Victorian house: are we mad?

[Matronic6]

So we had been planning to relocate to my hometown for a while. Were planning next year, then renting whilst we look to buy.

A listed Victorian building that looks like it hasn't been updated since the 60s has come on the market. It is definitely a very reasonable price but that it is because of the extent of work required.

If the property wasn't so stunning, it would be an absolute no as the scale of work is quite daunting. But it's the first property that I can see past all of the work and see the potential.

The other factor is cost. We can easily afford the house but don't think we can afford the work in quick time. We will need to break it down over years. It is priced around 200. Whilst we could afford a deposit around 40/50, we are considering a deposit of 20-25 and reserving some cash to begin work. Even with this reduction in deposit our monthly mortgage will be about 300-400 cheaper than our rent. Then we could make an extra payment each year to reduce mortgage.

I am certain the changes we would need to make will be at least 100k. I know that a 300k newbuild would be so much easier. The other factor is as the move will be brought forward I am likely to be out of work for a bit. DH is remote so he is unaffected. So will also be relying on one income for a while. Though info plan to start applying for remote jobs ASAP if we do go through with it.

Are we mad to consider it? Is there anyway it can be made easier? Anyone done the same and have advice?

I have only ever lived in Victorian/Edwardian houses. If you can fund the work - I'd go for it.

The listing is the only thing that would concern me. Why is it listed?

It's in a conservation area, all buildings on street are Grade B 2 listed. DH's main concern was the insulation. He has reached out to council to establish what elements of the building the listing affects.

If it’s habitable, go ahead. I’ve also lived in Victorian and Edwardian houses apart from 10 years in a modern flat. I hated the flat - thin walls, low ceilings, no storage space, roasting in summer, freezing in winter, persistent mould problems, shoddy doors and windows.

It is habitable now, it's just terribly ugly.

If it’s a listed building, you may need to get Listed Building Consent (a type of planning permission) for any works, especially structural changes. You may also need to use particular materials/ techniques to comply with the listed building requirements, which are likely to be more expensive. As you say you don’t have enough cash already, that would be a concern for me.

It does depend on the listing grade but there are some works that you can do. This list from Haringey ( other councils do exist and will have the same rules) in fact I was surprised how much you can do.
https://new.haringey.gov.uk/planning-building-control/planning/planning-policy/design-conservation/listed-buildings/doing-work-listed-building#:~:text=It%20is%20a%20criminal%20offence,that%20the%20building%20was%20listed.

With your renovation budget have you factored in that you will have to use traditional materials? These can be quite pricey as can finding tradespeople. For example if you want to replaster, theoretically you should use lime plaster and you would need listed buildings consent to change the single glazed windows to double glazed. You would also need to check with the local planning people whether listed buildings consent is needed to install central heating if there isn't currently any.

DH actually works in construction and has worked with listed buildings before so has a good understanding of what needs permission/speciality work. Central heating already done and the original features are in good condition.

The house itself seems to be in good condition but not been surveyed yet. It's more than every inch needs modernisation. And that we don't immediately have the budget to do everything and will inevitably have to stagger it over years. It just feels overwhelming and a bit mad when we would have a much easier and cheaper life just getting a turnkey.

But it will be stunning. I'd go for character (and I have, every time)

Sounds great to me! If it's liveable, there is no hurry to get things done.
What's putting you off?
Age? For me, the pros outweigh the cons - tend to be solidly built, well designed, central locations, characterful.
Condition? - totally changeable.
Price? - cheaper than your rent.

The only thing you have said (other than the listing) that's slightly worrisome is spending £100k on a £200k house - is it worth £100k investment? What does a fully done up house in the same location cost?

It's hard to do a full reno while living in and when you have to stagger the work - but you are in the best possible position with OH in the trade. I live in a big still not finished Victorian (12 years!) but I would honestly put up with it never being finished to avoid living in a new build. I think it's different if you're doing the apartment city living thing, but a four bed box on a soulless estate would genuinely depress me.

I would absolutely do it if you're not afraid of hard work and your relationship is rock solid.

It's not easy, but it is a great way to end up with an incredible home that you wouldn't have otherwise been able to afford.

DH and I have done up a few old houses and now we live in the 7 bedroom Georgian home of our dreams. But we actually enjoy decorating and going to B&Q and we're just as happy doing DIY as going to the pub. It's not for everyone, and there's always something that needs doing. And it always costs more than you expect.

I'm sat here in dusty clothes with paint on my hands. But when I come home and look at my lovely house I feel a rush of love for it that I wouldn't swap for anything.

I Iive in a 1901 house. I like the high ceilings. The rooms are a decent size. The house is pleasantly cool in hot weather - unlike newbuilds which are like greenhouses. I would do it, especially if the only real problems are old-fashioned bathroom, kitchen, relative lack of sockets.

