I can’t believe my solicitor did this

[TipsyPeachSnake]

So I accepted an offer on a terraced house which I bought over 10 years ago. Double glazing was put in back then, similar to others on the street. However, it has now come to light that the house is a listed building and there is no listed building consent.

I could purchase indemnity insurance to cover this for buyer but have found out that my solicitor contacted the council asking for retrospective LBC!!

Because of the actions of my solicitor the council have been made aware of unauthorised work on the property which could potentially lead to significant penalties and loss of sale.

I’m shocked a solicitor acting on my behalf would do this. What can I do? Anyone had similar experience? Please, any advice would be appreciated.

Please read OP’s posts more carefully. She bought it with uPVC windows and replaced it with “wood type”.

I have learnt the hard way that solicitors will put their own professional safety and interests first and not those of their client. They are risk averse and will ensure nothing comes back to haunt them even if it means the client has to take a financial hit . Before anyone screams “ well duh” I know it makes sense , but people need to realise solicitors’ representation of their clients’ interests only goes so far.

I don’t think anyone is going to scream ‘well duh’ because your comment makes sense…. It’s more likely the trainee’s actions have caused themselves or the firm damage.

This is a very similar situation to one my friend found a year or so back.

The survey pulled up that unconsented works had been done on a listed building. The sellers said "oh, no need to worry, no one will mind" at first. Then as she looked further into it with her solicitors, they got stroppier and stroppier and were trying to push the sale through.
Then she phoned her insurance to see what the situation could be, and the insurance company refused to insure - also saying that if she didn't tell an insurance company after the survey/solicitors had made her aware that she could find that she was uninsured.

She pulled out and subsequently got nasty messages from the sellers telling her she was ridiculous and still trying to push her to buy.
But from her point of view, it was right for the solicitors to tell her, and, because the buyers had no intention of doing anything, she was glad they did (even if it was stressful at the time).

I'm not convinced from the Op's side that if she'd been made aware of it and told what she needed to do, she would have had any intention of informing the council.

Good luck

If you live somewhere for 10+ years without knowing it was listed and hadn't bothered to get consent to get windows done yet had apparently taken great care and expense to have them changed from upvc to wooden frames you should be kicking yourself not your solicitor if you thought that wasn't going to hold up the sale.

Our solicitor also made contact. We got a letter from the council basically saying it was unnecessary and the buyers and their solicitor were happy enough with that to proceed. Worth a try!

As others have said, solicitors should only act on your instructions. If they had advised you that they would need to do x, they should have informed you of this and then if you still said no, set out the implications of doing so (eg if they’d have had to withdraw).

The solicitors should have a claims process so ask for details of that.

I’m quite surprised you didn’t see that the house was listed when you bought it. That’s on you, frankly. Yes, your solicitor should have mentioned it - whenever I’ve bought a house, my solicitor sits down with me and goes through all the paperwork. But he’s a family solicitor and I pay him well for the service.

And if you put uPVC windows in an old house - listed or not - that’s pretty awful. With a listed building, it’s unconscionable.

But she didn't put upvc windows in. She said she replaced the upvc with timber windows!

For what it’s worth I managed to get retroactive listed building consent for a change on a property I was looking at but didn’t end up purchasing (they had also violated fire regs and that wasn’t fixable) within two weeks by emailing the council and confirming they had no problem with it. It was a relatively minor thing but the underlying point is that this may not be as crazy a thing to do as you think.

Ooops sorry - sincere apologies I was reading too quickly.

But I still find it odd that in purchasing and living in a house the OP had not clocked its listed status. The last but one house I bought was listed and its Grade 2 status was everywhere in the paperwork.

As long as the timber window frames are in keeping with the house and the area, it’s likely that retrospective consent will be granted. But it is annoying to have the sales process interrupted like this. It’s good your solicitors are onto it in terms of their processes and practices.

op doing the work before you moved in is neither here nor there if you owned the property and you commissioned the work. You aren't always told every detail verbally and you would need to refer to your paper work to see is if you was told. As for indemnity insurance, this is usually for when there is no paper trail for the work in question however as you did the work and you are selling more then likely the buyers solicitor wouldn't have accepted an indemnity and may have asked your solicitor to check with the council . I would say your best bet is to speak to your actual solicitor .

