New kitchen…do’s and don’ts?

[Barrenfieldoffucks]

We are finally going to get the kitchen done. The extension was completed around 5 years ago, and has had a £50 second hand kitchen patched together in there ever since.

I have been though on the DIY kitchens planner and pieced together some ideas, and have Howdens and Magnet giving me a plan too. We will probably do most of the fitting ourselves.

What I’m hoping for from this thread is any do’s and don’t s from those who have done one recently…any things you wish you’d thought of, or things you’ve since discovered don’t work or don’t get used. Layout pitfalls etc. Companies to avoid. Where we live DIY kitchens will cost around £500 to deliver, which is worth it if considerably better quality or price. I’m aware they deliver ‘built’ units which is good.

I’ve attached both the plan i put together, along with Magnet’s suggestion.

Our biggest ‘hold back’ is that we have lots of doors and windows to work around. It is like an upside down L-Shaped room, with the kitchen in the Warner…dining area at one end of the L and sofa, etc at the other.

We have an American fridge freezer which would cause mutiny if I tried to get rid of it as the ice machine is the most popular member of the family, and want eye level ovens and an induction hob. Need space for the coffee machine and air fryer, again used multiple times a day. Other large appliances can live in a cupboard or drawer really.

The Island is used massively, so is wanted. We have a separate utility so no need to incorporate laundry things.

Ceilings are 2.45m high so could take either extra tall or standard runs of cupboards.

The various runs are: approx 4,45m down the left hand side (from the corner to the french doors, shown with tall units in the images), and approx 5,10m from the corner along under the window to the bifolds. Current island is around 2m long by 1m wide.

My one regret is having the sink draining area cut into our quartz work surface rather than a metal draining area stretched to the sink ( sorry, no idea what the right words are!). It ends up looking grubby, it's not so easy to clean and the drip water tends to end up on the work surface rather than draining away into the sink.

Full height pull out larder cupboard is so convenient, no struggling to reach the back of a cupboard.
Ditto drawers as well as storage cupboards, particularly for heavy items
We used Howden's, very satisfied

An inset sink as against an undermount one? I know exactly what you mean, I’d bee thinking of the former for the exact same reason. I had been wondering about a Belfast sink, but not convinced.

Agreed on drawers,I’ve used them throughout the plans. Pushes the cost up but much more useful. Also yes to a larder, we have one currently and definitely want a better version. There’s one in each plan but the location is undecided as yet.

The Magnet plan is looking a little better so far and their pricing seems ok, I’ve had the plan but not the cost from Howdens but will see.

Get the best appliances you can afford. Love drawers, best things ever. Two full sized ovens, my mum has an oven/microwave combo and it’s awful and such a faff to microwave anything. Dark coloured sink - ours is some sort of composite material… not sure what without trawling back through emails… it’s a lot of decisions but so lovely when it all comes together!

Definitely more drawers than you think you need!

We have a DIY kitchen. It's only been in for a year so can't really vouch for longevity but I love it. Ours is the Helmsley so is wooden and inframe. Howdens couldn't price match. Their best price was 3 grand more. Although howdens pricing is so opaque so goodness knows how they price it up. Downside is that if you forget something or need a replacement It's not as easy as nipping down the road to Howdens. Was still all fairly straightforward though. Just make sure you plan it to arrive well before fitters are booked in.

Both designs look quite similar. Personally I wouldn't have open shelves on the wall because my kitchen attracts dust and the early morning sunshine seems to put a bloody spotlight on it!

No to a pale coloured composite sink as they can stain. No also to the undermount. I've got one and it's sagging on one corner where the clips have failed. I've got stainless steel now and it's a bugger to keep clean. I would love a butler sink when I get my kitchen redone.

Have the designs got the oven right next to the fridge freezer? I thought that was a no-no due to the heat from the oven warming the fridge freezer? Maybe I'm wrong on that so don't quote me.

