Too late for upgraded house move?

[Cortisolina]

I’m 48, DH is mid-50s but in that classic London way, we had DC quite late. We have one early teen DC and a late primary DC.

I realise we are hugely fortunate and privileged to own a house but I’m afraid it doesn’t stop me feeling meh and that we should have taken more risks and traded up when we had the chance.

This isn’t the house I dreamed of when I was growing up and I can’t help kicking myself that we didn’t upsize areas and house when we had the time and possibly finances (and low interest rates!) to do so.

When I read other threads on here, it seems people just a couple of years older than me are downsizing. Meanwhile many friends have just finished wonderful renovations or have moved to lovely homes (thanks sadly to inheritances or rapid promotions).

We are probably now too old to upgrade, DC would be hit with IHT before long and that makes me feel a bit depressed.

There are no real excuses except that we waited too long, were vaguely satisfied and we skipped the small house stage to move straight to a medium sized house. We prioritised paying off a mortgage (STUPID move).

Pros of staying in our house:
We have always liked our area and street - super transport links, beautiful housing stock, nice neighbours, park within easy walking distance.
Prices are high as it’s London but for the size and proximity to Zone 1, they’re cheaper than comparable areas.
Easy commute for one DC school, just about bearable for other.
Commutable to potential workplaces.
Close to good areas.
Nothing bad structurally.
Nice period features.
No extra mortgage

Cons of staying put:
I’m bored of our house. We have lived here for the best part of 20 years! We could redecorate but don’t think this would fix the things that I want to change - more living space, wider footprint, bigger garden. Can’t extend further and not worth it.
No offstreet parking.
Slower capital growth as it is worth less than more ‘known’ areas.
Feels less safe than area I would want to move to.
If we ‘upsize’ value wise now, it might give us more options when we retire in a decade and can sell a more valuable property.
On the other hand, if AI continues to wipe out professional jobs and if governments continue to deter well off foreigners, there won’t be anyone to sell the more expensive house to.
DC will still be at home for 6-8 more years.

I have always eyed a more expensive area that isn’t as conveniently located but is more leafy.

I know we should count our blessings but I hate feeling like is this as good as it gets. It’s definitely a head over heart hormonal rant and I apologise in advance to those who can only dream of being homeowners in this messed up economy.

Funny you should say that.

My DD had wheezing as a small child and her lips went blue. My next door neighbour was a friend and our GP. It's the only time in over 30 years we ever called on him. We felt helpless so far away from help.

My DD is 30 now so that was pre 111, although 999 existed and was probably the route we would have taken.

We’ll have been here 21 years when the youngest finishes. Like you, I’ve had plenty of house envy as friends have upgraded, but we are so financially secure here that it will make our “child free again” years very comfortable. Some of the outlays that friends have are eye watering, and frankly terrifying.

My dream has changed as the children near adulthood. I now see us in a smaller (but lovelier and more low maintenance) place that we can easily leave to go on extended travels while we’re still young enough to do it. We’re in our early 50s and don’t want to work another 20 years just to pay for a big shiny new house.

Nobody ever said on their deathbed that they wish they’d spent more time at work, so we are choosing less time working and more financial comfort, and I can’t think that I’ll ever regret it.

That will probably have all changed by the time the OP is old anyway.

Are you willing to say which area you live in now? Or perhaps reduce tube station is nearest? I'm just being nosy.

DH and I bought our zone 2 house in that bracket 2 years ago (at the lower end). Our dcs go to prep school and most families there own houses in a similar ballpark. Families all have dual earners, both in professional jobs mostly in law, finance, tech, entertainment. Most of them aren't originally from the UK but are all settled here, and many of us have lucked out with stocks/alternative investments rather than climbing the property ladder. Personally we didn't have/need family money to help us buy but there are some families who have.

So I'd say there is still a significant market for that type of property and I wouldn't be concerned that you won't find a buyer. I think a freehold house in a good area of London is still a solid investment, especially if you are staying there for 10+ years. I know the demographers say that families are leaving central London but there are still plenty of us here - I can tell from the busy toddler classes and extracurriculars and sold out family events.
I also think London still has an appeal to certain foreign investors (have seen several new developments marketed at Chinese investors).

I can understand your reasoning for upsizing now - we bought our house with a future plan of downsizing and releasing equity to help the dcs in early adulthood (we are even older parents than you) and it made sense to stretch to the max we could borrow. We are expecting the dcs might live with us beyond uni age though - it just seems very common now in London and easier to establish a career or do a postgrad.

