Does anyone actually know what the property tax is rumoured to be?

[kirinm]

I’ve read a few bits and pieces and all I’ve gathered so far is they may get rid of stamp duty (a good thing for me personally) but then bring in other taxes which might include a general property tax and / or capital gains?

For buyers, surely the change is a positive one unless I’m missing something?

(Stamp duty on our current purchase is nearly £60k so if we somehow manage to avoid it, that would be brilliant).

People were suggesting that you lived in central London. I waas demonstrating that, as you mentioned, there are plenty of very less desirable areas where terraced houses do indeed cost £1 million.

@Another2Cats your sums are not correct based on your assumed figures.

I’m now in my late 60s and have lived in my house for over 35 years. We were thinking of downsizing and moving closer to DS and partner to help if/when they have children. They will need childcare.

If the CGT gain on selling my home goes back to the 1989 purchase price we cannot afford to move. We will be here in a too big house until death.

we no longer have all the paperwork of allowable expenses to offset CGT gains from work done. They weren’t needed as we didn’t have to think about CGT. It would really penalise people who have built a long term home, rather than those who have traded houses every few years.

You would deduct the cost of those, just like you do now for houses that do qualify for CGT. Capital improvements get deducted from any gain.

@Witchlitemakes a good point about proving those costs, but if they did introduce CGT on primary residences, they’d have to implement a system where reasonable estimates for work that took place a while ago are acceptable.

@DrySherrythey do have a choice! They don’t need to go after property! They have many other revenue streams, including reforming the welfare state and taxing the wealthy properly.

@Yachtiesand @Haribomum7totally agree with you both! It’s insanity what this government is doing!

We are the same - if they tax us selling our family home we will have no alternative but to just stay here .

I believe the idea is to smooth out the inequality between those with large property ownerships who need to move regularly vs those who don't. Two people of broadly equal wealth and incone currently pay very different anounts of tax over 20 years if one was able to stay put throughout and the othet had to move house 3-4 times. The changes are supposed to make it fairer but the people who never move will see it as a huge injustice.

Agree with those suggestions, that would be ideal. But this thread is about what has been leaked as actually being considered. In reality reforming the welfare state and heavily taxing the wealthy are unfortunately much harder than targeting individual property wealth. Rachel and Co can reach the property fruit with ease unfortunately.

@DrySherry ,

Going after the wealthy means going after capital rather than income, including property wealth.

The truly wealthy can choose between capital gains and income very easily. And they will certainly buy massive primary residences whilst they remain so tax efficient.

Going after the wealthy means going after capital rather than income, including property wealth.

Quite

@NewbutoldfatherIve heard rumours certain tax reforms would be on property over £2 million, which would make more sense! However, I do think the current rhetoric sends a negative message about striving for more! The welfare system needs MASSIVE overhaul! We need to incentivise people to work! For every person who does need welfare helo there are many that take advantage!

Why do you think a property tax is 'insanity' @overwhelmedsinglema? Are you able to articulate why you are so against it? Do you think it is more insane than the current situation where the younger generations are completely priced out of owning property?

The government really does not have a lot of potential income streams, which is one of their major problems as they have a huge deficit. They have made a promise not to increase income tax, which they may break, but would face considerable criticism if they did. Taxing property is taxing wealth, at least for many people and that seems to be what you advocate.
As regards cutting the welfare bill, there is a limited amount that they can do unless the economy collapse and then they will be forced to do this. I've said this on here before but the amount of drama that was made over the small, proposed cuts to the WFA, showed how people will scream and scream if they try to do this. Can you imagine if they announce they are removing the triple lock? They already tried to reduce benefits, which I agree they should do, but that also created drama and many MPs voted against it. I think a government will be forced to do this but they won't choose to do so because they can't.

Why do you think a property tax rather than stamp duty discourages people from striving? High rates of income tax do, especially over 100k but most of the property gains in the UK are unearned, so didn't involve much striving at all.

@rainingsnoringi agree with you! I think it’s insanity they backtracked on their welfare reforms, they should have carried on with them. They can’t just keep giving out without getting much back.

I am perfectly for the government to tax the mega wealthy on their assets, such as property! But not the average middle earning family who have done well and got a semi decent house! It will feed into the rhetoric that actually don’t bother wanting to do better for yourself, as the government will penalise you for doing better! I’m a single parent and surrounded by many on crazy amounts of benefits, their way of thinking is ‘I won’t look for a promotion’. Or ‘I won’t look earn more’ as I will have my benefits cut! These aren’t made up people these are people that I know, that earn a substantial amount when their benefits are added up. The government needs to stop penalising the stretched middle and take for the super rich and radically overhaul the welfare state!

@rainingsnoringwith all due respect many people I know earning over £100k live in very nice houses!

I can 💯 guarantee that will never happen! It would be political suicide 😂

But people won’t have the paperwork to prove deductible expenses after 30 years etc.

But people won’t have the paperwork to prove deductible expenses after 30 years etc.

What happens now?

Maybe….. but they could potentially introduce a tax with a high threshold that would only affect a small number of (very wealthy) people. Properties worth more than 5m for example, like a mansion tax. The issue with the plan is it won’t raise much money!

Whatever it is I hope it can bring prices down.

@MO0Nbut I don’t understand this logic? Many people will have brought their property at the higher end of the market. And unless they really have to, would never sell their property at a loss. Similarly, it costs a lot to build property… developers build houses to make profit! What we need is wages to go up, so that we can afford the higher property prices!

Exactly. Theres no point unless they are taxing the wealthy-ish (often retired) homeowners who own majority of higher value housing stock. And they are the very voters no political party dares to upset!

Yeah, it would certainly be an issue for the asset rich (relatively) low income retirees if they bought it in at a more meaningful level like 1m+, which would obviously catch a lot of homes in the SE. As you say, that feels politically untenable.

Theres no point unless they are taxing the wealthy-ish (often retired) homeowners who own majority of higher value housing stock. And they are the very voters no political party dares to upset!

True.

The triple lock should absolutely be paused for a bit but as @rainingsnoring the cries over winter fuel were ridiculous.