That's the other issue, no other houses I'm the street have been on the market for years so we have not context for this. We did get speaking to one of the neighbours who actually showed is their house, which was stunning, they are in their 60s and took it over from one of their parents. And apparently a lot of the houses are the same. This is the first time in at least 15 years that a house has been on the market.

Another period house a couple of streets away is on market for £550-600.

I would definitely go for it over a new build. Victorian houses are much better, It doesn't matter that you can't do it all straight away - much better to do it at a slower pace and have a better house at the end of it.

If the other house is in catchment for a great school that will drive up price. I would speak to some local EA's about likely valuations [but not the one selling you the house]

Personally I'd go for it but the bank will only loan you the value of the house so any funds / savings are likely to go on the refurb, not into overpaying the mortgage.
I've found in practice that's it's really motivational to save the cash and do the work rather than load it into the mortgage. Cheaper long term too.

DH and I have just spent nearly 3 yrs renovating, so here are my tips. Ours is a 1930's but still full of character. Ours also isn't listed.

Has the property been occupied for the past 2yrs? If not, there is a little known loop hole where you pay a reduced VAT rate for labour and goods to get it back to a livable/better state. I'll give you details, but it needs to have been unoccupied at least 2yrs.

We bought a 2nd hand, static caravan and lived in that whilst the building works went on. It was plumbed into the sewer, fresh water, tiny shower and kitchen, but was a little sanctuary away from the dust. You might be able to move room to room, but don't underestimate how much disruption having people onsite can be and how dust can manage to get into supposedly sealed containers

We had a rough estimate of £150,000 but with the end of covid, cost of materials etc that price doubled! We aren't even finished yet. Structural work is done, but gardens and furnishings need buying

Is yours detached? I personally wouldn't spent the time and money if it was a semi or terraced.

Oh wow great tips, thanks! We do have a relative that lives near by, who is desperate for us to move to the area, offer to stay with her during the big jobs. It is a terraced house. The area it is in, the majority of period properties are terraced or semi. A detached period property is very rare and very pricey!

We actually didn't want terrace at all, but this property appeared and has so much more character than the other properties we were looking at. A friend knows someone who has done extensive renovations in several properties is going to view it on Friday to give his opinion on just how big a job it would be.

I have one although not listed. It was a dump when we moved in, the central heating boiler was condemned the day we moved in and the bath was cracked so that had to be done straight away. The rest we did over a number of years as we could afford it. We did all the decorating ourselves except for the stairs which we couldn't reach. We've been here for 30 years and love the bones of it. We've had 2 kitchens and 2 bathrooms over the years and converted the garage into living space and downstairs toilet. It's built like a tank, solid as a rock. You do need a small contingency fund for repairs, the chimneys needed repair this year so that was £900. However we have big cool rooms with beautiful high ceilings and a huge garden. Its really quiet too, can't hear the neighbours. I'm planning to go out in my box

I bought a Victorian house 13 years ago and have enjoyed the space. the quality of the build and the lovely general environment.

However, I would make sure you have sufficient funds to cover loft insulation, all new windows and external doors, and a new boiler (if it is needed) as soon as you move in.

You can replace or repair everything else gradually but trying to keep the motivation to redecorate going, during a cold winter, in a freezing house is tough. I can cope with anything as long as I am warm.

In your position I would do it, yes. I couldn't face a project house myself, but I don't have the skills, connections, or contingency fund. But it sounds like you are the right people to look after a house like that. Go for it.

"He has reached out to council to establish what elements of the building the listing affects."

Every element of a listed building is listed. Some things can be done without LBC, but a huge amount in a full renovation will absolutely need it. If you're serious about buying it, I would put in a pre-app consultation with your planning department to talk about your plans for it. It costs £100-200 and it will either put you off completely or give you some confidence.

I work in planning, and I constantly deal with people that either don't want to do something right because it will be too expensive, or they can't wait for the planning system holding up their project. The nastiest enforcement cases are almost always listed buildings where owners have charged in and started 'improvement' works to make it habitable.

You cannot underestimate how much more expensive a listed building is to do properly.

You will be immediately fed up with the length of time that planning applications take when you want to get cracking and move in.

Hi OP,

You mentioned that a similar house nearby sold for 500-600.... and if yours is on for 200 that gives you a good.idea of how much is needed to bring it up to standard.

Listed building aren't too bad but do tend to cost more because of the specialist materials required plus paying out for permissions etc from LBC.

If you're up for the challenge go for it, period houses are always worth the effort IMHO. 👌

Is it a great location?
If you didn't want terraced amd this is terraced, what other compromises will it involve.
There is only so much you can do renovation wise and changing lay out wise and adding extension wise. Once all that is done, will there still be a compromise you can't get over or location issues. From experience, try and you might you can't make something perfect if there are elements you can't change. Be honest with yourselves ,rather than getting swayed by the could be beauty.