Don’t fall into the trap of keeping up with the Jones’. I think you’re exactly at the age where you are assessing if your life has panned out to where you thought it would be. It’s classic mid life crisis stage. Should I change careers/take a massive promotion that would bring a lot of changes to the way we live our lives eg lots of foreign travel or even moving abroad? Should we move abroad simply because we’ve always wanted to?

Am I really happy enough with this partner to stay with them into retirement or shall I leave while I’m still young enough to find someone else?

i never learned to X/Y/z and I always wanted to.

You see your parents ageing and slowly declining and maybe one or 2 people you know have serious health issues like a stroke, and it’s all very sobering and thought-provoking. And yes, you analyse EVERYTHING, including how satisfied you are with your home.

Ultimately I think a lot of choices made at this age depends on how financially comfortable you are and whether the risks are worth it. From the sound of it, you sound like you have a high income. But if that all ended tomorrow (god forbid one of you had a stroke or something happened to your child). are you set up to withstand such an extreme event? They are extreme, but they do happen. Last week 2 people I know had a stroke and they are my age. Would having a big mortgage mean your house is at risk if that happened?

In your case it’s just a shame the cost of moving is so high these days . That amount of money just on stamp duty is absolutely ridiculous, isn’t it? It’s totally a factor when you’re doing your “risk analysis”, because it’s not as easy to move again if you do upgrade to a different property and find that it doesn’t suit for whatever reason. But then again if you’re going to have to keep spending on your current house to maintain it perhaps it’s just worth biting the bullet and sucking up the stamp duty cost.

Just be aware that before you know it your children will be applying to university. Once they’re at the end of year 6 those few years go VERY fast. Will you have enough money to give your kids the choice to move away to the uni of their choice? Maybe their choice would be Imperial or UCL but would they be happy still living in the parental home? Would YOU? Living in London as a student now is ridiculously expensive. My young relative who moved to London to study shares a one bedroomed flat with his girlfriend and they pay £2k a month in rent. That is beyond ridiculous. His parents can just about afford to help him with it but it does mean a lot of overtime etc for them and thoughts of retirement or going part time as they get older are WAY in the distance now.

We have made different fiinancial decisions and as we have stayed put we have been able to more easily afford to give our children the choice of where to go to university, whether they do a masters, to support them with finding a job afterwards wherever they need to go, including abroad if they want. I wouldn’t have wanted to prevent being able to give them those choices just because we’d stretched ourselves on a fancier house.

Totally agree. I picture this scene in my head. A couple approaching 60 who stretched themselves financially to upgrade to a dream house enjoy entertaining friends in their lovely home. Their friends may always comment as they settle down to a drink in the luxurious entertaining space “oh, I love coming to your house, it’s just so nice!” BUT then their conversation with each other quickly turns to pensions, early retirement and excited talks of travelling the world, paying for their adult children’s weddings, big family breaks away together etc.

For the hosts, they might genuinely still love having people round. And still having their adult children pop their heads round the door to say hello (because there is no bank of mum and dad and they can’t afford to move out yet). But maybe after 10 years of it they are sick of always being the default party house just because it’s the nicest biggest entertaining space in a convenient location. Maybe the adult children always feel like they have to go out on those nights their parents are entertaining. (Or conversely hang around all night changing the dynamic and not helping to host)

And when their parents are running around making drinks and cooking dinner for their friends, and tidying afterwards, they are secretly feeling insanely jealous of their financially free friends (whose adult children moved to their own house a couple of years ago and who invite them over regularly and entertain THEM) and wrily muse that there is no way they can afford to even THINK about early retirement plans. Now the grass, which had looked very green for a long time, is starting to look a bit brown again and looks VERY lush on the other side of the fence.

in this situation I know which side I’d prefer to be on.

I spend a lot of time daydreaming, can you tell? 😆

I'd say wait. We moved 11 years ago (aged 49 and 47). Two reasons for moving, investment and more room. Fast forward, our old house has kept up better with inflation than our current one. Also, children have flown the nest. We do use every room to some extent (overflow clothes and occasional guest in one room), but we don't really need the downstairs living space we've got for two.

Your posts read a bit oddly to me OP, I get the house envy and the feeling bored but it’s also like moving to a premier area just so that you can say you live there or for better capital growth, when it looks like you’ve already paid off the mortgage on a very nice and valuable house!