If you have a utility, can you put a microwave in there and go for two full sized ovens? We have two and it's awesome. Even if one is basically a dedicated yorkshire pudding oven. But is worth it.

If you're going for wooden worktops definitely choose carefully with the sink. We have a double Belfast which I absolutely love but we (well, the kids mainly) get sooooo much water round the sink and tap area. We've got quartz but wood wouldn't handle the constant water well.

There was a very long thread years ago that had tons of tips and I’ve used them in two kitchens now!

I think your layouts look good. I’d consider having a slightly deeper island and putting the induction hob on it. You can get a pop up extractor fan built in behind it which sorts out splashes and cooking smells. I find that this layout is really sociable and I can chat to whoever is in the kitchen while I cook.

We’ve got a double sink and use one of the sinks as a drainer. The draining board lives in there so can be taken out if we need to use the sink as a sink. Keeps the surfaces clearer.

We have wall mounted ovens, the top one being a microwave/oven combination and haven’t had any problem with it. It’s a nice space saver IMO.

Our wall cupboards have frosted glass doors and lights inside which works quite well and breaks up the block of colour.

For flooring, my top tip is to choose something crumb coloured. We had a smart dark brown floor for a while and it was a nightmare for revealing every crumb.

I need the wall cupboard doors to align with the base unit drawers / doors or it drives me mad! So many kitchen designers don’t do this.

Have you got a local company who would do you something more bespoke? Our local kitchen company built units to size including an oddly shaped alcove and a special corner cupboard to hide the fuses. Including fitting, it came in 3000 less than Wren. That also included the cupboards going all the way to the ceiling which I highly recommend. Avoids random crap on top of cupboards and Christmas things and other rarely used bits and bobs live on the very top shelves.

Make sure your plug sockets have enough space below them to plug in large charger plugs. We have a quartz splashback and there is not enough space to plug in some larger plugs
make sure your wall cupboards go up to the ceiling to avoid dust traps.
Have the largest sink you can if you wash a lot of pots.
Our microwave is above the oven and is also a 2nd oven.Although I like the 2nd oven aspect it is quite high up when you’re taking out hot dishes.
We have a gas 5 burner hob with one ring for a wok/ big pan. Personally I wish I had installed the hob 6 inches below the work surface as when I put a big pot on the wok burner it is too high to stir.
Drawers are fab
I have a treble width floor to ceiling larder cupboard. Best thing ever for hiding clutter.

We recently downsized and have a much smaller kitchen than those we've had previously, but didn't want to sacrifice the following - as many deep drawers as possible, huge sink (ours is a Belfast and we always chose a double before, but this time I wanted one huge sink. We went for an enormous Whitebirk which I love!), integrated dishwasher, pull-out bins.

Choose decent quality handles and taps etc - the things you touch frequently should be the best quality you can afford. I love our tap so much - and it's no longer available - that we removed and replaced it before marketing our last house as I was determined to have it in my new kitchen! We're getting a mix of deVOL and Corston handles/knobs to elevate the overall look.

I have just had my builders fit two kitchens in a development project so I am completely up to speed with kitchens I wanted high end and both had to be solid wood painted and granite worktops.

Much will depend on budget I fell in love with Tom Howley but bottom line riled them out.

Magnet, Howdens, Wren etc etc etc are awful quality, I would never use them.

DIY kitchens fabulous showroom however their design software is shocking and that was the reason I didn’t buy from them. I even looked into paying a designer to do that element.

Look at Used Kitchen Hub and Rehome - my two kitchens came from them, both are second hand and I sourced Miele appliances.

Agree with @Wowthatwasabigstep re: preloved bargains. We bought our last kitchen from Handmade Kitchens of Christchurch and the two previous ones we got from an independent design studio. All were solid wood, in-frame, painted. I wanted the same quality here, but we're on a tight budget as we might sell once the renovations are complete. So I sourced second hand oak in-frame cabinets online which I'm repainting. Cost a few hundred £££, but look fab!

