the OP agreed?

Whilst I agree tenants should be treated fairly, so should landlords. For example, we are not to know if the landlord is an accidental landlord whose circumstances are such that they need to sell their property to release equity to avoid themselves going into debt or having their own home repossessed.

If indeed that is the case, why is the op entitled to stay for longer than she agreed she would per her contract just for her convenience? Convenience in the sense that she has chosen a subsequent rental whose availability dates aren’t suitable and is opting not to use an AirB&B or other short term rental to bridge the gap (because of cost factors).

Why is her want to save herself the inconvenience and extra cost a greater entitlement than that of the landlord in selling their property, for whatever reasons they may need to?

Note, for clarity: I believe the OP should simply ask the landlord and the landlord, assuming they are able to, should agree. The best approach is the amicable approach given all sides are human after all… despite how landlords are often portrayed.

Disclosure: I am an accidental landlord. Unable to sell my property due to cladding issues and thus forced to let it out (at a below market rate I have held for c 5 years despite market and letting agent pressures to increase, because I believe it’s the right thing to do).

@ExpectMore the landlord has said no to a short extension.

Of course you're an 'accidental landlord' 🙄
tenancy law is clear. Tenants have the right to remain in a property whilst a legal tenancy is in place. Landlords don't have the right in law to end a tenancy other than via a court order. Only tenants can end a tenancy by giving notice/leaving at the end of a fixed term.
You might not like the law but it's the law. So no, I don't think any tenant should be obliged to leave their home before they are ready and able to just because the landlord asks them to. Even if they ask super nicely 🙄

He could go to court but there is a huge backlog so you would have moved out before case came up. I'm a LL and would keep the court action in place but unofficially agree the 4 week extension. That way if you didn't move out after 4 weeks then court action would still be ongoing but if you did move out I'd stop court action. I hope he simply gives you a 4 week extension.

@AmandaBrotzman isn’t it the case that the tenancy has ended, but until such time as the fee is a possession order from the court, the landlord cannot make the OP leave?

@AmandaBrotzman you are missing the point. I suspect it’s beyond you to get it so I won’t try to articulate it again. Have a nice evening

Unfortunately there are many chippy tenants who imaging all landlords are the super wealthy and are wracked with jealousy that they have to rent, whilst the likes of you and I rent out properties, often at no profit whatsoever.

There are of course rogue landlords, who give us all a bad reputation, but I am hardly surprised that so many landlords are looking to sell up or move their properties to holiday let models when tenants are so unreasonable, fuelled by the inaction of local authorities and organisations like shelter.

Make no mistake, their are genuinely hard done by tenants in very bad situations, to whom my heart goes out - the OP is not one of them, she is a pisstaker, pure and simple

Then we disagree.

I have followed up with Shelter and my local authority and have confirmed that @AmandaBrotzman and @rainingsnoring are both absolutely right (and I’m grateful to you both for the information).

The law is clear. A section 21 notice does not mean I have to move out. The tenancy can only be ended by me as the tenant or by court order. So if I don’t move out by the end of the month she can apply for a court order to evict me. Which will take about 6 weeks, by which time I’ll have moved out. Also the courts would take a dim view of the application to evict because I have offered to move out 4 weeks free he would like.

I will be writing back to landlord expressing my disappointment that he won’t consider my reasonable offer to move out by end April, and also notifying him that I will move it on 30th April unless ordered to do so by the court.

I am not prepared to incur thousands of pounds in extra temporary rental costs by moving out to their timeframe, particularly when the law says I don’t have to.

Thanks all for your advice.

You don't have to move out, but taking that tone with the landlord kind of re-asserts my opinion that you are taking the p.

You are disappointed that he won't just roll over and go along with you wanting to stay longer, because of course he has no obligations.

I hope he finds good grounds to keep your deposit!!

Do we? sorry who are you?

It’s not about paying the mortgage ffs. It’s about paying for a product or service

@DeftWasp - thank you for your helpful contributions.

If he wants to keep any of my deposit he will have to find good reason and evidence it since it’s held by a third-party under a deposit protection scheme.

im puzzled why you seem so personally pissed off by this - im only following the law and using the legal protections available to tenants against unscrupulous landlords. Are you an unscrupulous landlord?

we are landlords ourselves and we’ve just made application to court to evict someone. My advice would be have the conversation with landlord. It could be that he still advertises it in the meantime. But 4 weeks is doable I would stay if I was you. By the time landlord makes application to court the 4 weeks would be up anyway

You are using the law, when you don't have to, you are not skint, being pushed out by a slum landlord facing sleeping on the streets.

You have had a reasonable request and notice, but seem mortally offended and think this landlord is dreadful for simply following the rules.

It seems he has played it by the book, been courteous and businesslike, and yet you are determined to mess him around, when you don't have to.

You are a rogue tenant.

I am a landlord, not a rogue one, my tenants have been in situ since 1996, and long may they stay.

And yes, your landlord will apply to the court, because he will have no idea whether you will go after 4 weeks or not, he won't trust you so will start proceedings.

No I’m not a rogue tenant at all. I’m perfectly within my rights. Look it up. You can’t be that good a landlord if you can’t understand the law @DeftWasp

Hmm, maybe you’re my landlord @DeftWasp 🤔