For me the priority would be how the house will work for you and the family over the next 5 years. Surely with 2 kids, one late primary it would be a terrible time to move to the countryside? Especially if your kids are doing activities, decent schools and the area isn’t unsafe.

Also no way would I be buying a property where I can only afford to pay interest or where it’s a real stretch- have you seen the price of uni? And also your age range is rife for redundancies, slight episodes of ill health, needing or wanting to work a bit less, not more. I suspect lots of people with the swanky entertaining space in Chelsea lose sleep over money and having over stretched themselves.

In your shoes I’d be looking really realistically at what your budget should be- and maybe look to buy something different, or with more long term potential (like annexe space or a really nice garden). Or I would seriously consider extending and remodelling where you are.

Given your ages and you mention your DH is mid 50s and unlikely to progress further in his career, I really would not make that jump from £1.6 to £2.4. The additional mortgage at your ages plus the stamp duty just isn’t worth the stress and financial strain.

You obviously have a good London house and there are plenty of pros for it. I understand house envy versus friends but you can’t change the past and remake different decisions, but you can stop yourself from unnecessarily burdening yourself with financial stresses.

You say you’re bored with the house. I would look at the cosmetic and easy fixes you could do to inject new life and interest into your current home that don’t put you in financial difficulties further down the line.

A friend cashed in her house in this situation and moved 10 mins drive away to a house which was smaller, cheaper but had a much bigger garden and room for an extension. Both houses were of similar period. She has never ever regretted it and loved some of perks of new area although it was less prestigious. Better park, nearer tube, high street with actual shops not just coffee chains. W3 to W13.

a house which was smaller, cheaper but had a much bigger garden and room for an extension.

This is exactly what I mean, can you get something more interesting or quirky, or which will be better eventually for the price of your existing house?

Such interesting talking points and advice! Lots to think about. The person who described mid life crisis is very spot on: I think I even said in the original post it’s a feeling of is this as good as it gets? For the house that is but as the house is a symbol of the self, maybe it goes beyond this.

For those suggesting different house with potential but at same price point, this would be the dream but the problem we have is the target area is a lot more expensive and the type of property in the lower bracket is either 60s modernist (on estates with zero ability to expand) or squished terraces with very long and skinny gardens which lack the lateral space I’m craving.

A PP mentioned there are still plenty of people in dual high income set ups but I do wonder if these are coming to an end with AI hollowing out some of the white collar jobs… I can see it now speaking to headhunters. Who is to say if it’s a blip caused by the new NI rise and lack of business confidence or if it’s the fall of the western economic empire?

@CurlyhairedAssassin A lot of what you say is really insightful, thank you. I definitely secretly fall into the Jones’ trap! Once upon a time we were doing very well - not based on what we earned, though that helped, but on what we didn’t spend! It allowed us to save up and get a house and a couple of investments. I’ve belatedly learned about leveraging and realised we were daft to try and pay off a mortgage in our 30s/40s. We should have kept a mortgage and leapfrogged to the next house size.

Those who say having a smaller house gives them more choices, it does in terms of cash in the bank. BUT unless you have it all in shares, you surely have more choices if it’s in your home as the capital growth of a 2m house that grows at say 5% a year gives you plenty of choices in a few years when you can downsize and cash in. At that point, you can hand even more cash to your DC. Or get a no maintenance or house somewhere and a small cottage in the country. Or buy your DC flats in a uni town. If we stick to our boring townhouse , it won’t appreciate as much so we will have fewer financial choices.

Some of you have pointed out the expense of adult children and university.

We have a couple of very modest rentals that if we are pushed to, could sell. They’re rented at well below market rents with interest only mortgages. We could sell one or both to trade up but would be clobbered by CGT and they’re in a low value location. We always thought of them as nest eggs or revenue streams for retirement or uni for DC.

The money we have ‘saved’ by paying off the mortgage is largely splurged on DCs’ education as we live in a mediocre to rough schools area. That is another factor that will hold back our house price value. Over the last few years, people who moved in locally with secondary school aged DC would largely opt for private (especially if buying the bigger houses vs flats). But most people on high incomes who don’t have squillions will now move to an outer suburb with less risky schools or into a grammar zone. The ultra rich won’t move here anyway. They will pay for expensive areas with expensive schools.

We are around the 50-ish mark, give or take a few years. We are also trading up. We will have a bigger house and are paying a little more although not much as we are moving to a cheaper part of the country. My partner wanted to go for something slightly cheaper and pay off our mortgage, which wasn't massive. In the end we decided not to, partly because there wasn't a lot on the market where we were looking and we wanted to get on with it.