We've got a speckled white worktop. It's the only thing I regret about our new kitchen because you can't see any crumbs, which makes it difficult to keep clean.

I'm also a fan of drawers - especially under the sink. I also have large drawers under a work surface & keep baking tins etc in one and my pans etc in another. So much easier to find everything than kneeling/bending down and rootling around in the depths of a cupboard.

I love:
My big sink. Everyone told me to get it divided but it’s so easy to use a basin when I need a split. (I keep a folding camping one under the sink) but I can soak a roasting pan in mine, hide the pots and pans, wash the fridge or oven racks. Love love love it.

My kitchen sink is white ceramic. Everyone said it would be a nightmare to keep clean but it’s the easiest thing ever.

Pull out drawers under the counter. I can see everything! No hidden corners. Also pull out pantry shelves do I can easily put away newer jars and cans behind older ones without ever playing jenga.

My full size side by side fridge and freezer. American fridges are beautiful but I need capacity.

My appliance garage. I was doubtful but dh wanted it - it holds the most often used appliances and has lovely pocket doors that fold in on themselves. I love how instantly functional but also uncluttered the kitchen is.

My chest height dishwasher. I’d give up an eye level oven for this beauty, because it has eliminated a million bends a day, whereas the oven is only turned on once a day. The kitchen designer and plumber nearly had heart attacks over this but it is wonderful. I read about this on another kitchen thread and I was beginning to wonder if that poster had made it up because they were insisting that the plumbing wouldn’t work and the door couldn’t be integrated without a big gap under. It turns out that Bosch do a model of dishwasher just for this.

Hob on the island. Not for everyone but I love how social cooking is now. The dc sit up and do homework or chat or chop things, guests hang out in the kitchen more, and I’m not stood with my back to everyone.

I love how we clustered work zones. I completely ignored the work triangle and organised by key jobs - dishwasher (beside bin, sink, and the plate cupboard. Food prep- I can swivel to reach the fridge, pantry, counter, bin, sink. Cooking- a safe place to land hot oven trays, hob with utensils, herbs and oils in easy reach.

I put a huge amount of thought into lighting, the placement of sockets and how to group switches. My electrician was a bit bemused because most people aren’t usually so specific and he felt there was a “right way” to order things. But my way is intuitive to me. He was won round though because he asked me a couple of months later if he could bring an apprentice over to show him the kitchen

I do not love
my utility room sink. It’s stainless steel but a really low quality steel that is actually stainful. Fortunately it’s out of sight but it irritates me because stainless steel should be very low maintenance. Do ask questions if you opt for it in your kitchen.

The carousel corner press. It seemed so neat in the showroom, but I didn’t give much thought to what might take up residence in the unreachable back corner and under the carousel. Considering nailing it shut.

Amtico floor - the fitter was a complete knob, Held up everything for three days getting the levels perfect. And the floor is still wonky. I didn’t know you shouldn’t use rubber backed mats (what other kind are there?) and the section inside the back door have turned orange, But they won’t replace them because apparently we should have known this, and should have ordered extra spare tiles in case of problems. I’d rather save up for a whole new floor than give those idiots another penny,

Mixed feelings:
The concept of pull out bins is good but the ones we have are badly designed and dirt gets stuck in them. It’s an irritating extra job to scrape out that shouldn’t be necessary. I like not looking at a bin, or trying to find floor space for it, but I should have got a kick to open door, because I’m always getting the handle grubby.

I raised the counter height by 4 inches either side of my sink and this really bugs a lot of people. My reasoning is that you end up stooping into the sink but I don’t use my sink as much as I imagined I would, and it has been a weirdly controversial talking point ever since. I probably wouldn’t do it if I had my time again,

The silestone calcatta gold worktop is a thing of beauty but I wish I’d chosen something a little less precious. They made such a sales point out of it being stain resistant but it’s only supposed to be cleaned with water (wtf) so it’s discoloured around the sink from the fairy liquid in the water drops. And you can’t put anything hot down on it. It looks good but my old Formica counter was a workhouse by comparison.

