Damp

[kirinm]

We made an offer on a house. We think it's an extremely generous offer and wouldn't have made it if it wasn't for the fact we are very keen to stay in the area.

It is a total renovation job and a very big one at that. Immediate work would be needed just to live in it. Vendor is now suggesting that he might take it off the market to 'fix' the problems - not renovate, fix the problems.

The major problem as far as we can see is damp. On a very big scale. Estate agent is trying to convince the vendor that he is going to spend more fixing than the reduction we've made on the asking price.

I spoke to a friend of mine who is a structural engineer and showed him some pictures of the damp and he actually suggested that we be very careful because the cost of fixing it could well be in excess of what the property is worth even done up. He thinks the damp could go down to foundation level although obviously a survey would be needed.

I'm just wondering if anyone has any experience of properly fixing long term damp issues. To give you an idea of what we are looking at, the following are pics of the kitchen walls - this damage is visible throughout the kitchen, downstairs bathroom and 'conservatory'. There are also mushrooms growing out of the kitchen ceiling - a leak from the bathroom we think - that wasn't fixed.

The other stuff is just the usual black mold found on skirtings which is probably the thing we'd be less concerned about.

Pictures now added

By way of background: We made an offer of £950k against an asking price of £1.0m. The last house on the road sold for about £1,070,000 in 2022 but wouldn't have needed any work.

The upstairs isn't as damp. The bedroom off the bathroom has suffered damage from the leak and there was also supposedly an issue with the roof which has been fixed although the internal damage hasn't been fixed. However, all three bedrooms would need redecoration and probably new windows. Bathroom would need to be replaced and not just because we don't like the look of it.

Vendor is a landlord.

I reckon you might have a mixture of damp. Condensation (the mold) leaks, maybe penetrative damp (is that socket on the outside wall). The mushrooms are a sign of dry rot, aren't they?

I wouldn't buy it tbh. If this is what you can see, god knows what is hidden!

Get a survey, though, then see.

The kitchen would have probably been an external wall originally but there is an 'extension' which is as damp. It isn't limited to one wall - perhaps the entire of outside needs to be regrouted?

I would have a full structural survey done immediately but am leaning towards pulling the offer anyway.

Not grouted - repointing

Honestly OP I would pull out unless you have loads of experience in renovating. The vendor has literally let the place rot around his tenants. I bet he is the sort to have fixed issues on the cheap or bodged them himself.

We do have experience of renovating and my partner is an electrician.

We've dealt with some damp before where we had to hack back to brick and repoint but it wasn't on this scale.

We live in a conservation area of very old Victorian properties and have experience of identifying horrible problems hidden behind plaster but yeah, I'm very quickly losing interest especially as the vendor has let the house get into this condition and is now potentially looking to 'fix' it all himself.

Is it a period property OP? If so, would definitely advise a surveyor who specialises in historic buildings if so, particularly if there is damp. You risk otherwise being advised incorrectly (eg. Damp proof injections etc). They may also be able to honestly advise the likelihood of resolving the issues so you can make an informed decision. They’re pricey though, but worth it if you are considering it.

Just to add, we’ve bought a property with damp but the price reflected it and we’ve had the survey and felt it is “fixable” and how much it will cost, how urgent and how much can be DIY. It scared a lot of buyers off though. Maybe we’ll regret it 🙊

Thanks - it is Victorian. If the vendor stops dithering and accepts the offer I would pay for a full structural / damp survey. There's making a generous offer and then making a silly offer which I feel like we may already be verging on!

Did you go with a structural engineer or a different type of expert?

Ah would probably be worth it then! Also do you follow the Your Old House UK - Repair and Conservation page? That’s been so valuable and lots of people and experts happy to give opinions.

We went with a damp/timber specialist because there had already been a L2 survey completed (not by us) which we were satisfied with, in terms of anything structural, it was specifically the damp we wanted a survey on. We used Alpine Surveys who are independent and was happy with their report. We also got quotes from Smith Heritage Surveyors, who were more expensive - we very nearly went with them, they offer both the L3 surveys and damp, but I’d expect the L3 covers the damp element.

Older buildings need totally different intervention than newer - ours is also Victorian, and we need to repoint externally with lime mortar, and do something about the high external ground level. Potentially looking at lime plaster inside but we’re going to address the outside first and see if that’s enough.

@eighteenth18 thanks for that. We were concerned that some of the damp around the bay window may be because of a height difference outside. And that's not even the damp I started the post about!

Crikey that's a brave project to take on. My honest feeling is that your offer is too generous.

Damp is the symptom, not the cause. You need to get to the matter of WHY it's damp before you can figure out how much it's going to cost to fix. Can be to do with impermeable materials being used improperly as much as it is to with leaks letting water in. Impossible to tell from your pictures what's going on but it looks bad enough to imagine something reasonably widespread is going on - even the mould around the bay is more severe than usual so even if it is condensation, it implies the humidity levels are higher than you'd expect in a normal house. Is the house rendered?
I'm sure in a popular area of similar Victorian houses it is entirely fixable, but it could be caused by previous interventions with inappropriate materials, which would personally make me extremely unkeen to accept the current owners "fix".

That's my feeling too! It is a nice road and it's a decent sized house but I'd imagine done up / nicely decorated with nothing immediate to do, would sell at no more than £1.1m. So unless we could get the work done for under £150k - which would include the costs of redoing the rest of the house once everything is fixed, we'd be overpaying. Even without the damp issues that would be tight.

No not rendered but I think there will have been lots of quick fixes if anything has been done at all. I would be looking for damaged drains, guttering, roof issues and definitely looking at the height difference between inside and out.

It wouldn't surprise me if the guttering was damaged and has been ignored with water permeating through poorly maintained external walls into the inside.

I feel very sorry for the tenants who lived there. I also wouldn't touch it with a barge pole if the owner takes it off the market to 'fix' it before putting it on expecting £1.0m +

It is such a shame because it's the ideal house size and location for us but we don't have endless amounts of money to spend fixing problems we can't even see yet.

I would pull out. It's going to need a lot more work and a lot more expense than you think. The damp needs proper investigation by a specialist firm.
Your offer is likely much too high considering what needs doing.

If I was offering that sort of money I would pay for a full structural survey before exchanging contracts.

Just to add, it's shocking that the landlord left the tenants to live in these conditions, particularly in an expensive house that they must have been paying a lot of rent to live in. That makes him a jolly unpleasant person and one I would not be at all keen to do business with.

If they accepted the offer today, I'd be instructing a surveyor / engineer tomorrow. I wouldn't do anything else until a survey had been carried out.

That's generally how most people go about it, isn't it?

Ah OK, I thought it had progressed beyond that.

Good luck (actually I don't think that damp looks too bad and to have your own source of mushrooms is a postive boon these days with the rising cost of living)

Oh I see. I thought the offer had been accepted a little while back too. I guess you need to seriously consider whether this is the house for you and whether you want to assess following a full survey while you wait for the owner to make up his mind!