Planning permission refusal

[CuriousGeorge80]

Hi all - wondering if anybody can offer some advice. After a very lengthy, delayed application process we have just found out that our planning application for a rear extension has been refused. We are semi-detached and neither neighbour on either side objected, plus we have applied for a much smaller extension than others that have been approved in same style houses on same road in recent years.

Anyway, it has been refused on two grounds. One of which is because the architect drawings had a patio drawn on - honestly he did this to look pretty I think, as it’s not something we have ever discussed with him, although probably we would have a patio there I guess. But the patio in the drawing is not raised and would just be turning an area of grass to hard surface. This would not change the current set up v our neighbours garden at all (we can’t see into either due to trees on non-attached side and fence on attached side). Anyway, I’m very confused as you don’t need planning for a patio, and I could build a patio in that spot tomorrow if I wanted to. Does anybody know how they can turn down a planning application based on something that doesn’t require planning?

The second reason for those interested is that they say it is 0.3m too long on the attached side but that’s just a design feature intended to reduce impact on next door (by having a small part of wall that sits out further than the glass doors) that can be deleted without any issue. We offered to do this in the email exchanges but they ignored and refused the application anyway.

Go back to your architect

You need to revise the drawings. They cannot agree something different on basis of your emails.

Thanks for your replies but I’m asking a specific question on the patio (obviously I am going to speak to the architect but I feel he is at fault on both points and so would like to specifically understand the point on the patio before I speak to him).

I guess the patio is irrelevant if there is another issue too. So when you resubmit for the other issue simply remove the patio.

You could appeal the patio but I think that is pointless if there is another problem not - appealable.

Has he shown the patio to be made of non-porous material like resin in which case it needs planning.
But as others have said you need to go back to your architect and revise the drawings.

It’s your architect who should be the expert. Planning decisions are made on the basis of plans put in front of the committee and on how far they conform to planning policies. So when your architect comes to redraw, get them to show you exactly how it conforms to those planning policies before resubmitting.

Patio may be over shared drainage or they may be worried about the drainage from it - does it cover a soak away or mean that you have less porous surface area?

And you/architect can ask for specific feedback as to what needs amending or clarifying.

Is this a planning application you have had refused? Or an application for a certificate of lawfulness?
Just asking because if would be unusual to have a full app refused for those reasons.
In a certificate app the planning officer can only check the legislation and say if it complies (it's not an a assessment of the planning merits). If it doesn't comply it has to be refused. You can easily get your architect to amend the patio and measurements and reapply fof the certificate.

As @GandTtwice says that's odd to refuse on those issues unless they break some planning rules. I'd be asking for clarification from the planning office but seems you have done that? I know they can be difficult.
Architects are not necessarily the most knowledgeable of planning regulations as they change frequently, but I would go back to yours. At the least it seems you will need to resubmit revised drawings.

What GandT says.

But also, if it was for full PP what was the exact reason for refusal re the patio?
You can also look online at the Planning Officers report which will set things out in more detail.

Architects like to think they know planning, but they often miss the more technical details with something like a Certificate of Lawfulness and permitted development. Planning Consultants know their stuff (RTPI members). It's like going to a gynaecologist to sort your Gaul stones - they'll know where it is, but you wouldn't want them doing the surgery!

Full planning or PD? How long is the extension?

It’s full planning.

The plans are 3.5m from original wall, so they are within their rights to turn it down even though other houses of the exact same design on the same street have had up to 5m approved (and lots of them over 4) - they have said that while they accept it doesn’t impact light for attached neighbour, it does impact on neighbours enjoyment without giving more detail - so unclear why it’s been refused for us when like I say exact same houses have had it approved at much longer than we have asked for. But they will argue discretion and I’m sure it’s pointless to appeal that point.

But I am specifically asking on the patio as I don’t understand how they can refuse planning on a point that doesn’t require planning, so really interested for views on this specific point.

@Seeline on the patio they said that standing on the patio our neighbours would be able to see us and it would impact their enjoyment of the house, but we have grass there now and use it, and could put a patio there without planning tomorrow. On one side we have a 6ft fence and the other very established trees so I’m not sure it’s even true! But even if it were true I am wondering how it can be relevant! (To be clear, the design does not show a raised patio and when the planning inspector asked the architect he confirmed it is not raised).

The issue with other houses having similar is not relevant - with planning every application is determined on its own merits as no two sites are exactly the same. There will be different orientations, different land levels, different relationships with neighbouring properties etc

Have you had a look at the Planning Officer's report on the planning portal?

The patio issue does seem strange.

Could you copy and paste the two refusal reasons?