Bit daft:
Paying extra for the inside of cupboards to match the outsides. It’s not really something you ever notice.

Drawer dividers - stupid expense for something that actually restricts functionality. Wish I’d just got a bunch of plastic ones and I could have arranged it all better.

Wine fridge - menopause was lurking round the corner. Why did no one ever warn me that my alcohol tolerance could plummet and I’d feel hungover before I’d even get down to the bottom of the glass?

Neff slide and hide oven door. I don’t know why this seemed like a good idea. It lets too much heat out. I was watching my dsis with her ordinary oven door, lift out a roast, and knock the door closed with her elbow, and I realised I’m a bit gullible when it comes to nifty gadgets.

The Lessons Learned Kitchen Thread

We just had kitchen done and the biggest irritant for me is the sink.

I originally wanted it so that the bowl would be on my right hand side and the drainer on my left hand side. The fitters said thats wrong and most people would put the drainer to the right (despite every house I ever lived in having a left hand drainer). They ended up switching it and its a bloody nightmare.

We also wanted a 1.5 bowl sink but because the changed the direction over the cabinet join to a left hand sink they could only fit a 1 bowl sink.

You can't turn on the tap without having to reach over everything on the drainer, the tap turns on by pulling towards the drainer too. I ended up stabbing myself on a bread knife and constantly have to move things just to get access to turn the tap on and off. Never once had these issues with a left hand drainer. Its the one thing that literally effects the kitchens use every single day.

We have corston sockets and switches. The old fashioned toggle switches. They are beeeeeeeeeautiful. 😍 I'd definitely agree quality knobs and handles make a difference. Ditto quality worktops. I really think the best worktop you can afford helps to elevate it and also helps it age better.

I wouldn’t be without my Quooker boiling water tap. Also measure your vacuum. I changed mine from an upright to a Henry and he’s too fat to fit in!

We've just had a magnet kitchen installed, by our own fitter.

We have a normal oven, with a combi microwave oven and as its a small kitchen its a good space saver and seems to work well. I had not heard of one before.

I specifically wanted an oven with a defrost setting but magnet didn't provide one and I am currently in dispute with them over this.

They also recommended acrylic worktops, which we dont like as it scratches/marks easily but can be buffed back out with fine sandpaper and a buffing clothing, or something like bar keepers friend or cif cream.

Dw wanted a belfast sink, which is too big for what we need and we have had to buy a liner for the bottom and a bowl to wash up in as it also marks easily.

We are however overall pleased with the quality of the magnet stuff, and we had AEG appliances as they were on offer. I price checked them with AO and currys and they were cheaper through magnet with their promotion. Its very, very new tho, so time will tell how long it lasts and how well the warranties will work.

Howdens couldnt match them on price, even with our fitter's trade discount, and using the discount of someone we know who worked at howdens. Our fitter said he much preferred using magnet for kitchens anyway as the quality was better than howdens. They also supplied all the units pre-built.

I tried to get a price with DIY kitchens but couldnt get the design right and found the design tool on the website difficult to use.

I wouldn't touch Wren as I know 2 people who had serious issues with them, but others seem happy with them.

I think a lot of the outcomes with places like howden/magnet/wren is down to luck, it either comes good or it doesnt. This isn't obviously right, but often how it is with the big chains. We did have an independent kitchen company design and quote for us, but they were over £7,000 dearer than magnet for similar stuff.

Didn’t fit the kitchen I currently have but it has glass worktops, which I now love. Really don’t stain, totally heat proof so you can put pans down anywhere, easy to clean, you can have whatever colour you want and looks good.

Also we had a glass splashback behind the hob. So much better than our previous tiles, especially to clean and looks great.