Why are building regs so important if??

[Mumofsonanddogs]

Love mumsnet but never posted before
I am interested to hear peoples experiences of buying a property with a loft conversion that has no building regs
Back story: my son and his girlfriend viewed there dream next home, not expensive, ex council etc it was perfect, ready to move into, it was advertised as a 2 bed as the 3rd bedroom in the loft does not have a building regs certificate it also had a single storey extension, (I don't know wether this had building regs) the owner is a builder and has done the work himself, anyway they missed out on the house as the owner had the choice between two offers and I think the others may have been first time buyers
I am gutted for them and I keep trying to justify the loss by telling people " oh well it didn't have building regs etc" just for them to say well it doesn't matter because it's only advertised as a 2 bed, if this is correct what is the actual point of building regs?

The point is to confirm that it was not done illegally, that the council and/or water company won’t come later and tell you to remove your extension because it’s been built over pipes that should not have been built over or that it poses a safety risk. It’s also to confirm that your loft won’t crash on your head, etc.

Building regs give both the owner and any potential future buyer confidence. Without it you are relying on trust. Selling a property without really narrows the potential pool of customers.

And if God forbid there's a terrible accident involving the extension that no one checked was safe/fireproof/properly wired in, insurers can refuse to pay out. That's if you can get a policy in the first place.

Saying "it's only advertised as a 2 bed" only makes sense if you're planning on only using it as a two bed. If you're going to treat the loft as a third bedroom then you'd want it to comply with building regs to ensure it's safe.

My DH is also a builder and we would always get building regs for major changes, it adds value to the house and saves this trouble when you come to selling the property. So I would wonder why the builder chose not to. My guess is that the builder chose to cut corners and the building may be structurally unsafe.

Thank you X my thought is he didn't think he was going to move, so it didn't matter?

Thank you x

Frankly OP it is not unusual in older properties not to have all the documentation in place, simply because the rules might have been different then or the council no longer have the paperwork now that records are digitalised.

I was trying to get details of work that was done on a my loft on a period property decades ago, not an actual conversation for it to be used as a room but one of the owners added some storage and boards, The council told me they did not kept records from that far back and no paperwork was passed on over the decades.

Not much I can do about it.

If it had building regs then it would be marketed as a 3 bed property and would be more expensive than a 2 bed. The sellers have probably lost out on thousands of pounds by not getting them.

The country is obsessed with regulation, especially when it comes to housing. This is why we build twice less houses than other developed countries.

My house is an 1890 terrace with a large loft with high ceilings. No building regs. The whole street is similar, in fact probably most of the village. No one cares about building regs, the lofts have been in use for a long time. They’re advertised as loft rooms and doing a building regs conversion would cost more than you’d get advertising it as a bedroom.

Building regs provide a standard that works need to be done to. With a loft conversion these standards are primarily threefold - structurally it makes sure that the work you’re doing won’t make the roof collapse and the top floor can support the weight of new living space up there, insulation wise it makes sure that the space is habitable during the winter and summer and you’re not going to overly consume fossil fuels trying to heat an uninsulated space, and finally with fire safety it ensures that there is a clear and protected exit route in the event that there is a fire - which is why the newer regs say that you have to put in fire doors or a sprinkler system when you’re creating habitable space on an additional floor.

None of these requirements are bad things. If you’ve got a loft conversion without building regs then the best case scenario is that it won’t be comfortable to live in (if it doesn’t meet insulation standards). Worst case is that it’s unsafe; either structurally or in terms of fire safety. This is why you can’t advertise the property with an additional bedroom; you’d potentially be putting someone at risk as it’s not considered habitable space. There are absolutely older properties with old loft conversion without building regs (or that can’t be demonstrated) - we own one. It’s then up to the individual’s assessment or appetite for risk and/or assessment of the quality and safety of the conversion as to whether they use it or not.

A man died in a fire, trapped in a loft conversion which didn't conform to fire regulations, not half a mile from my home. So I would never use a loft without building regs as a bedroom.

As long as an non habitable room is not sold as a bedroom it is fine for valuation purposes. How the owner chooses to use it is up to them. We have a loft room without br, but the access stairs do and it was built at same time as the house. So it might have met requirements 25 years ago but probably would not now. We have used it as an occasional bedroom but mainly playroom/storage.

Thanks for taking the time to comment, this is a bit different as it's very recent conversion x

If it’s recent (like last 15 years) not having Building Regs is a massive red flag about whether the work has been done properly and safely. Loft conversions need to be done carefully due to fire risk and escape/ease of access and ceiling height, insulation and damp, roof structure (which impacts the entire building structure), electrical and gas work for safety needs to be certified as well.

I think the seller could try and get them retrospectively? Else pay for an indemnity insurance policy?

Building regs aren't a guarantee of good work but at least they say something.

Given the penchant of people these days to smash down walls or haul tons of stuff into the loft to build extra rooms I would want some sort of guarantee it is done properly and not on the cheap or improperly supported.

Or else your whole house is at risk of collapse. Or could become a death trap through safety issues.

And then there is the additional issue that if you want to sell it, you might run up against the same problems.

That’s no bad thing. An entire apartment block collapsed in the US a couple of years ago, due to lax regulations. Closer adherence to regulations would have prevented Grenfell.

You are totally wrong. Building regs don’t stop people building houses! What a fatuous comment. Building regs stop people building dangerously unsafe houses - and you have an issue with that?

peoples homes collapse because some idiot has undermined the foundations of a house next door to make a basement without building regs.

uk building is already bizarrely unregulated. Standards are already poor, so it’s a thin line that stops totally lethal buildings being signed off. The U.K. reeds more regulation for batter standards, not less. Jesus.

I don't recall any Grenfell type disasters in Europe in recent memory. Building regs and other layers of red tape only serve peculiar interest groups with lucrative related businesses. The country's housing stock is the oldest and shoddiest of the continent as new build cost is among the highest in the world. No wonder our youth can't afford to own a house.

European countries also have building regulations, you know. Examples below.

Building regs in Germany - overview in English. https://www.dibt.de/en/we-offer/technical-building-rules

And the Netherlands. https://business.gov.nl/regulation/rules-for-construction/

This.

There are tons of amendments and changes that occur to properties over the decades, if the house hasnt fallen down or roof fallen in from some unregulated loft conversion that took place 20 or 30 years ago, odds are, its fine.