That doesn’t make any sense (at least the conclusion doesn’t). A solicitor must act according to instructions and the OP will probably be making a complaint. The solicitor has no obligation to inform the council. Therefore the risk averse option is not to inform the council.

Solicitor surely should have let you know first. But once you were aware the solicitor couldn't have then proceeded knowing it was a LB and that no consent was gained for the window installation. The solicitor is acting in your interests. The other sides solicitor would no doubt have raised the LB status and window issue - no getting away from it. Also if windows were fitted they also need to comply with building regs and have installation certificates.

When you bought the house you should have been informed it was a LB - it would come up in the solicitors searches so you would have had this in writing. If you were not informed then you have a case against your previous solicitors for negligence - thats what searches are for. But it sounds like you were aware. So the fitting of the windows without council permission is on you. It will be best to sort that out now. If non-traditional windows were in place already I presume you still have evidence of that from your house purcahse docs? So did the previous vendor have the required permission? If not your solicitor for the purchase may have been negligent.

Either way it all needs sorting out now and best do that properly.

I was relieved to read this post, because when we threw ourselves on the mercy of the council inspector having ignorantly committed a criminal offence in replacing a wall that a previous owner had taken out (only he wasn't the kind to give a proverbial about permission, retrospective or otherwise) - anyway, the nice inspector said it was an improvement so he wouldn't be taking action only don't do it again.

If your new windows were demonstrably more in keeping with the character of the property than the old ones I imagine the response will be similar.

But acting without instruction from you was bang out of order. I don't suppose the trainee will be sitting down for a few days.

Your solicitor should not have acted without your instructions. That's grounds for a law society complaint.
what kind of windows did you put in? Makes a difference because you won't get consent for PVC

The estate agent you bought the property through had a duty to disclose the fact that it was listed as this could have affected your decision to buy. Also your solicitor at the time should have raised this and made you aware. As others have said, ignorance is no defence and regardless of when the works were done, the present owner, namely yourself, is liable for any remedial works. I would also check any other changes you have made as when we purchased a listed building and put a planning and listed building consent application in, we were told that everything inside and outside the property was listed.

I was thinking more in terms of their professional registration, compliance with planning regulation etc.

We applied for LBC to get our double glazing done, and when they granted it they said the only reason to approve the double glazing was because someone had installed double glazing prior to the listing. They were quite clear that although not in keeping it had precedent, and they required a very thin spec. I wouldn't be at all surprised if you didn't received retrospective LBC, and as it's a criminal offence to make listed building alterations without LBC, I doubt your solicitor had a choice on reporting it. Maybe with some grovelling it might be ok!

What were the windows when the property was originally listed?
It sounds to me that the original (as at listing date) windows were replaced with uPVC at an unspecified date likely 20+ years ago, then OP upgraded these 10 years ago. I doubt that the council conservation officer would contest anything.

However, there will be a delay to the sale. I assume her solicitors will be amenable to chipping in for the costs of the delay as its their fault and it'd be cheaper to them if they would come to agreement with OP.

So if it were me, I'd go in with the "I believe your error will cost me xyz each month the sale is delayed, and reduce my property value by x%. Therefore I expect recompense of $A% of propertyas valued by surveyor, then a further $xyz until transaction completes".

Maybe speak to the buyer. If the issue is confined to the windows and he is going to replace anyway, he might be willing to comply to whatever comes to the surface.

I would chat to him.

I think this is wishful thinking OP. They most certainly are arsed about listed buildings.

I live in a LB. We even need permission for a new boiler. Something to do with the flue. My neighbour had PVC windows installed by the previous owner many years earlier. He had to replace them with single glazed wooden ones.

your solicitor should not have done this without your instructions.

I am a solicitor and would never have done this, its is really shit tbh

When did you become aware that your house was listed?