We plan to be in our next home for about 15 years, at which point we will have finished work and will cash in our chips and downsize. The way I see it, you've got to put your money somewhere and the stock market isn't so hot right now. We may as well put it into our next property and cash in later.

We've still got the energy to maintain a larger house and with us working from home, the space will come in handy. It'll also be a great entertaining space for friends and family, especially as I start to take over the reigns on hosting Christmas.

I say, go for it. It's great to have new adventures and projects to look forward to.

It’s really interesting that feeling bored is feeling like a property problem. Can’t you use some money to make life more fun/exciting? How much of this is related to envying your friends fancy pads? They might be envying your manageable mortgage!
alternatively, if you do want to think about it as a house problem, is there one room that you can make fabulous? We have the bathroom of my dreams, for example. Or rethink your master bedroom and make it a gorgeous grownup retreat. Decorating can be something much more ambitious and fun than just a lick of paint.

I hear you @EBoo80 . I guess I’m dissatisfied with the entertaining space we (don’t) have. We have a typical double reception room with a door that can open up between the two rooms and then a large-ish kitchen diner which now feels small after seeing people’s monster kitchens with huge sofas/tables/islands. As all the living space is on one floor, it’s hard to see where older DC/teens will retreat to with their pals if we are also having people round.

Also, we don’t have the funds/need to re-do the kitchen but that is where the entertaining currently takes place and it’s feeling tired.

I viewed one house back when interest rates were low with a fabulous sleep out in the garden. We don’t have a big enough garden for that sadly.

I guess there is an element of regret here: did I give my DC the best family home possible? I would have loved to have a garden big enough so DC could practice football/cricket properly rather than worrying about the ball going into the neighbours’ gardens.

@Cortisolina I could have written this word for word. Same ages and in exactly the same position here - and I did the 2.3m stamp duty calculation this morning!

We like our SW London area but I would love more space - our house sounds very similar to yours size wise etc , although we are terraced and our garden is smaller. It’s absolutely not my dream home and I also get house envy… We could convert the basement and rejig the overall layout (cost and upheaval fills me with horror). Ultimately the house won’t get any wider, brighter and less overlooked. Also, kicking myself for not having moved earlier. Feel free to DM me if you’d like to chat!

@Cortisolina- same here with your latest post too! We have the same downstairs layout and it’s not easy with two teens or for entertaining. We don’t really use our garden as it is very overlooked and can hear everyone’s conversations in the summer!

Another option is to extend into the garden and have more living space off the kitchen/dining room, but then the garden would be about 15-20ft.

Tbh you have lots of choices. You can move area. You can move to an area with state schools and save money on that. You can upsize easily enough to a prosperous suburb with change in your pocket. Entertaining in a large space is a temporary luxury, as is a garden for football. Some of the best supper /dinner parties I've been too have been in small kitchen diners. You just have to decide what is most important to you. No one ever gets to have everything. But you have choices galore

Indeed, your current location sounds irritatingly perfect...
You want more space; is there any furniture/equipment you could outsource to a rented space, eg for WFH or a hobby? Could you get more outside space by creating a roof garden? Could you buy a small piece of land nearby and create a second garden or allotment?

I thought London property had stagnated when accounting for inflation?

Very interesting post OP, and relevant to where I find myself right now.
We have a big decision to make this weekend; whether to offer for a bigger older house with a bigger garden about 10 minutes drive away from our current (for 30+ years) home. And we are in our 60s .. so from my perspective I definitely don't think you are too late to make a change!
I get what you are saying in many respects. Our house sounds similar to yours and we were happy there for many years. I do feel we missed our chance to upsize due to being too cautious when we had three young children; then we moved to London for five years for work, living in a flat Monday-Friday but keeping our main home as a family base for our student/young adult kids to live in or return to for holidays.
I've never had the spacious characterful house I always wanted and now have the chance to do so. A bit late perhaps! It would be a great project and as we (fingers crossed) are fit and healthy, I reckon with luck we could have ten good years at least of enjoying the sort of house we've always wanted before possibly downsizing to something more manageable in our seventies. We know we are very fortunate to be able to afford to do this without financial worries.
We have hesitated so much over this decision though (and I know some of our friends will think we're crazy .. but what does that matter?) Edging towards going for it .. and I identify with the PP who is looking forward to her bigger garden at the age of 70 .. I feel much the same.

Really curious to know where this “little known area” within walking distance of a major London hospital is…